Emirates Arrives in Adelaide on Promo trip

[Aussie]

Emirates to start Adelaide service in November | adelaidenow (http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/air-they-come-emirates-touches-down-in-adelaide-to-promote-new-service-starting-november/story-e6frea6u-1226478215697)

Emirates makes a promotional trip to Adelaide Airport... Anyone know how that worked? A flight to Melb with a diversion? Surely they didnt send it down empty...? :D

[camber]

Looks like a ferry flight from MEL and return. On ground for 3 hours.

[Aussie]

Ahhh that could well be it! Nice one! :ok:

[donpizmeov]

These Boeing things tend to fly Ozzie almost empty these days anyway Aussie. Seems they don't like a bit of heat and long distance flights. Makes staff travel very difficult. Frustrating to see an aircraft push back with 30+ empty seats and no staff accepted.
They can do India and back full though, so not a complete loss.

The Don

[vfenext]

Don, classic post! Still laughing!!! Pity it's true.

[scandistralian]

Which flight pushed back with 30+ seats avbl?

[clear to land]

Best guess is that if there were 30 spare seats it was at MZFW: lots of freight which makes far more $ than staff SLF. Sorry Don, forgot that on the 180 you can't carry freight so didn't think of that..;)

[bvcu]

so looking at how things are in the freight world at the moment if it was so valuable there wouldnt be any freighters parked at the moment .........

[donpizmeov]

Fellas you fly the thing, check. The flight to BNE is carrying less revenue than a 345 at the moment and burning 100kg per hour more. Check the flight plans if you don't believe me.
Belly full of cargo maybe...but limited to some 20+T under max ZFW to make the distance.
Fringhtok I thought we had freighters to carry cargo? Don't the pax fleet carry, well you know, Pax? Seems the 777 does neither when it warms up. Lucky that doesn't happen too often. :ok:

The Don

[GA Button]

Good banter :ok:

[Fearless Leader]

Logic is not necessarily used in this part of the world:ugh:

[trimotor]

Sounds like more A380 pilot justification for an aeroplane not able to do what the makers put on the tin! DXB to the USA west coast anyone?

[MrMachfivepointfive]

Anybody know why the 345s are operating short flights when the aircraft was specifically designed for ULR trips?
The 345 can take MZFW DXB-SYD, while the 773ER is already sliding down the payload range diagram. However the 773ER can match the 345's max. payload of ~42 tons on that sector. The 773ER will be in SYD 20 minutes faster and burn 6 tonnes less.

[springbok449]

Just out of interest, how many Pax does a 345 carry? Just wondering because carrying MZFW doesn't necessary mean that much if it's carrying a 100 Pax less, there surely has to be a reason why the 345 and 346 production shut down over a year ago and that the leasing cost are cheap compared to 777 or am I missing something...?

I'll get my coat...

[Yarra]

Springbok... A340-500....@ 3 class config... 258 seats...

[donpizmeov]

trimotor,

You may be right. The 380 may be just as sh@t as the 777 to the west coast of the US. Crap for staff travel. Fingers crossed that it gets the east coast oz though, as at least it can fly there with full seats.

The Don

PS. What are the thoughts of a cat F twin?

[scandistralian]

Stuff wasting the 380 on East Coast Aus trips (who really wants to go to that side of the country anyway?!) Imagine how much the Super would make us all flying 2 class to DEL/BOM/MAA instead....

Hello Bonus!!!! :ok::ok::ok:

Seriously, how qualified are we to make fleet/route management choices, you don't think the Kahunas have all the tools to make the right decisions?

This whole 380/777 banter thing is good for a laugh, but woe to those who take it to heart, there is much more to life than having one of the best jobs going, arguing the merits of two of the worlds finest commercial aircraft.

[Wizofoz]

Yep.

Both have their place and both make money on the right route.

Interesting slip by TCAS at a recent meeting- "When we have an all 777/380 fleet"......

Seem like the 350 is a dead duck!

My money is also on us being launch customrer of the 777-8 and 9.

[Praise Jebus]

I don't care too much which jet makes the most money...that is someone else's worry. I do care about my staff travel and it was easier getting a seat to/from oz direct on a 345 than a weight restricted 777. Now if EK ever picks up Alice Springs as a destination then the 300ER will be the perfect choice.....

[donpizmeov]

I preferred TCAS's "92hrs will not become the target" quote. Rates also with JAs "By Oct all EK pilots will be able take all their leave", still wondering what year that Oct will fall in.
One office dwelling acquaintance, said that during some indoctrination course recently, they showed a slide with the future fleet being 120 A380 and 160 B777. So who knows?

The Don

[falconeasydriver]

I do care about my staff travel and it was easier getting a seat to/from oz direct on a 345 than a weight restricted 777.

Talk about wood for the trees! Part of the reason you could get on the 345 is because we were carrying less people, there were a lot less seats available than now....it's just that our commercial department are utterly superb at filling seats.
Staff travel is a lottery that's for sure, but FABs helps, FWIW in all the BNE and MEL directs I've done this summer, we never left staff behind for performance reasons, I've even nominated a closer alt to destination which got 12 staff and an additional 3 tonnes of freight on.

[donpizmeov]

Did you do that Falcon, or did your Captain? :E

No staff on the direct BNE for the past week. FABs was showing empty 1st, 4 empty in J and 22 spare in Y on one such trip. NO staff accepted. Checked its flight plan when I got home and it was TOW limited ex DXB so ZFW restricted to 40T revenue. So FABs although good, does not help in cases like this.

The joys of staff travel.

The Don

[falconeasydriver]

Don check your PMs :ok:

[donpizmeov]

Got it. You done good.

The Don

[halas]

Amsterdam, Heathrow, Seoul, Osaka (no more slots into Narita so have to truck the stuff down) Sydney & Hong Kong.

All 777 Freighter flights. Why? Because the vag!na can't carry freight.
And remember every second flight on these is empty. So there is a lot at stake when they put the Gay180 on any run. Especially when they have to follow it up with freighter aircraft and one way is empty!

Not complaining at all, but pointing out what is happening. This is great for any ones monthly hour accumulation. For me, having done two of them, dead-heading twice in first class, it's money for jam! ;)

halas

[donpizmeov]

Very good points halas. But if it only carries 500 or 528 pax depending on the variant, how can the difference between DOW and the AZFW be 66 to 73T depending on the above. Don't tell me they are lying on the load sheet.

You are totally correct though. The 777 makes a very good freighter. Shame it can't carry any pax.

The Don

[bvcu]

Interesting article in flt int online a couple of days ago about the numbers with belly cargo...... seems there isnt a simple obvious answer as to its profitability as no one can agree how its costed , so how does that fare in the argument on the big one that cant carry much v the smaller one that can carry a lot ? dont think theres an easy answer !!!

[Praise Jebus]

Falcon I agree with your point re numbers growth but then as you Boeing boys point out, the 777 can take freight so it gets loaded up with that before staff and you have the situation that Don mentioned above,TO weight limited. It might make money....I don't care too much as I see it climb out as I drive home... At least on the 500 I had a better chance of a front seat than on the 7, 12 vs 8 helped. FABs is an improvement but useless on a large slice of our network. Good job for getting staff on though, I do the same.

[halas]

I don't know Don. But l think the most important thing to remember is that freight usually cubes out before it weighs out.

Now if they sent the 380 to SEA SFO LAX DFW IAH, how many punters would they leave behind?

Personally, I couldn't care less.

But it's all down to how they utilise each and every airframe. EK commercial department choose to send an airframe on a run that is either restrictive or not. There must be some logic in the way they do it. There must be some gain in not putting one of the other types on the flight.
Pretty soon l think you guys will be experiencing that, and being at the pointy end deciding on minimum fuel / Maximum load / Leaving punters behind.

Back to the freighter....
So you reckon that 500 or so punters on minimum yield justifies a freighter flying one way empty. I disagree. It's the freight alone that pays for the follow up aircraft to carry what the 380 leaves behind.

halas

[White Knight]

380 to SEA SFO LAX DFW IAH

They won't leave many punters behind 'cos I hear that all North America flights will be 380 before end of 2014:}:}:} Leave the the finances to Commercial heh girls???

T7 is a lame duck for long-haul... My folks really hate getting stuck out of MEL!

[Iver]

Will fully-loaded A380s have the range to serve LAX and SFO nonstop from Dubai?

[givemewings]

Awhile back Galley FM suggested there was a plan in the works for a few of the new deliveries to feature only one shower spa (possibly even none!) in F, reducing the tanks/weight required and using those a/c on routes where the demand for the showers is low. Probably nothing to it but you never know!

When is the stretched version of the 380 due? After all this is only the first one... Iver, we had a couple AB guys (as pax) onboard recently who said the next lot would definitely be capable of doing those flights full...

[halas]

KC 10 can take a a lot of fuel, but it's not fuel carried that makes money.

halas

[Wizofoz]

When is the stretched version of the 380 due?

When Airbus make money on the first one- In other words when Hell freezes over!!

[donpizmeov]

Wiz,
This hell freezing thing seems good on a couple of counts. First as you said airbus makes some money, secondly the cooler temps might help the boeing not be as take off weight limited ex Dubai and allow it to carry a useful load. Finally some good news for staff travel.

Hope it happens soon.

The Don

[falconeasydriver]

now now Donny.....

next thing you'll be saying is the 380 cruises at .85:E

[donpizmeov]

It does when its been told to slow down Falcon. :}

[clear to land]

Slow down -oh no-another 380 overspeed ASR-who would have expected mountain waves over the 'hump'? :ugh:

[three eighty]

Who would have expected the right runway when cleared for the left!