What’s the rule about luggage under the seat in front of you?

[t1grm]

I have a standard size carry on. I thought the whole point of this is that it fits in an overhead locker (end on) and fits under the seat in front of you. I was on an Easyjet flight the other week and all the overhead lockers were full. They were taking bags off people and checking them into the hold. I put my carry on under the seat in front of me. It fitted snugly but perfectly and I was able to sit in a normal upright posture with my feet flat on the floor. Alright I couldn’t slouch down and stretch my legs out under the seat in front of me because there was a bag there but, I was happy to forgo that luxury for an hour to save time and worry in collecting the baggage.

However, one of the cabin crew said it was not allowed and, after much protesting, I had my bag taken off me and put in the hold. The excuse was that it stuck out past the end of the metal bar. It did stick out about 3 inches but it was flush against the front of the metal bar and is a standard size (22 inches IIRC). What is the point in having a standard size which is then too big to fit?

[PAXboy]

Sorry to be negative but ...

They all make their own rules! There are many, many 'standard' sizes. If the CC thought that, in an emergency evacuation, your bag would have caused you, or another pax, to trip as they left their seat - then that is that and you accept or leave the aircraft.

You will never get a clear answer on this. All the airports point to the airlines and they point to their standards. If there is an anomoly between the 'standard' on one sector and on another - even with two aircraft of the same carrier? That's the way it is. The CC have to secure the cabin the way that they can defend to their manager of, worse case, in court.

[easyflyer83]

Yeah, i think the crucial point in all this was that, whilst it fit under the seat if it was sticking out in anyway that could cause someone to trip in an evacuation, it shouldn't be stowed under the seat in front. Although I sympathise, it was absolutely right that the bag was offloaded. Tagging and offloading bags is a hassle for the crew so it is unlikely that they would have done it if they really didn't have to.

[WHBM]

I have a standard size carry on. I thought the whole point of this is that it fits in an overhead locker (end on) and fits under the seat in front of you. ...... It fitted snugly but perfectly .....The excuse was that it stuck out past the end of the metal bar. It did stick out about 3 inches but it was flush against the front of the metal bar and is a standard size (22 inches IIRC). What is the point in having a standard size which is then too big to fit?
Human beings don't come in one standard size, and neither do aircraft or their baggage provision, either overhead or under the seat. Likewise for manufacturers of "standard" luggage their job in life is to sell their luggage. They probably don't know one end of an aircraft from the other (and certainly don't if they pretend there is some standard, 22 inches or anything else).

Fortunately there are people at the airline, not the bag manufacturer, who do understand about both dimensions of baggage etc, and safety factors, and spend quite some time defining limitations, while still being reasonable to their paying customer passengers, which limitations they then train their cabin crew in. Please take advantage of this. Contrary to much belief, cabin crew do not receive commission from the bag handler for each piece of baggage they reorganise.

I still don't understand how within one paragraph the bag transmorphed from "fitted snugly but perfectly" to "stick out about 3 inches". You also don't say if you were sitting in a window seat (nobody to go past you), centre or aisle seat (where two people alongside may have to negotiate past your protruding bag in smoke conditions). Given the high density seating on Easyjet, 3 inches is a significant proportion of the space available to those passengers to pass between the seats.

I don't believe Easyjet charge when they take bags off passengers and put them in the hold, so what is the issue with doing that ?

[Tableview]

I don't believe Easyjet charge when they take bags off passengers and put them in the hold, so what is the issue with doing that ?

They don't charge if they take the bag due to lack of space, but they do if they take it because it's too big - that's fair.

The problem with taking your handbaggage off you is that you will normally have stuff in it that you don't want to check in - keys, papers, laptop, etc. If they take it off you then you have no way of carrying this unless they provide with at least a plastic packet. This is a matter I have taken up with EZY.

[WHBM]

They don't charge if they take the bag due to lack of space, but they do if they take it because it's too big - that's fair.

The problem with taking your handbaggage off you is that you will normally have stuff in it that you don't want to check in - keys, papers, laptop, etc. If they take it off you then you have no way of carrying this unless they provide with at least a plastic packet. This is a matter I have taken up with EZY.
Well the "too big" should be dealt with by the gate staff. The cabin crew, dealing with issues inside the aircraft, do not, I understand, even have a charging mechanism available to them for bags that make it that far.

I've never encountered a laptop bag that doesn't fit under the seat (even my whopper does), and other items would surely be either on your person or in some genuine hand luggage - not in some 22" suitcase.

[Tableview]

WHBM (http://www.pprune.org/members/59838-whbm)

The point you are missing, and perhaps I was not clear, is that sometimes, due to lack of space in the overheads, they make you check in genuine cabin-bag sized baggage which you are entiteld to take on board. This particularly happens when you don't join the baa-ing queue of sheep and you choose to be amongst the last to board. By that point the overheads are sometimes full.

[Jarvy]

Simple answer, get to the airport earlier then you will one of the first to board so won't have the problem again.

[Tableview]

It's not about 'getting to the airport earlier', it's about not leaping up and standing like an idiot for half an hour before the gate opens, or standing like a sheep in queue for 40 minutes being jostled. And before you say 'Speedy Boarding' .... that's a farce out of most of their airports.

[WHBM]

The point you are missing, and perhaps I was not clear, is that sometimes, due to lack of space in the overheads, they make you check in genuine cabin-bag sized baggage which you are entiteld to take on board.
Well "genuine" cabin-bag sized items, including my quite chunky laptop bag, will always fit under the seat in front of me, without obstructing anyone else, as will other comparable items, women's handbags, etc. A 22" (nearly 2 feet) sized bag can go where it belongs, and which the airline provides facilities for, in the hold.

In passing I've never found no space in the overheads full for coats, or even laptops, only for what are actually suitcases that belong elsewhere in the first place.

[avturboy]

I have a standard size carry on.

Standard size carry on ... didn't think there was such a beast.

Each airline makes its own rules, pax beware!

Check each airline's website for their own restrictions and stick to them.

You might end up with different bags for different airlines though!

[ExXB]

From Wiki:

The International Air Transport Association (IATA) sets guidelines for cabin baggage/hand luggage/carry-on luggage size. They are not mandatory, however, and individual airlines can and do vary their requirements. The IATA guideline is:
Cabin baggage should have a maximum length of 56 cm ( 22 in ) , width of 45 cm ( 18 in ) and depth of 25 cm ( 10 in ) including all handles , side pockets , wheels etc.

Many network airlines apply this standard but beware when travelling LCC or similar.

Read the conditions of carriage before you buy your ticket, and again, before you travel.

[LondonPax]

If you choose not to join "the baa-ing queue of sheep" and "choose to be amongst the last to board" that's the risk you take. Maybe they're not sheep at all but frequent flyers who know what happens when the overheads get filled up with monster suitcases that should have been checked in. This isn't limited to EZY and its ilk either. Same on BA, including in business class.

A few minutes standing in a queue before boarding must be better than having to check a bag in or to have to put it in an overhead somewhere well away from your seat so you have to force your way against the flow of disembarking pax just to get to it.

[Hotel Tango]

By choice I don't fly on race-for-your seat carriers so can't comment on carriers without seat allocation. As for the others I tend to try and assess at the gate how full the flight is going to be. If it looks heavy I do my best to get on early so that I can guarantee a space in the overhead locker. Otherwise I stay seated and board at my leisure. I also check what type of aircraft I'll be flying on as hand baggage size is more restricted on the commuter types.

[Victor Inox]

Of course, all airlines could fix the problem with carry-on luggage very simply by installing overhead bins with separators to create individual compartments of the exact size of their maximum permissible carry-on bag. Label each compartment with a seat number - and presto.

[Smoketrails]

Of course, all airlines could fix the problem with carry-on luggage very simply by installing overhead bins with separators to create a individual compartments of the exact size of their maximum permissible carry-on bag. Label each compartment with a seat number - and presto.

It would at least stop a lot of the cheating that goes on(In the states I noticed a lot of the pax taking on 2 or 3 pieces of handbaggage!).

[DaveReidUK]

Of course, all airlines could fix the problem with carry-on luggage very simply by installing overhead bins with separators to create a individual compartments of the exact size of their maximum permissible carry-on bag. Label each compartment with a seat number - and presto.

You're kidding, I hope. I can't think of anything that would make worse use of the space available than a whole bunch of extra, expensive, and unnecessary dividers.

The most flexible arrangement, though clearly not possible for structural reasons, would be to have a single bin the full length of the cabin with no dividers at all. Closing it would be fun as well. :O

It would at least stop a lot of the cheating that goes on (In the states I noticed a lot of the pax taking on 2 or 3 pieces of handbaggage!).


Far better, simpler, and quicker to stop passengers getting past the gate with more than one piece.

[farci]

The strategy I employ, particularly when there is no allocated seat, is simply to choose any overhead bin with empty space before arriving at my seat.

Never quite sure If I feel guilty about this :confused:

[PhineasC]

Last time a flew an internal BA flight seats were preallocated but boarding was a free for all, usually my goal to be a super cool flyer last on last off. By the time I'd got on to the plane the closest empty bin was half way down the plane, so I was last off though I didn't need to collect my luggage. The airlines ought to board FF first so they can get the bins closest to their seats.

[ExXB]

Last time a flew an internal BA flight seats were preallocated but boarding was a free for all, usually my goal to be a super cool flyer last on last off. By the time I'd got on to the plane the closest empty bin was half way down the plane, so I was last off though I didn't need to collect my luggage. The airlines ought to board FF first so they can get the bins closest to their seats.

Many do, but obviously not BA. But you do have a choice, don't you? Oh, maybe not.

On Swiss, the flight attendants stop Y class passengers from using business class bins. (politely, asking to see boarding card, and assisting) Although on one Jumbolino flight I took ZRH-GVA there were only two rows of C and NO overhead bins (O2 and other stuff for the crew up there) at all for C passengers.

[Cymmon]

Slightly off topic but this has been seen in Lanzarote Airport:

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc261/richbedforduk/Lanzarote/272f6e21.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc261/richbedforduk/Lanzarote/2a0ca971.jpg

Ryanair problems?

[ChicoG]

It irks me when I see people putting their bag in an O/L several rows in front of them, so they can try and barge their way off a few rows early on landing.

I had the good fortune to get downgraded from C class to an equivalent row on an all-economy aircraft (only a quick hop over the Gulf), only to find all the bins full.

It's a tribute to Qatar's respect for their frequent flyers and business passengers that the CC simply removed a bag that wasn't meant to be there to make space for mine.

Furthermore, the chancer five or six rows back that had tried it was dismayed to see his bag go all the way to the back of the plane.

Oh how I laughed.

:)

[ExXB]

Slightly off topic but this has been seen in Lanzarote Airport:Ryanair problems?

LCC problem I would say. The problem with this is that the LCCs will permit this only where they have been pressured by law, or that particular airport. Take GVA-BRS, for example. At BRS 'somebody' has pressured the LCCs to accept the extra Duty Free bag, so they do - with lots of notices to that effect in the DF shops. But in GVA this isn't the case. One bag only, no exceptions.

This really irks my wife who travels with old DF bags, so she can put her handbag into one before boarding. In BRS she gets away with it. In GVA she doesn't.

For another thread perhaps, by why do LCCs never carry enough small change? I'm referring specifically to squeezy-UK and UK pounds!

[bondim]

ExXB,

In response to your last question: at ezy, each Cabin Manager is given £60 when promoted to carry as their float, half of this is carried in euros. Now multiply that £60 by the approximate number of Cabin Managers employed, say 2000, that gives the airline £180,000.00 out of circulation, losing value by the day. If you were an airline maager, trying to squeeze every penny of profit, would you give more float, say double the amount, £360,000.00?

This amount of change, further, doesn't go very far if the first three pax pays with a £20 note, hence the crew tend to not have enough change on their first flight.

[ExXB]

ExXB,

In response to your last question: at ezy, each Cabin Manager is given £60 when promoted to carry as their float, half of this is carried in euros. Now multiply that £60 by the approximate number of Cabin Managers employed, say 2000, that gives the airline £180,000.00 out of circulation, losing value by the day. If you were an airline maager, trying to squeeze every penny of profit, would you give more float, say double the amount, £360,000.00?

This amount of change, further, doesn't go very far if the first three pax pays with a £20 note, hence the crew tend to not have enough change on their first flight.

Let's see if I understand this. On the first flight out the Cabin Manager has £30 and €30~40. There are two trolleys - one from the front, one from the back. So each has £15. No (expletive deleted) wonder they never have any change.

With interest rates (much) less than 1% I don't buy your argument. The number of lost sales (I once abandoned my order when they didn't have change - and I didn't trust them to give me a reasonable exchange rate on my Swiss credit card) would well exceed any loss.

Sounds (again) like somebody putting the airline first, and the customer second.

[DaveReidUK]

Sounds (again) like somebody putting the airline first, and the customer second.

That's an interesting perspective. History is littered with the corpses of companies who gave great customer service but didn't do their sums properly.

If the cabin crew make their budgeted amount of sales to passengers who offer the correct money, I can't imagine the airline losing sleep over passengers who don't get to spend their high-denomination banknotes.

[TightSlot]

Let's see if I understand this. On the first flight out the Cabin Manager has £30 and €30~40. There are two trolleys - one from the front, one from the back. So each has £15. No (expletive deleted) wonder they never have any change.

Have you ever carried that amount of coinage?

If £60 isn't sufficient. what amount is? £100? £150?

[Cymmon]

£2,304.27p is sufficient. I have spent 5 years and £1,235,648.02p on my research and this will ensure all change can be given correctly. Thank you to the government changing money and coinage research agency.
Luckily they paid me £25.03 for the research so I think I got a good deal.:\

But the biggest unit of UK currency would be the £2 coin.:zzz:

[bondim]

I have been ezy cabin crew for nearly 7 years and I struggle to recount any instances at all where an order was abandoned because of insufficient change. If this was an issue, the airline would certainly do something about it; onboard sales are a very important revenue source.

Besides, we almost always manage to get all the change due by the end of the service. If that is not the case, a PA is made to pax to help out (I don't personally like the need for this intrusion, it definitely doesn't sound good and is less than great service). But as for lost sales, I doubt that's an issue.

By the way, I'm not defending any sides here, merely offering the explanation to ExXB's question.

[Shack37]

Have you ever carried that amount of coinage?

If £60 isn't sufficient. what amount is? £100? £150?


OK, two questions so here's two more.

Why should a passenger need to carry that much coinage?
If £60 isn't sufficient shouldn't the airline(s) decide what is?

[lenhamlad]

Why should a passenger need to carry that much coinage?

He doesn't. A snack and a coffee or soft drink will set you back less than ten quid. A five pound note and five in pound coins should do the trick. Where's the big deal?

[easyflyer83]

With interest rates (much) less than 1% I don't buy your argument. The number of lost sales (I once abandoned my order when they didn't have change - and I didn't trust them to give me a reasonable exchange rate on my Swiss credit card) would well exceed any loss.

I'm an Easyjet CM. We do very occasionally run short of change but more often than not it is £5 notes. Actual coinage is usually fine.

Abandoning an order on the grounds that the crew are short on change has never happened to me and to be brutally honest it seems like you cut your nose off to spite your face. You'd have got your change, the crew weren't going anywhere lets face it. Also, on your card you could surely have gained an idea of the rate you was getting. Plus, with a drinks/snacks order which is typically low value, the exchange rate wouldn't have mattered anyway.

Making a mountain out of a mole hill if you ask me. Yes occasionally crews run short of change but for 99.9% of passengers it doesn't bother them at all provided they get there change by the end of the flight.

[TightSlot]

Why should a passenger need to carry that much coinage?
There's a lesson in this for me - I wasn't clear enough. May I rephrase?

Have you ever carried that amount of coinage? Do you know how much it weighs?

If £60 isn't sufficient shouldn't the airline(s) decide what is?
The airline has decided - It's £60. Apparently there is a belief that this isn't sufficient. It seems reasonable to ask what might be considered sufficient if that is the case.

[ExXB]

Maybe I misunderstood Bodim. I thought s/he meant that the trolleys had a total of £15 in notes and coins, not just in coins.

I apologise if I was making a mountain out of a molehill, but on many squeezy flights I have taken the crew makes various attempts to address the issue - requesting exact change where possible, making announcements requesting change, promising to return with your change (and making a note on a handy napkin), etc.

Because this is such a frequent occurrence, at least on flights I have taken, I thought squeezy might have seen this as a hassle for their staff and an inconvenience to their customers. From responses it appears I was mistaken.

In my particular case I was at the point where the trolleys met in the middle of the cabin, I only had a £20 in UK currency, (which I had gotten from the ATM at Geneva airport, no other notes dispensed there) they would not take Swiss coins only notes, and I only wanted a beer. Neither trolly had enough change. They would take my Credit Card but would bill me in pounds not francs meaning high transaction fees. So I said, thank you but no thanks.

[wowzz]

ExXB - I do not think EZY management will be losing much sleep over the lost profit on your beer.
In my experience [only 10 or so sectors per year] I have never experienced any problems with lack of change on EZY flights - occasionally there may have been a slight delay in getting the correct change, but never a lost sale.
However, on my less frequent flights with a certain Irish lcc, it seems to be the norm to run out of change quite early in the flight: I always get the impression that there is no such thing as a £5 'float' let alone one of £60.

[Sober Lark]

Will Ryanair's new order for 737-800's have larger overhead bins?

Given the generous 10kg allowance and dimensions per person the present Ryanair fleet seem to have difficulty accommodating cabin baggage on a full aircraft. When the overhead bins are full the baggage under the seat doesn't seem to work as most people have maxed on their dimensions and weight and there just isn't enough room under the seat in front of you without it jutting out and creating a tripping hazard.

[parabellum]

'Speedy Boarding' .... that's a farce out of most of their airports

May be but not, in my experience, at LGW or AMS.

[WHBM]

For those expecting the pax to have adequate coins for their purchases, bear in mind they have just come through security, where one of the nuisances is coins on you. Therefore many, myself included, will dump most of their coinage before leaving the house, knowing the issues at security. For those airports where the security tell you to put your keys and coins etc in the side of your laptop bag rather than use the little tray, that's generally where they still are, up in the overhead (with you in a window seat) when the sale items come around.

Aviation. Joined-up thinking ..... ?

[ExXB]

Spicejetter, did you see the date of my posts? Curious why you feel it necessary to insult me a year later.

[kaikohe76]

Hi,
Many years ago when having boarded a UK shuttle flight (BA not Easy) in civies, I stll had my Nav bag as cabin baggage. Early departure, so lots of attache cases far too big, being ramed into the hat racks.
Absolutely no space in the hat rack above my seat, so I spoke to one of the F/As & asked what do I do. Initial answer was, my cabin bag (Nav bag) would have to go in the hold, my answer, was no way jose & stood my ground. Eventually some hatrack space above my seat was made, there were two large items, that should not have got into the aircraft in the first place. It turned out, these belonged to pax who was sitting many rows from mine, he must have boarded at the front of the que, & run about taking up hat rack space, before sitting down. The words, ignorant, fat & businesman, would have been appropriate at the time.

[Roj approved]

Now folks, this is a worldwide problem not restricted to LCC's. there are a number of issue, all have been discussed previously.

But to summarize the big points:

1. Bag manufactures labeling a bag "cabin legal".

2. Different standards across the airlines/ports as to how many bags are permitted.

3. Different weight/size standard for carry on bags

4. Different level of enforcement. Ie: the issues of space on a full flight are not such a problem on one with a good load of empty seats.

But for the passengers,try this.
Jump on a set if scales, then weigh your carry on bags, then go to the airlines website and see what the allocation is for pax and bag. (84kg for my airline)

That is the maximum you and your bags can weigh. So if you are 83kgs, you only have 1kg of allowable luggage. Conversely, if you weigh 50kgs, you can bring the maximum number of bags up to the total maximum weight allowed for carry on, eg: 2 bags totaling 10kgs, (not 2 bags equaling 34kgs.)

With the "normal" person being larger than they were in the past, there are some passengers that technically are unable to use any of the carry on entitlement. (And should be paying for another seat if they weigh above the airlines maximum)

The weight and balance and performance figures for take off are calculated using the standard weights of 84kgs, plus check in bags, freight and fuel. These figures are maximized for runway length, weather, engine life etc, and provide an airline with some considerable cost saving.

There are some aircraft that can work out the actual weight once airborne using different parameters, and it is evident that the passenger/carry on luggage weight can be out a lot of the time. The biggest discrepancy I have seen is 1.5%. 1200kg's!!

That may not seem like a lot, but it could be critical in a rejected take off or one engine failure on take off. If also increases fuel burn.

Next time you are getting agitated about cabin baggage with your "standard" cabin bag, Just ask yourself, is me and my bag equal or less than the airlines maximum? Have I done everything I can to maximize my chance of stowing my bag correctly? (Check it in the bag check module, boarded early) if you have, the CC should have no reason to ask you to check your bag.

If by chance they do want to offload your bag, here's a tip, be nice, and comply, otherwise you may go to CDG, your bag may go to ANC!

As for the on board change issue, carry a note close to the value of the food/drink you intend to purchase, and let the CC keep the change, one day, it could stop your bag from being offloaded and ending up in ANC. Karma;)

[DaveReidUK]

then go to the airlines website and see what the allocation is for pax and bag. (84kg for my airline)I've never seen an airline website that quotes this kind of information (other than those like Samoa Air operating very small aircraft where MTOW or performance may an issue).

Can you point us towards any that you are aware of, please?

[ExXB]

In the good old days IATA used to set a standard for baggage - checked and carry-on. IATA members applied that standard as a minimum. There were no penalties or sanctions for non-compliance. Most other (non-LCC) airlines applied the IATA standards knowing that their connecting passengers would not be inconvenienced.

LCC's being point-to-point, non connecting airlines, applied their own standards.

A few years back the European Commission told IATA that standard setting for baggage was 'anti-competitive' and if they didn't stop doing so they would see IATA in court. When IATA agreed to stop the EC Commissioner at the time issued a press release telling the world that they had stopped this awful cartel ripping off passengers.

A few airlines (EK for example) now give a more generous baggage allowance than the previous IATA standards, but most now give less.

Isn't the EC wonderful!

[ExXB]

ExXB - this thread had replies as recent as a few days ago. I read through
and noticed you easyBashing just like you have been doing on more recent posts too. You obviously have an issue with easyJet, and LCCs in general. Are you too good them?

I get the impression that if they offered an EK First service for £30 one way you'd still complain and they would still not be up to your standards. A professional complainer methinks.

If its not baggage at the gate, it's the safety demo, the lack of change, "illegal" storage of bags. What next? The brand of milk jiggers they use??

I'm sorry you don't like my posts. But in the future please play the ball, not the player. I stand by my comments on the safety briefing though. I do think there is a lot of room for improvement there.

[Sober Lark]

I assume the max dimensions of permitted hand baggage are such that on an aircraft where all seats are occupied the baggage can be stored in the overhead bins without having to go under the seats.

In passing I've always found ExXB replies accurate and informative and I've benefitted from information that the poster has given freely. Leave off Spicejetter. Thanks.

[DaveReidUK]

I assume the max dimensions of permitted hand baggage are such that on an aircraft where all seats are occupied the baggage can be stored in the overhead bins without having to go under the seatsIn the case of most narrow-bodies, that assumption would be incorrect if every passenger chose to bring on board an IATA-standard carry-on bag.

[Sober Lark]

I didn't know that David.

Regarding the space under the seat in front of you. Has this been designed to accommodate the carry-on-baggage of the max dimensions / weight the airline stipulates?

[DaveReidUK]

Regarding the space under the seat in front of you. Has this been designed to accommodate the carry-on-baggage of the max dimensions / weight the airline stipulates?It depends. You might think that a standard triple economy seat - usually about 60" wide - would be able to accommodate 3 x standard IATA carry-on bags, each 18" wide, underneath. But you can almost guarantee that the position of the seat legs/tracks and/or the curvature of the sidewall mean that only one, or at best two bags can fit.

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/3/4/4/0049443.jpg

[peakcrew]

Roj approved said:
Jump on a set if scales, then weigh your carry on bags, then go to the airlines website and see what the allocation is for pax and bag. (84kg for my airline)

I confess I haven't seen that on any of the airline websites I've been on, and I'm fairly good at reading the conditions etc. Could anyone give more information on where this is likely to be found? I don't know anything about the poster, nor her/his veracity.

What does surprise me is the figure of 84kg. I am 6'6" (198cm) and the only way I'd get below 84kg is to have a leg amputated! Given that the average height in western countries is increasing, this figure seems very low (I'm not sure I know anyone who would be under 84kg) and needs reconsidering since, as pointed out, it is important in calculating fuel-loads.

[ExXB]

Deep in the past I'm sure the baggage wizards had a wonderful formula for calculating how much carry-on to expect. But in those days load factors above 70-80% were the exception rather than the rule and people were comfortable with less in the cabin. Anyone else remember the open hat-racks?

If there was any magic in calculating carry-on it was from a different era.

And many airlines use the overhead space for O2, blankets and pillows and crew stuff. This reduces the space available for passengers.

[superq7]

Thread drift. What bugs me on TUI flights is the safety briefing video starring children, or perhaps I'm getting old and grumpy.

[Sober Lark]

High load factors can only mean smaller carry on baggage in the future. When you think of it why pay for fuel to carry 10kg if you can stipulate a smaller 6kg. Samsonite would be delighted and the saving on fuel would be considerably more than doing away with window shades.

[paulc]

Until airlines can 100% guarentee that items placed in the hold are not going to be droped, lost, thrown, stolen and mistreated then there is no way I am going to put anything I carry on in a suitcase. Carry on is for items of value that passengers do not want to be apart from (in my case photographic equipment & laptop)

[deep_south]

I recently travelled LHR - FRA on the shiny new A380 that BA are "practising" with. I was in the Y cabin, in the K window seat.

BUT... half the "foot space" was taken up by the IFE box; there was another (slightly smaller) IFE box between H&J, and there as a "frame" limiting the foot space around H.

I couldn't get my feet into "my bit" of the foot space - so I ended up sitting "twisted". It was bad enough for a 1h 20m flight - I wouldn't like that on a 12 hour flight, and you would need a seat mate who was prepared to share their space.

There is *no way* that you could get three medium bags under the seats in front. Granted, the A380 does have a good amount of overhead storage, but if many people bring their 2 pieces of carry on, (bag + laptop sized) then there will be an almighty scrum to get it all on board safely...

[Maddie]

Can I ask a question please?

I flew on an almost full Dash 8 - 400 recently. By the time I boarded the overhead compartments were all full. I had to put my suitcase (which was within size) under the seat in front of me. It was too long for the space, so I had to sit with my feet on the protruding suitcase for take off.

I noticed too late (when the plane was taxiing) a row of 3 empty seats further back. Had I seen them earlier, I would have asked to move there, or at least put my suitcase under one of these seats.

After take-off I asked to move nearer to the front (not because of my suitcase but because the plane was very warm and there was some light turbulence and I felt quite claustraphobic). The crew were fine about this, so I moved forward minus my suitcase.

What would you have done were you me (apart from join the boarding queue earlier).

Thank you.

[Rwy in Sight]

I am not sure I understand the question but the way, I move once I board a Dash8 -400 or any other aircraft which is quit full, is to look around a few rows back and forth to see if an overhead compartment has space to put my carry on - if the space above my seat is full. Obviously it helps since I board either first of last.

And it often helps to ask the crew for "directions" where to stow the bags, but be careful because you can end with you bag gate-checked. If there is space they will point to it.

[RevMan2]

Simple solution.
Check the airline's website, if it says 55 x 40 x 23cm, maximum weight 8kg, that's your allowance.
Carry a tape measure just in case someone challenges you.
Where's the problem?

[Maddie]

Good evening,

Just to clarify, I did check my luggage in advance it did meet the criteria, I wasn't flying with Stobairt Air so the 7kg weight limit didn't apply.

