Just out of interest, what does it take to renew a CPL if you lose your SEP (and have not flown for say just over the 2 yr threshold). Is it a case of a full CPL skill test (and expense) with an examiner or do you just need the same as under a PPL to renew SEP? Thanks

Don't get confused between licenses and ratings. A PPL/CPL doesn't get renewed as such by a flight test - once you have it, you keep it subject to validity every 5 years or so by paying the CAA a nice big fee.

Actually using your license to fly is dependant on having the correct ratings (and medical). So you need to renew or revalidate SEP, MEP, IR, FI etc. as and when required and each has differing timescales and requirements.

I don't believe there is any difference between a PPL holder and a CPL holder renewing an SEP.

DSB

To get your CPL re-issued you need a current JAA class one medical and a class rating (SEP or MEP) which has been current in the last 5 years. So for your first reissue, providing your CPL is still valid, you will have held an SEP in the last 5 years, so the only thing you will need to do is to renew your medical.

Linda

In JAA/EASA land: The renewal of an expired SEP rating is the same for the CPL as it is for the PPL. It can be done by any flight or class rating examiner, not just a CAA-nomiated CPL examiner, and can be scheduled by yourself, you don't have to go through the CAA as you had to do for the CPL skill test.

If the rating has not yet expired for 5 years, the examiner will just sign your ratings sheet and send a form to the CAA, you can fly straightaway; if it has expired for longer, the CAA has to send you a new ratings sheet, so you have to wait for it to arrive.

Training for this is "as required", basically up to you.

After EASA kicks in, there are mandatory re-training requirements which, if you talk to a sensible training organisation, translate into "training as required, with silly paperwork added".

Thanks all, that was as I thought. What got me rethinking is there are a lot of 'CPL' pilots out there who either aren't current or skills eroding so I was thinking there must be some retraining as License holders will effectively revert to PPL standard (particularly those doing crammer CPL's to tick boxes out in Florida and the like). The new EASA rules sound a little ominous however - any enlightenment as to whether this will be different for renewing CPL's vs PPL's or still concentrate on the SEP rating (or other) much appreciated.

Later editing as have just found the answer on the CAA website:

"Unlike JAR licences, EASA Part-FCL licences do not expire. With the 2012 amendment to the Air Navigation Order all UK licences will also be non-expiring. The validity of the licence will depend upon the holder having a valid medical certificate appropriate to the licence. The use of the licence privileges will depend upon the ratings in the licence and their currency.

Ratings on EASA Part-FCL licences are revalidated or renewed according to the requirements set out in Part-FCL. Ratings on UK licences that are the same as EASA ratings are subject to the Part-FCL revalidation/renewal requirements. The renewal/revalidation requirements for national ratings remain as currently and as notified by the CAA in the Air Navigation Order and CAP 804."

Sounds like an EASA CPL will be valid for life as long as you have valid medical and rating. So no fee to the CAA every 5 years - bonus!! Am I missing something as I've never benefitted from such changes before??

No, you haven't missed anything.

And under EASA, SEP renewal is still SEP renewal, regardless of whether it is attached to a PPL, CPL or ATPL.

The one thing that changes from JAR to EASA is that for any rating that has expired, an ATO needs to do an assessment and develop a training programme before you can take the renewal test.

If you have a sensible ATO, this should not be a problem [one flight to see where you are, and if ready, the test], but puts you a bit at the mercy because they need to give you a certificate that you have concluded the recommended training before you can get the lapsed rating back.

The one thing that changes from JAR to EASA is that for any rating that has expired, an ATO needs to do an assessment and develop a training programme before you can take the renewal test.

Does that mean that schools that stay as RFs until the last minute before becoming ATOs will not be able to train for rating renewals in the meantime?

I believe that both RFs and FTOs are deemed ATOs and have a few years to comply with the paperwork requirements, so for the moment they are fine. And I hope that there will be a solution for RFs. But I have not dug deeply into the fto regulation so might be wrong.

Former FTOs and TRTOs have, since 8 April 2012, been deemed to be ATOs and have until 7 April 2014 to become fully compliant with Part-ORA. RTFs have until 7 April 2015 to become ATOs and, until then, may continue to train for the PPL but not the LAPL.

Part-FCL states that the mandatory refresher training prior to renewal of an expired Class Rating must be completed 'at an ATO', which implies that it may not be done at a RTF but this should be confirmed with the Authority. Bear in mind also that Part-FCL is not implemented in the UK until at least 17 September 2012.