Bomber Command Memorial

[Samuel]

For the dedication of this magnificent memorial in June, the RNZAF is to fly 50 Kiwi Bomber Command veterans to the event in a B757 . There were some 1800 plus Kiwis died in Bomber Command.

For once a Government gets it right!

[Tankertrashnav]

Well done the NZ government.

What do reckon on the chance of any veteran in the UK getting so much as a rail ticket to attend the ceremony?

I'm not optimistic :(

[John Eacott]

Meanwhile the Australian gummint is funding six veterans, and nothing toward carers to look after them :(

Sad priorities from our 'leaders' :rolleyes:

[Samuel]

The NZ flight will include air force care-givers.

[Not Long Here]

Samuel,

A rather selective view from you given the publicity around this story:

New Zealand Drops Veteran From Bomber Command Memorial... | Stuff.co.nz (http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/6723939/New-Zealand-drops-veteran-from-trip)

[Willi B]

John

Totally agree. What passes for Government here recently paid for some 130 pubic serpents to travel business class to Copenhagen for a Climate Change Convention, where they achieved the square root of 5/8's of SFA; yet those who have made a much greater contribution to the Country are treated so miserably.

And would David Cameron or Theresa May please direct the 'ethnic', unshaven and dischevelled looking immigration staff at Heathrow who process non EU arrivals, not to demand from our veterans the reasons for travel, length of stay in the UK, an assurance of not wishing to work while in country and written evidence of their ability to support themselves financially while in the UK.

[Samuel]

Not Long Here

Not selective at all, but factual! The NZ Veterans Affairs Dept does not now and never has had responsibility to provide for servicemen from other countries, in his case that being the UK as he served in the RAF and not the RNZAF. He is not therefore a RNZAF veteran, which is the qualifying status! The qualification for the assistance given was for those RNZAF Veterans of Bomber Command.

There are possibly thousands of ex-UK service veterans who arrived in NZ post war and we would have need a fleet of aircraft to take them. I gather that , even in the UK, the government has made no offers to assist such veterans.

Perhaps it should also be mentioned that the gentleman you refer to will be going due to the generosity of the good folk of Nelson who have paid for his air fare! He declined accommodation costs because he has relatives to visit.The report you quote was out of date the very next day.


"Nelson pensioner and former Royal Air Force fighter pilot John Beeching is still in a tailspin over the level of public support for his wish to get to England in June for a memorial service.Mr Beeching, 88, initially wanted to join the New Zealand delegation as one of the few surviving ex-Bomber Command members, to be part of a dedication and unveiling of the Bomber Command Memorial in London.He learned recently he could not be considered in the official New Zealand veteran delegation because he did not belong to the Royal New Zealand Air Force when serving as part of the Bomber Command.

A storm of publicity this week has generated a huge public response with offers of donations to get Mr Beeching to London. GJ Gardner Homes announced it would provide up to $10,000 to get him and his wife, Wendy, to the ceremony, and the Cawthron Institute, where Mr Beeching works as a handyman has also offered a generous level of support."I'm still completely shattered by all this. It's absolutely unbelievable, and there's no question I'm going to that ceremony."

Nelson theatre company director TJ Ramsay, who became aware of Mr Beeching's situation through her work with him on a forthcoming Lest We Forget commemoration event, is now helping to manage the process to get Mr Beeching to London".

[Scuttled]

And that is even more heart warming than the excellent service provided to retired RNZAF personnel by their government.

BZ Nelson residents.

[Samuel]

I couldn't help but note, just in passing and by way of comparison, that the standard of written English in the Nelson Mail, a small provincial town newspaper far exceeds that of the Daily Mail!:D:)

[herkman]

I stand all amazed at the lack of action, taken by our weak kneed government who can always find money for their own pet interests.

Who have the hide to come to veterans funerals and cry crocodile tears for our fallen. Refer to us as the countries treasures and refer to us as warriors.

Then go home and forget us till their next public relations exercise, and the act starts all over again.

Their lack of action and compassion shows how little they understand what such a trip would mean to those left. A last chance to meet old RAF mates, a last chance to say goodbye, a last chance to walk their old bases and perhaps a chance to meet some of their ladies.

