MP files Early Day Motion to Tax Heli flights over London

[RJC]

The article can be found here (http://www.edms.org.uk/2012-13/532.htm?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter)

Text of article...
That this House notes with concern the large number of non-essential helicopter flights over London causing unacceptable levels of noise pollution to large numbers of residents in urban areas; further notes that lack of regulation in this field means that there is no limit on night-time flying and that sufficient safety precautions are not in place for the landing sites; observes that there is no formal way to monitor whether helicopters have complied with basic flight regulations and guidelines; believes that, given that motorists incur additional costs when travelling in congested areas like London, it is inappropriate for helicopter users to pay no additional charges beyond a reduced level of fuel excise duty; and calls on the Government to introduce regulation, similar to that introduced in other major international cities, to reduce the levels of helicopter noise pollution in urban areas and which ensures all helicopter flights are registered with a central agency, incentivises helicopter manufacturers to reduce noise pollution in newer models, bans night-time flights and disincentivises the use of private helicopters in urban areas.

Those with views should perhaps contact MP Julian Huppert...

[Savoia]

I'm not sure if approaching the proposing MP is the best response. It would seem to me that an MP sympathetic to the cause who could counter Mr Huppert's unhelpful motion would be most useful.

My question is .. where is the British Helicopter Association? What are they doing to defend the industry in this matter and, of greater relevance, to enhance and encourage rotary-wing access to the city?

[RVDT]

In a nutshell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_privilege).

Parliamentary privilege is controversial because of its potential for abuse; a member can use privilege to make damaging allegations that would ordinarily be discouraged by defamation laws, without first determining whether those allegations have a strong foundation.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/Julian_Huppert_01.JPG/220px-Julian_Huppert_01.JPG

Poor chap - I wonder if he is aware that it is probably just the MET going about their job.

Now, hands up all you who fly around in/out of London uneccessarily and at night! Apparently someone knows who you are. You have been warned!

Priceless - as they say, you couldn't make this up if you tried.

I wonder what Boris thinks of this chap leaning over the fence and telling him what and what not to do.

I wonder what the REAL story is? Maybe someone should ask Mr Huppert.

If you read the past motions by this MP you will get an idea of the agenda.

Interestingly academia and politics seem to be the only hands on experience to date.

[Bravo73]

For some reason, every time that I read the MP's name, I see Julian Muppet.

I imagine that I'm not the first. :E

[Brilliant Stuff]

It probably got noisy only recently due to the sport day we had where we had several agencies flying over London providing essential services....

I thought we are in a recession?

[misterbonkers]

Sorry, my hands go up!

Anyway. Time for another ginger biscuit...

[RMK]

If his constituency is Cambridge, how does London helicopter noise affect them?

Noting his other motions, he seems to have jack squat of real importance to do. Maybe he has a mate that lives near Battersea heliport who said “here’s something you can do to look busy...”

Honestly, I can’t speak with people this dim, but if you’d like to: Contact - Julian Huppert | MP for Cambridge (http://julianhuppert.org.uk/contact/)

Probably as a starting point, someone could explain to him that any helicopter in the London CTR is under SVFR and pilots can’t just fly in willy nilly and do as they please.

[Pittsextra]

I live in central london and over the years have lived in a variety of places and actually the only noise pollution that is easily identifiable as that of helo activity is from the police helicopter.

I used to live in E14 and actually it got rediculous at one point with regular 3-4am awakenings as they hover over areas on the south bank. Quite what value they were adding was anyones guess - given all the optics would work just as well much higher.

Then more recently in NW3 and you see regular activity over Hampstead heath. Whilst it might be nice to watch an EC145 at 100ft its easy to see why that causes offence to the masses.

If London commercial traffic gets a kicking then parties with vested interests would do well to get in touch with the police to understand their operational rational.

[Savoia]

.. understand their operational rational.
Presumably rationale! Either way it is based on tasking from ASU Ops which in turn is driven by levels of (mostly) criminal activity.

.. would work just as well much higher.
Err .. yes, you are beneath a fairly expansive TMA in London!

[Pittsextra]

In the end any ASU operating in London is simply directing and providing surveillance - so do that at 300ft is the same as 5000ft - we can all puck our own number that works.

Yes there is a TMA but I can assure you nothing is overhead E14 at 3 and 4am that is commercial - I believe the first commercial flights are heard around 5.30am.

And even as a pilot nothing gets you rev'd up more than a helicopter at a few hundred feet for an hour at 3-4am. In fact I'm sure residents would happily chip in and pay for whatever damage/ issues the criminals are causing than have that night after night..

In the end sadly it just alienates other commercial traffic that has far less impact.

[SASless]

An auto rides on the roads and streets....uses the traffic system....crosses bridges.....thus I can see some wear and tear on the infrastructure.

Beats me what a helicopter does in the air over London that would merit an additional charge for that passage?

[RVDT]

SAS,

While you are at it can you explain to folks why in the U.S. of A. people "drive" on a "parkway" and "park" on a "driveway".

[heli1]

I wonder if he has been reading of Senators Schummer's "success" in Long Island which mandates heights and routes but has now upset local residents who previously weren't affected!
And what about Heavies on approach to Heathrow...are they next ?

[homonculus]

Heavies only really effect the western outskirts of London. Most people have bought their houses there since Heathrow started and so IMHO caveat emptor.

However for those of us living in central London there is no issue with fixed wing. Nor is there an issue with rotary. EXCEPT police units. I might get one or two twins transitting north south but it is inaudible inside. In comparison we often have one and sometimes two police aircreft hanging overhead for hour after hour. At 3am it stops me sleeping. In the day it stops me holding a telephone conversation.

I too fail to see why surveillance cannot be carried out just a few hundred feet higher. Another 500 feet with reduce the noise by 75%. I fail to see why marches and other planned events need aircraft when police can easily position on the tops of buildings. And I fail to see why they need to remain in a stationary hover in the middle of the night when presumably they cant find the criminal!

It is clear that most residents and workers in central London cannot identify a police helicopter. I am often asked if the noise is from my aircraft. This motion may have little chance of success, but the minister I am told failed to support us when the issue was raised in the House despite having been briefed by the industry. We need to get the message over that it isnt us before the rumour grows

[Pittsextra]

what homonculus says.. completely agree.

[MBJ]

Its not pretty seeing a grown man cry - that was me after reading this post! If this early day motion is a representative picture of this man's views it undermines anything he says about anything!

[misterbonkers]

AND its a CONGESTION charge for cars not a POLLUTION charge.

So his argument is just flawed. :ugh::D:confused::eek::sad::oh:

[freqslf]

My appartment (Spring Street, a couple minutes walk from Paddington Station) is surprisingly quiet at night. Apart from the hovering police helos, that is. Could be something to do with scanning of the roofs i would guess.. infrared whatever :8

[chevvron]

The motion shows a remarkable lack of appreciation about what the procedures are in the Heathrow/City CTRs; might one suggest that maybe his researcher hasn't done their job properly and that merely writing a motion based on information from constituents doesn't achieve much?
(Looks like an a-hole anyway; probably claims for every postage stamp)

[MBJ]

You've almost got to admire the breathtaking ignorance displayed by this sorry specimen of MP. :{

[wokkaboy]

Mr/Dr Huppert has a bee in his bonnet about aviation, he's also opposed to runway expansion in the south east.

BBC News - Cambridge MP calls on Lib Dems to oppose new runways (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-19722897)

He will clearly therefore choose never to fly in an aeroplane or helicopter if he is a man of his word and values...

:rolleyes: