When did the radio operator disappear?

[Peter47]

Can anyone tell me when roughly when long haul aircraft stopped carrying radio operators? Presumably this was related to advances in radio technology with "dial up" radios in the same was as INS replaced the navigator. What happened to radio officers, were they trained pilots like navigators or separate profession like flight engineers in piston days?

I seem to vaguely remember an RAF pilot in the early 70s telling me that he had flown an aircraft with a fixed crystal set which could only transmit on a single or a limited number of frequencies. A civilian ATCO had told him to go away and not come back until he had a proper radio.

[wrecker]

I remember on a trip to Moscow in the early 1970 working Velikiye Luki center on HF (AM) and having difficulty getting a position report across because of heavy QRM. He came back to me on CW so I replied in like manner. we were lucky we had the HF set at the back of the flight deck and it had a key socket.

[Spooky 2]

I flew a couple of ex KLM 1049H Connies back in 1966/67 they had radio operator stations in them but I have no idea when the actual RO dissapeared. Suspect that KLM was using then on routes to Indonesia and perhaps Africa.
The RO was spositioned righ behind the Capts seat while the Nav was located outside the cockpit and aft near the crew rest area.

[brakedwell]

Single Sideband HF radios arrived in the early sixties, making Radio Officers/Signallers redundant. The RAF Argosies were fitted with SSB when they entered service in 1962. The Britannia fleet HF radios were updated in 1966 and the air signallers were disestablished soon after.

[old,not bold]

......RAF pilot in the early 70s telling me that he had flown an aircraft with a fixed crystal set which could only transmit on a single or a limited number of frequencies. A civilian ATCO had told him to go away and not come back until he had a proper radio.

Mind you, that could have been the RAF Twin Pioneer pilot who flew my Prentice to South Africa from Sharjah in 1967. It had a 4 channel crystal VHF set mounted behind the pilot's seat. Adequate for normal training operations, perhaps, but on longer trips, eg Gatwick to Sharjah and on to Durban, there was a box of 70-odd crystals to cover all eventualities on route.

When ATC said, for example, "call Tower on xxx decimal x", but the frequency was unexpected and therefore not one of those set up for the sector, the pilot would reach behind the seat with the right hand while flying with the left, switch the radio power off, remove a redundant crystal by feel from its socket, replace it with the required crystal from the box, then unplug the antenna and replace it with a plug wired to a 12V light bulb (ie the 3ft piece of wire was soldered to the bulb terminals), switch the power on again, then press the PTT on the stick with the left hand and operate the antenna tuner on the set with the right until the bulb glowed, then put the antenna plug back, then press the PTT and call the station required. On a good day this would take about 2 minutes. In poor visibility and turbulent conditions it would take rather longer but this was offset by the fact that the aircraft flew quite slowly; on a long final approach one only needed 2 - 3 miles to "call Tower on xxx decimal x".

Nowadays, I understand, you simply rotate a knob, or even just enter it with a keypad, and the new frequency is displayed in figures on a little screen. Modern rubbish. Just more gizmos to go wrong.

[mcdhu]

Yes, it was the Collins 618T that did for the siggie. A few went on to pilot training!

Mcdhu

[TEEEJ]

Hi Wrecker,
Apologies if you have already seen the post but this might be of interest?

Russian Navy but probably one of the last air-to-ground / ground-to-air Morse networks still in regular daily use?

8816 16405 QTO (Russian Naval Aircraft Morse Code) by TOMTEEJ on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free (http://soundcloud.com/tomteej/8816-16405-qto-russian-naval)

A few more recordings of the Morse net at the following.

http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/477212-birth-square-search-x-q-code.html#post7117926

[alisoncc]

Russian Navy but probably one of the last air-to-ground / ground-to-air Morse networks still in regular daily use? Haven't listened to an NDB for an awfully long time, but they always transmitted their signature in morse code. Do they still? Probably NDB's have long gone, sad.

[TEEEJ]

alisoncc,

NDBs are still active.

Navaids in Australia (http://worldaerodata.com/nav/Australia.php)

World Aeronautical Database (http://worldaerodata.com/)

NDBs and other beacons are also monitored as a hobby.

ndblist : ndblist (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ndblist/)

The NDB List Information Page (http://www.ndblist.info/)

[sixtiesrelic]

Merpati had a radio operator in their domestic DC-3s in West Irian/ Papua/ Dutch New Guinea ... which ever you like to know it as.
The one I met was a runt by Indonsesian standards, so almost a Pygmy by ours. They needed to be, they were poked in a tiny space behind the hydraulic reservoir in the forward luggage locker and the company needed some room for the cargo there.

[VP8]

Still carry 2 radio operators on the AN124's today!! :ok: