CAA Are they normally like this?

[syncro_single]

As an RAF HF Instructor I was keen to re-qualify for my CRMI qualification. After trying to find a company that I could use my Enhanced Learning Credits with I was informed that because I am ‘Non-civil’ it would not be possible, the following was quoted
“The CRM Advisory Panel, at its last meeting held in December 2008, reached an agreement that the CAA will no longer support CRM accreditation for non-civilian CRMIs i.e military personnel etc. With immediate effect, the administration of applications from non-civilians will stop. Non-civilians with existing CRMI authorities will continue to be able to exercise their privileges. However, because of the change in the CAA policy, their CRMI authorities will not be revalidated unless the individual instructor has qualified to teach civil CRM courses.”
So it seems that I am stuck between the ‘proverbial rock and a hard place’ I am potentially due to leave the RAF in 2 years and want to make my self employable in the HF market. Seems to be that the military is being discriminated against, any comments, and advice gratefully received.

[TurbineTooHot]

In my limited experience, the CAA seem to loath the military.

I don't know what drives this, can anyone shine a light on it?

[mad_jock]

Global Air Training - Aviation Training Courses (http://www.globalairtraining.com/aviation.htm)

This lot had quite a few mil types on my course and they say.

Ministry of Defence ELCAS

Global Air Training is an approved provider (Ref1713) for UK Ministry of Defence Enhanced Learning Credits ELCAS.

[Sir George Cayley]

If the CAA 'loathe' the Mil how come there are so many seconded into DAP?

SGC

[SASless]

The CAA does not loathe the Military.....any notion of that is pure conjecture.

However....The CAA does like to make things difficult for everyone.

You are not being picked upon...singled out...or in any way being given special treatment.

The question begged is "What difference in subject matter, standards, and course content is there between the RAF CRMI Course and the Approved CAA CRMI course?"

If the RAF would incorporate the CAA Approved material, curriculum, and Standards.....add in the RAF materials that is different....and undertake gaining CAA approval for their course....it would seem problem solved.

[wiggy]

I'm afraid SASless is correct, they (the CAA) can be gobsmackingly hard work, regardless of your background - they certainly don't discriminate between civvie and military.

Someone recently commented elsewhere on Pprune that the CAA's unofficial motto is:

"We're not happy until you're not happy".

Having been farked around right royally recently over what should have been the straightforward renewal of an ATPL I've held for over 20 years I'm inclined to agree.

[dallas]

The CAA has 2 roles: regulation and money-making. I initially wrote that they're a business, but that's not true as they're not overly fussed about the customer and gumf like deadlines. Self-regulating monopoly would be better.

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

Having taken a look at the CAA rules, I left the RAF and got FAA licences, in 1/2 the time and 1/4 the cost and 1/20 the aggro. Can I fly in UK airspace? Yes.

All the CAA achieves is significant losses to the UK economy. I presume this must be their mission statement.

[Rigga]

Correct - The differences between RAF courses and CAA courses is not the CAA's problem, it's the applicant's problem.

Secondary motto for the CAA:
"It's your problem not ours!"



Although I have to say that if you have all the right things in all the right places (i.e. You've done all the work) they're really quite good....

[Professor Plum]

So to cut a long story short, if you do the HFFC and the instructors course, you cannot convert these to Civvy qualifications, and you have to attend a civvy training course, such as Global Air Training, and gain the civvy CRMI tick, paid for by yourself, or perhaps learning credits (if eligible)?

Is that correct?

[Doctor Cruces]

When I was in the civil aviation industry, we used to call them the Campaign Against Aviation.
I thought that summed them up perfectly.

Doc C

[NutLoose]

In my limited experience, the CAA seem to loath the military.

That's totally untrue..... They loath everybody..... I used to go round to my local office and look about and imagine what parts of it I had paid for.

[Whopity]

Over the years the CAA has made numerous offers to grant licences, ratings and authorisations to military personnel based upon equivalence however; in most cases it has been the MOD that has rejected the offers, probably because they didn't want to make it too easy for people to leave. More recently, European directives have dictated what the CAA can and can't do giving then very little flexibility. Whilst the CAA charges for its services, it is not allowed to make a profit, other than a small percentage which goes back to Government.

If you think the UK CAA is bad, try dealing with a European one!

[Rigga]

Of the dozen or so "Competent Authorities" I've had dealings with, the one across the Irish Sea seemed to be most piccy. Mind, that was some years ago and they may have changed both of the staff since.


...All the way across the Irish Sea, that is...