[S.o.S.]

RevMan2 It seems to be that Maddie is asking a different question and your reply does not really fit.


Maddie, I've not been on a Dash8 for a while but it sounds like you did all that you could. In the past, I've had to put my cabin legal bag under the seat and it still projected as you describe. I think that asking to move - and leaving the bag - was the simplest, given that you were feeling uncomfortable. Perhaps if you ask the question in the Flybe thread in AA&R http://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/538075-flybe-7-a-12.html then you might find some cabin crew respond.

[mixture]

Carry on is for items of value that passengers do not want to be apart from (in my case photographic equipment & laptop)

(a) People are so precious about their electronic equipment...
Q. how do you think it gets to you in the first place ?
A. packaged in cardboard, with a bit of foam, stuck in the hold as cargo !

(b) I've got two words for you if you insist.... "F-Stop Bags"

They are all size compliant... BUT ... if you find yourself on the receiving end of a gate dragon and don't fancy an argument .... ICU out and with you ... bag with cables & gubbins in the hold.... 10 seconds, dragon sleighed and you can change your equipment-baby's diapers in-flight ! Wonderful bags !

Oh and one last word for you .... " I N S U R A N C E" ;)

[SamYeager]

@mixture



(a) People are so precious about their electronic equipment...
Q. how do you think it gets to you in the first place ?
A. packaged in cardboard, with a bit of foam, stuck in the hold as cargo !



As I'm sure you should be well aware the electronic equipment does not hold any personal/financial/commercial data during delivery so I can fully understand people's concern.

[mixture]

As I'm sure you should be well aware the electronic equipment does not hold any personal/financial/commercial data during delivery so I can fully understand people's concern.

I'm afraid I don't buy that nonsense counter-argument for one reason :

ENCRYPTION

Available on Mac, Windows and Linux, and has been for some time.

What happens if someone steals your laptop from your hotel room / from you at the airport ? How does that differ from the data risks of putting it in the hold ? Exactly ! It doesn't ! If its valuable... encrypt it and back it up !

The only people who treat their electronic equipment like babies and over-react to any dent or scratch are those who don't use their kit in a professional capacity (and indeed, probably haven't even bought professional kit and are fretting over some $300 piece of plastic).

How do you think the likes of the BBC/Reuters/CNN/[insert name of your choice] work when they take vast amounts of high-end kit out to remote locations for filming ? Do you honestly think they keep much (or any) of it attached to them like a baby-carrier ? No. It goes into well padded bags/cases and into the hold.

You don't necessarily need fancy Peli cases either if you feel it would clash with your sense of fashion .... decent suitcases such as Tumi ones are pretty solid and indestructible, in all my years of travel I've yet to see a baggage handler do any damage to a Tumi (infact I've yet to see much damage at all.... all I've seen are a few scuffs and marks on the fabric from the baggage handling machines).

I treat my equipment as it should be... like tools, not babies. And you know what, in all the years I've adopted the policy, its not been damaged once in transit.... infact the only occasion where damage occurred was when the equipment was at arms length from me and in-use .... didn't notice quick release was loose and camera plummeted to the ground.

[paulc]

Mixture,

to replace my 2 camera bodies & 2 lens would be over £5k (pro equipment) and still you wonder why I do not want it in the hold. Its all very well saying insurance but that does not get me replacement equipment immediately.

You menton the big news companies but the people who use that kit do not own in.

[ExXB]

Er, (from BA conditions of carriage)

8f) Fragile or perishable items must not be packed in baggage checked into the hold
You must not include in your checked baggage fragile or perishable items or items of special value such as:

money
jewellery
precious metals
computers
personal electronic devices
share certificates, bonds and other valuable documents
business documents or
passports and other identification documents.

Note that they don't say 'should not' they say 'must not'. You are not given a choice.

[iggie]

mixture

What is meant by 'ICU out and with you'?

[Mr Optimistic]

What's the big issue with checking in baggage? We are a long time dead, the odd 20 minutes isn't much of an issue. On business trips my personal productivity is so high that the company share price drops if I am seen to be inactive for half an hour.