Sea plane in Kuala Lumpur

[esa-aardvark]

Hello, on the way to the airport outside KL saw a Seaplane
at what seemed to be a small airfield actually not too far from
KL centre. I passed at high speed in a taxi, it seemed similar
to the Sunderland, but possibly smaller, and was standing on
the wheel sets which were used to beach Seaplanes. Airfield
was possibly (ex)-military with single engined aircraft parked
and helicopters in camouflage. Anyone know what & why ?
For those who know KL not too far from the Nirvana centre.

[bigoil]

Smaller than a Sunderland?

Maybe a Grumman? Albatross, Malard, Goose, Widgeon. Unless the Mars is over for a visit.

[MReyn24050]

Was it here?
Royal Malaysian Air Force Museum -* Kuala Lumpur - Malaysia (http://www.aviationmuseum.eu/World/Asia/Malaysia/Kuala_Lumpur/RMAF_Museum.htm)

Listed is a Grumman CSR=110 Albatross.

[Tmbstory]

esa - aadvark:

The airport may be Simpang, the Royal Malaysian Air Force base, close to KL.

Tmb

[Oldpilot55]

The Albatross was parked outside when I visited a couple of years ago. Sounds like Simpang

[lauriebe]

e-a,

It would have been Simpang/Sungai Besi, home of the RMAF Museum. As mentioned earlier, it was probably the HU-16 Albatross that you saw.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8335/8137693757_4a1e5161ca_c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/janner88/8137693757/)
20091103-IMG_8719 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/janner88/8137693757/) by Janner88 (http://www.flickr.com/people/janner88/), on Flickr

However, it could also have been one of Maritim Malaysia's CL415s that visits this base occasionally.
http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4003/5077959020_3e6340dcfe_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/janner88/5077959020/)
IMG_9566 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/janner88/5077959020/) by Janner88 (http://www.flickr.com/people/janner88/), on Flickr

[Groundloop]

Smaller than a Sunderland?

Maybe a Grumman? Albatross, Malard, Goose, Widgeon. Unless the Mars is over for a visit.

All of the above are flying boats, not seaplanes. A flying boat has a fuselage which is hull shaped and sits in the water. A seaplane has floats which lift the entire fuselage above the water.

[Sultan Ismail]

Indeed it is a small airport by modern standards but in the days of the Sultan (they don't have Raj in Malaysia) this airport served as the Kuala Lumpur International Airport.

The runways are unchanged in length and width from the days of Independence in 1957, when De Havilland Comets and Bristol Britannias graced the Apron.

Today the thresholds are displaced several hundred metres to accomodate the increasing development of central Kuala Kuala Lumpur and its encroachment on the Glidepath.

The Royal Selangor Flying Club has been a resident of this "Airfield" since before independence and before the "Internationalisation Upgrade" to Airport.

Next time you are in KL please visit the Museum and then drive a kilometre through the Base and call in to the RSFC Club House. If you are lucky you could go for a short trip round the Petronas Twin Towers and KL Tower.

And it is a Grumman Albatross HU-16 :)

[Terry McCassey]

One of their CL415's was seen recently doing practice scoops off the lake at Putrajaya, some way south of KL. The tight turns and steep approaches an unusual, but eminently welcome sight in this neck of the woods. Whether it's a flying boat or a seaplane I believe is neither here nor there.
Terry

[esa-aardvark]

Thanks to all who replied. Obviously I imagined the bit
about looking like a Sunderland. Back there Thursday, but only
for 12 hours or so. If I get a chance on a longer trip I'll certainly
try to visit.
Many thanks, Joihn

[Sultan Ismail]

Just what do Malaysia have in mind for these water bombers? Forest fires are not a threat on the Peninsula however if they plan to invade Sumatra during the stubble burning then they have my support. It is criminal the degradation inflicted on health and the environment by these selfish acts.

[727gm]

Posted by Groundloop:

All of the above are flying boats, not seaplanes. A flying boat has a fuselage which is hull shaped and sits in the water. A seaplane has floats which lift the entire fuselage above the water.

************************************************************ *******************************************

I beg to differ - "flying boats" have boat hulls, and "floatplanes" are (generally)landplanes with floats attached, but both of these are SEAPLANES.

[India Four Two]

727gm,

Transport Canada agrees with you :)

My rating, which almost everyone casually refers to as a "float rating", is actually a Seaplane rating.

[Oldpilot55]

A few years back they were using one of the Canadairs to water bomb a warship that had gone on fire. They towed it out of harbour and they repeatedly dropped water on it.

Malaysia to replace burnt navy ship: minister - Intellasia East Asia News (http://www.intellasia.net/malaysia-to-replace-burnt-navy-ship-minister-109977)

[weloveseaplanes]

A flying boat has a fuselage which is hull shaped and sits in the water. A seaplane has floats which lift the entire fuselage above the water.

Seaplanes are aircraft that can operate from water.
There are two types - flying boats and float planes.
Flying boats are boats which sit in the water till the pilot applies the gogo juice.
Floatplanes are planes with floats attached.

[FlightlessParrot]

As usual, there are two different usages. The British usage is (or at any rate used to be) that a flying boat is a flying boat, and a seaplane is what is called a floatplane in the USA. The Wikipedia article on the Short Mayo composite is a nice example. US English uses "seaplane" as a generic.

For what is worth, I was brought up on the British usage, but the US vocabulary, with a generic term, and globally unambiguous distinctive terms for the two species, seems more efficient, and if water-capable aircraft were more common, I'm sure it would be adopted in Britain, too.

What, I wonder, is the usage in Canada, where such types are still quite widely used?

(Edited to add the Wikipedia example,)

[India Four Two]

What, I wonder, is the usage in Canada, where such types are still quite widely used?Seaplane covers all types and the rating. Float plane is the generic term for landplanes on floats. Flying boats are usually referred to by type name: Mars, Catalina/Canso, Mallard, Goose, Teal, etc.

Normally VVTS but tempo. NZNP.

[weloveseaplanes]

What, I wonder, is the usage in Canada, where such types are still quite widely used?


. . . Beaver ;)

[evansb]

Transport Canada, (Canada's aviation regulator), calls it a "seaplane rating", and does not differentiate between operating a flying boat and operating a float-equipped aircraft. Canadian chart supplements for water aerodromes refer to "seaplane operating areas". I've heard the term "float-plane" used more by passengers than "seaplane". I've even heard "pontoon-plane" used on a few occasions. When the average joe sees the huge Martin Mars water bomber fly overhead, I don't think "flying boat" is the first thing that comes to his mind. Vancouver-based Harbour Air calls itself "The World's Largest All-Seaplane Airline". Seattle-based Kenmore Air also refers to its "seaplane" fleet, yet you can book a "Floatplane Picnic" through them. EDO, the world's largest manufacturer of floats for aircraft, refers to their product as "floats", but makes them for seaplanes.

[albatross]

My Canadian commercial licence is endorsed as SMELS which stands for Single and Multi-engine Land and Sea. ( May also denote a lack of personal hygiene ).

Except for 1 circuit in a CL215 and another 3 in a PBY Canso I have only flown Float equipped aircraft on water such as the Beaver, Otter and 180/185/206 Cessna. I got my rating on a 65 horse J-3 Cub on floats ( what tired horses they were -LOL-) and what fun times they were too.
As noted below there does not seem to be any difference between "Float" equipped aircraft such as a Beaver or "flying Boats" such as a lake amphibian seaplane or a RC-3 Seabee or even a PBY Canso which would however require a type rating being over 12500 LBS.

From:
Part IV - Personnel Licensing and Training - Transport Canada (http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/regserv/cars/part4-standards-421-1086.htm)

DIVISION X - AEROPLANE CLASS RATINGS

421.38 Requirements

(1) Seaplane Rating - Requirements

(a) Experience

(i) An applicant for a seaplane rating shall complete a total of 7 hours of seaplane training, including:
(amended 1998/03/23; previous version)

(A) a minimum of 5 hours dual instruction, and
(amended 1998/03/23; previous version)

(B) a minimum of 5 takeoffs and landings as sole occupant of the aeroplane, except for two crew aircraft, in which case the takeoffs and landings shall be done as pilot-in-command.

(ii) The following exercises shall be included in the seaplane training:

(A) taxiing,

(B) sailing,

(C) docking,

(D) takeoffs, and

(E) landings, and

(F) as conditions exist, operations on glassy water, rough water and in crosswind conditions.

(b) Skill

Within the 12 months preceding the date of application for a seaplane rating, an applicant shall have successfully completed a qualifying flight under the supervision of a Transport Canada Inspector or a person qualified in accordance with CAR 425.21(6) by demonstrating the level of skill specified in the Instructor Guide - Seaplane Rating (TP12668).
(amended 2000/09/01; previous version)

[pigboat]

My Canadian commercial licence is endorsed as SMELS which stands for Single and Multi-engine Land and Sea.
So does mine, but my Cub had 150 thundering horses. :D
Do they still hand out SMELS licenses? I understood they were like 00 licenses, you could fly anything that floated as long as it was below 12.5, or above that, if you had the endorsement. Hasn't something changed whereby now you require a separate type endorsement or something, irregardless of weight?

[albatross]

You sir are correct I believe - Don't rightly know for sure as I haven't flown a fixed wing in years TC sent me the licence when they went to the new format.
I assume that when I win the lotto Max I will need to meet currency requirements before zorching off to the cottage in the Piston Beaver I plan to purchase.:ok: