View Full Version : ScotAirways Pulls Out of GLA; Concentrates on EDI-LCY
11th Jan 2002, 14:48
From today's Scotsman:
[quote]Stagecoach boss takes on BA
STAGECOACH tycoon Brian Souter is to go head to head with British Airways in the capital by launching a new 16 flights-a-day service between Edinburgh and London’s City airport.
ScotAirways is to pull out of Glasgow and concentrate all its resources on a new service aimed at the Edinburgh business market.
The Business Express concept will be launched this month after the company, part-owned by Stagecoach founder Brian Souter, concluded it could make more money by withdrawing from Glasgow.
The airline will charge around £140 for a single journey on its 31-seater turbo-prop Dornier 328 aircraft, although some flights will be available for £49 through an internet booking system.
Last night, Mr Souter said the decision had been driven by commercial reality and the realisation that there was a gap in the market for a fast commuter shuttle service.
He said: "Edinburgh is the right market for this product. It seems to us that Edinburgh is where the disposable income is, it’s where the business market is buoyant and in Glasgow, it is quite difficult to make that business product work. We’ve been doing Glasgow for two and a half years now and our trend in Glasgow has not been good."
He claimed ScotAirways has reported "phenomenal" business in the Edinburgh market, with year-on-year growth in excess of 120 per cent.
The company will take on British Airways by claiming it provides more flights each day between Edinburgh and London.
Mr Souter will claim, in a campaign expected to start next week, passengers could cut an hour or more off their travelling time because of reduced check-in times and less time spent boarding and disembarking from the smaller aircraft operating on the route.
He said the company believed it had identified a gap in the market between the large carriers such as British Airways and the budget operators.
This week, ScotAirways announced the suspension of its service between Aberdeen and London City airport, two months after taking the route over from British European.
The previous day, the airline had suspended flights between Inverness and London City after four months of operation.
Last night, Mr Souter said: "We’re pulling out of these places because we’ve not been finding the market has been coming through for this type of business"<hr></blockquote>
11th Jan 2002, 16:00
One wonders if any other routes are under threat
at GLA? Would AA for instance still be using
GLA if they operated the route from EDI?
12th Jan 2002, 04:23
One Thinks, Joe, that you and I have been done this route before.(Remember CO?)
The West of Scotland, and 'The Guvnor', knows this to be true: That, the market force exists in the West, where it doesn't in the East.
Now, I don't want to to start a slanging match about where is best, but let's face it, the majority of the population lives in West Central Scotland (Hello Mabel, luv ya!).
We should be thankful that carriers of the like of CO, AA, AC, etc still fly into Scotland, and not be pissed off about why they fly they GLA and not to EDI.
[ 12 January 2002: Message edited by: Blue Boy ]</p>
12th Jan 2002, 15:56
>>Now, I don't want to to start a slanging match about where is best, but let's face it, the majority of the population lives in West Central Scotland.<<
Slanging match Guvnor? You won't get one from
me. <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">
The majority of people live in West Central Scotland yes. But it seems that most visitors
and Scots alike prefer to fly EDI. :)
The proof is in the passenger figures. On the various routes that both airports compete over,
EDI is the more popular. <img src="tongue.gif" border="0">
I don't see why a daily transatlantic route from EDI should be any different. :)
Current growth rates suggest that EDI will be
Scotland's busiest airport circa 5 years.
Indeed,given independent owner at EDI, the airport
would be in the lead now. <img src="cool.gif" border="0">
12th Jan 2002, 17:20
Hey Blue Boy!
Just a thought; East Scotland or West Scotland - it's all the wrong side of the Border in any case!!!!
It's not just the Taff git on yer back, eh........!
14th Jan 2002, 00:29
'Blue Boy' you're spot on. The west coast does have the largest conubration (Greater Glasgow) & probably the biggest draw for North American tourists in the West Highland scenery & Golf Courses @<hidden> Troon, Turnberry, Loch Lomond etc & of course many more West Coasters immigrated to the US/Canada from the west coast than from the east coast hence AAL, COA ACA etc having a presence at GLA ( I believe COA are upgrading to a 767-400 from April & AAL are upgrading to a 767-300)but hopefully EDI does get a US flight in the future but not to the detriment of GLA or elsewhere.
A scenario could have been that say AAL moved to EDI & the pax didn't materialise so AAL then pulled the plug on Scotland so yes the Scots should be gratefull that AAL continue to return to GLA year after year & rumour has it they *may* go year round again this year <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
14th Jan 2002, 14:24
>>Blue Boy' you're spot on. The west coast does have the largest conubration (Greater Glasgow) &
probably the biggest draw for North American tourists in the West Highland scenery & Golf Courses@<hidden> Troon, Turnberry, Loch Lomond etc & of course many more West Coasters immigrated to the
US/Canada from the west coast than from the east coast hence AAL, COA ACA etc having a presence at GLA<<
Despite this, Edinburgh is the 2nd.largest tourist-visited city in the UK - after London?
The main reason for US airlines being based at GLA is because BAA 'transferred' them there after the
demise of PIK as Scotland's transatlantic gateway.
If West Central Scotland has a slight advantage in
population, why does EDI outperform GLA on the
routes it is allowed to compete over.? <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">
14th Jan 2002, 15:26
Come on Joe, you know that's not the case!
After PIK's status as the 'designated gateway' was removed, transatlantic operators could fly anywhere they wanted - GLA, EDI, ABZ, INV etc.
They chose GLA. Why? Because that's where the market is - not EDI.
(Much as it pains me to say that, originating from the Kingdom of Fife ... currently living in the uncivilised wilds of Ayrshire!)
Edinburgh remains the main domestic business market for a variety of reasons, prime amongst which is the concentration of financial services companies and Parliament.
As for tourism - you have the Festival, the Tattoo and of course Edinburgh's status as the Capital. Glasgow could do a lot more to raise its profile, and it's starting to do that.
I see though that Edinburgh's just added a new weapon to its armoury - 'brown cafes' as in Amsterdam where cannabis will be on open sale! Should be a winner!
15th Jan 2002, 19:49
>>They chose GLA. Why? Because that's where the market is - not EDI.<<
EDI has never been trialled with a daily cheduled USA flight. BAA have always directed airlines to their GLA 'branch'.
If an airline wishes to make political capital it should fly from Scotland's political capital.?
Plan flying some of your long-awaited L1101s from
accessible EDI instead of remote PIK Guv...you
know it makes sense. <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0"> :)
15th Jan 2002, 22:07
Joe, wake up and smell the coffee mate.
I'm sure, with you working in this industry, that you'll be aware that it's the Airlines who decide where they want to fly from, not the Airport operator.
16th Jan 2002, 18:34
>>I'm sure, with you working in this industry, that you'll be aware that it's the Airlines who decide where they want to fly from, not the Airport operator.<<
Normally I would agree with you Blue Boy. But we
are talking about two BAA-owned airports who are
actually in bed together instead of competing.
If EDI had an independent owner we might be witnessing transatlantic competition as we speak.
BAA are dragging their feet over THAT control tower and full length taxiways, I'm sure an
independent owner at EDI would have these
problems addressed by now.
Smell the coffee? All I can smell is a large putrid rat calling its-self Scottish Airports <img src="mad.gif" border="0">
3 Off The Tee
17th Jan 2002, 06:30
Hey Blue Boy
GLA all the way eh?. You patriotic thing you.
Like Seaton Approach, never heard of the place!
Keep smiling <img src="tongue.gif" border="0">
17th Jan 2002, 06:44
3 off the tee, seaton....
Thank you so much for your feedback. It's so nice that my colleagues from CBG & PLH feel inclined to comment.
Seaton, especially surpirsed to see your comments, considering your expertise at suckling! (Pity about everything else though...)
Blue Boy and Guv, you are both wrong. When the transatlantic gateway status was removed from PIK, it was a political decision to move that traffic to GLA, EDI did not get approval until a few years later. Those are the facts folks!
PS I prefer GLA though, and as an east coaster that really hurts...
18th Jan 2002, 01:17
Back in your cage, Blue Boy!
On a serious note, it's a crying shame about SAY pulling out of GLA, great bunch of guys and gals up there, but the loads were never really Earth-shattering, and if the Operation ever went tits-up, it was always GLA that would suffer, in order to protect the more lucrative EDI and DND routes.
EDI is now going up to 11 flights to LCY per day, and DND continues to go from strength to strength.
Still got a bottle of Don Perignon chilling in my fridge for the first SAY-jock to make it out here onto one of EK's shiny new aircraft!
Best of British to all at ScotAirways (Aircrew, that is, not Management, nor that trout from Rostering - maybe you should come out here to learn a thing or two.....).
18th Jan 2002, 02:13
I still stick with my original point. Whether it was political or not, the Airlines will fly to wherever they want to. It is as simple as that.
Seaton, I hope you don't open the DP after 0100, you might get a nosebleed. You (still)owe me a Bullfrog, BTW.
Blue Boy, I thought my answer was clear enough, you saying political or not makes no difference, thats what happened back then. These days it is different, but the point raised was why GLA got a foothold in the tranatlantic traffic, and thats how they did it, the airlines had NO say in the matter!
18th Jan 2002, 02:26
Oh come on Meeb,
Look bak at my original posts on this subject, and as ' The Guvnor' agrees, The market is in the West.
Like it or not, that's the way it is. No politics. Maybe with the BAA being a business they saw the potential.....
I do not dispute that at all Blue Boy, I am just pointing out the way it happened in the dim distant past. It is quite well known that BAA lobbied the government of the day to allow only GLA gateway status (out of the 3 BAA airports), it took quite a few years for them to grant the same to EDI.
18th Jan 2002, 02:41
Why though, Meeb.
Remember, BAA (or it's forerunner) was 'in the dim distant past' a government organisation.
Why should the government not make money out of something?
GLA is where the market is, and therefore the load factors! Nothing will ever change that, especially jealousy.
By that time BAA was a private company. I do not think jealousy has anything to do with it, we are a bit more grown up than that. <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">
18th Jan 2002, 03:04
Of course we are. However, market forces will never change.
The biggest conurbation in Scotland is Greater Glasgow and most of the population remains in the west.
Let's be real here, mate. If carriers like CO, AA, AC, or anyone else, found the market to fly Transatlantic from EDI, why do they not do it?. And, this question is as valid now as it was pre September 11th. (And stop the monopoly argument)