I personally am ashamed of their lack of action, again bought to us by the same labour party who when, as they are now doing, spent all our reserves and stole, from the services super fund millions of dollars to keep their criminal spending spree on the roll, and now will not even index the super payments to the correct level.

I am also disappointed that QANTAS who has taken so many pilots and Flight engineers from the RAAF has made no move to take a goodly number back to the UK for one last ride.

The RAAF has tankers or C17's that could move perhaps all those well enough, and the hours and experience could be well used. They have the medical staff to keep the guys safe on the way, all good efforts to say thanks.

I am greatly saddened by the events and it only goes to show what a selfish bunch we have running this country.

HOW QUICKLY SOME FORGET.

I am also mindful of those ladies who lost their men, and have gone through life not knowing what happened to their men, they have not been considered.

Sad times I am afraid but made even sadder by the lack of empathy by some.

Regards

Col

[500N]

herkman

I agree, very well put.

The ADF, I think mostly the Army but happy to be corrected
took some old diggers back to France a few years ago.
Not sure of the details.

It makes a big contrast to how the French seem not to have
forgotten lost souls from other countries.

[Not Long Here]

Samuel,

Thanks for the update.

[bakseetblatherer]

One of our family friends, who can still regale us with tales of his time in Bomber Command as a pilot, is one of the 50. Cracking tales too, like how he arranged the tactical posting of an Air Engineer who was left/right dyslexic!

[teeteringhead]

And IIRC in both World Wars Kiwis lost the highest proportion of personnel to their population of any allied country ....

BZ NZ ;)

[Samuel]

True. Among the 55,00 dead in Bomber Command were 1850 Kiwis, which represented one in three of all those from NZ that served.All were volunteers.

[Wensleydale]

Each one, man by man, has won imperishable praise. Each has gained a glorious grave, not that sepulchre of earth within they lie, but the living tomb of everlasting remembrance wherein glory is enshrined, remembrance that will live on the lips that will blossom in the deeds of their countrymen the world over.

For the whole world is the sepulchre of heroes, monuments may rise and tablets be set up to them in their own land, but on far-off shores there is an abiding memorial that no pen, or chisel has traced, it is graven not in stone or brass, but in the living hearts of humanity.

Take these men as your example. Like them, remember that posterity can only be for the free, that freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it.

Pericles: 425 BC.

[Samuel]

It looks as the Australian Government has had a change of heart!

Media Release - VA028 - BOMBER COMMAND DEDICATION FUNDING ANNOUNCED (http://minister.dva.gov.au/media_releases/2012/apr/va028.htm)

[TBM-Legend]

The Red Crested Bitch cabs it around the globe in an 'commonwealth BBJ"...and couldn't give a continental about the $$$$$$$$$$$$$,

The Kiwis put on a B757 to take their veterans and we-do basically f$%kall.

What has this country come too? Thousands gave their all as young chaps for their service to Bomber Command and all else.

A KC-30 with a couple of hundred brave chaps and carers does nothing to hurt little Wayne's budget.

Please write your member or the PM to get this fixed...

[Willi B]

TBM-Legend

Totally agree. $3K for a return trip to the UK is an absolute disgrace. Why doesn't the PM travel to Gallipoli next week on a $3K airfare with 'the first bloke' and offer up the BBJ for Vets.

[500N]

Or even better, why didn't someone think laterally and combine the flight
of both the NZ and Aussie vets and doing it together.

Even the pollies can get some spin on it with being Green and saving
both money and fuel.

I am sure Qantas or Air NZ would have chartered / provided a plane
- or we could have used one of the RAAF VIP jets as suggested above.


and "six and eight Australian Bomber Command veterans".
Pretty piss poor all around IMHO. Is that all we can afford ?

[Willi B]

Letter below in today's Canberra Times (written in response to a letter published earlier this week)

Don Malcolmson's letter (April 18) makes me sad.

I am the descendent of two members of Bomber Command. My Australian father was a navigator/bomb-aimer of Lancasters and my mother a proud Scottish ordnance deliverer-ambulance driver of Bomber Command. Their generation served, accepted the risks and asked for nothing in return.

They married just after Victory in Europe day and settled in Australia, started their lives together and raised four children. Both are now departed.

It saddens me that if they were still alive they would read a letter such as Malcolmson's.

In his later years, my father sought health support for the damage his body and mind had suffered and endured. His acknowledged hearing loss, among his other disabilities, was questioned by a naive assessor when he was challenged as to why he had not worn his ear protection during his flights over Europe.

It is just as naive, but more insulting, that we can now only support the reunion of six surviving members of Bomber Command without carers for the unveiling of a Bomber Command Memorial in London.

It is a reflection on us all that, given the outrageous perks of office and the largesse that politicians, public servants and private enterprise bestow on themselves, that we treat veterans this way. Malcolmson's recount of the terrible losses and risks faced by these men and women supports the case for assistance.

The Australian people are not that selfish or thankless that they would not support these remaining veterans and their carers. Regrettably, our governments and public servant advisers appear blind to these sacrifices and the needs of these veterans.

If our country is so poor, then let's just ask for this horrendous sacrifice:

■ Every member of Parliament and equivalent in the private sector give up one study tour or conference.

■ Every public servant or business executive who is entitled to first-class or business travel give up one outwards privileged journey and travel economy.

If that couldn't pay for this attendance, I would be stunned.

There are many other ridiculous perks of office that are way outside the grasp of ordinary Australians that could be traded in to pay for these men and women to be there for this dedication.

No sacrifice could be greater than what these brave Australians did for us.

I hope Warren Snowden and his entourage read this and feel some remorse as they tuck into the pointy end nibblies on the way to Europe - Media Release - VA029 (http://minister.dva.gov.au/media_releases/2012/apr/va029.htm) -

And Julia Gillard's conscience similarly pricks her as she settles into the 34 SQN VIP aircraft's double bed en route to Gallipoli next week

[Willi B]

Does anyone know of developments (if any)?

[Willi B]

Seems the Minister has had a change of heart:

Saturday, 12 May 2012 VA040

INCREASED SUPPORT FOR BOMBER COMMAND VETERANS

Minister for Veterans’ Affairs Warren Snowdon today announced additional support to help more veterans get to London for the dedication of the Bomber Command Memorial on 28 June.

Mr Snowdon said the Department of Veterans’ Affairs had undertaken a nomination process for representatives from the Bomber Command veteran community to participate in a commemorative mission to attend the dedication in London.

“The significance of this occasion and the strength of the response from the veteran community has made it clear the usual parameters for a commemorative mission were not going to be sufficient for this occasion,” he said.

“I am pleased to announce the Government will now help more Bomber Command veterans to get to London.”

The eight places originally announced for the official mission party will now be increased to 30 places. A dedicated team including doctors, nurses and RAAF personnel will support the mission.

Further support, including a travel subsidy of $5,000 and assistance to participate in Australian commemorative services, will also be provided for all other Bomber Command veterans who travel independently to attend the dedication.

“Veterans can still apply for a grant facilitated through the RAAF Association to help them get to London,”Mr Snowdon said.

“The Department of Veterans’ Affairs is working closely with the Bomber Command Association and the RAAF Association to ensure veterans who are not part of the official mission party receive the advice they need to make their own arrangements to get to London.

“I look forward to announcing the members of the official mission party in the coming weeks and encourage Bomber Command veterans who have not yet nominated for a grant to contact the RAAF Association.”

Some 10,000 Australians airmen served with the Royal Air Force’s Bomber Command during the Second World War. Of these almost 3500 were killed in action and some 650 died in training accidents in the United Kingdom – making the bombing campaign against Germany and Italy Australia’s costliest campaign of the Second World War.

Media inquiries: Minister Snowdon: Lidija Ivanovski orMarcus Butler 02 6277 7820 or 0407108 935 / 0417 917 796

[Momoe]

It would be interesting to see by how much these 30 places are over-subscribed?

They should actually read their own press statement, 10,000 served of which, 4,150 died in service making this Australia's costliest commitment to the war.

Not even matching the Kiwi's 50 is a bloody embarassment, great people and country with a fairly savvy government that needs to learn to look back occasionally.