IAG BMI

[LGWFLYR]

The final EC decision on the IAG & BMI takover due today at 1800 UK time.

[martin102]

merger cleared according to Bbc news

[1234567]

Latest from WPS:

Dear colleagues,



I am pleased to advise you that the EU Competition Authority has today approved the sale of bmi to IAG. This is one of the major pre-requisites of the transaction and will enable the completion of the purchase to take place.



Today's successful outcome is the result of months of hard work. I would personally like to thank those who contributed to the process and to all of you for continuing to provide a safe and customer focused operation. As you know, a completion of the sale to IAG is regarded as fundamental to the future of our business, so today’s news signifies an important milestone for bmi.



In terms of next steps, we will work with Lufthansa and IAG to fulfil all the necessary pre-requisites of the sale and we are now working towards a completion date of around 20th April. From this date IAG will be our new owners and we would no longer be part of the Lufthansa Group. As previously communicated, we will continue to operate our summer 2012 schedule as planned.



We know that you are waiting for more information regarding integration plans and what these plans will mean for you. The integration roadmap is being finalised and it will be shared with you during the consultation process which will start shortly. Our business will undergo major changes during the integration process and this is necessary in order to achieve the synergies needed to make the business viable.



With respect to bmi Regional and bmibaby, both businesses have attracted interest from potential buyers and discussions continue. For both airlines, the sales efforts will continue and the summer schedule will operate as currently planned. If the airlines become part of the IAG transaction there are no plans to integrate them into BA.



We recognise that throughout this process you will have lots of questions, so we will ensure that we provide regular updates to you as and when new information becomes available. You can continue to contact the **** email address with any queries you may have.



Until the date of completion, please be mindful that there is still some information that we are unable to discuss with BA. We will circulate guidelines to the senior management team so please speak to your manager for guidance.



With best regards,



Wolfgang Prock-Schauer

[Max Angle]

Mergers: Commission approves acquisition of British Midlands (bmi) by IAG subject to conditions

Brussels, 30 March 2012 - The European Commission has cleared under the EU Merger Regulation the proposed acquisition of the UK airline British Midlands Limited (bmi), by the International Consolidated Airlines Group (IAG), the holding company of British Airways and Iberia. The decision is conditional upon the release of 14 daily slot pairs at London Heathrow in order to facilitate new entry, and upon IAG's commitment to carry connecting passengers to feed the long-haul flights of competing airlines out of London Heathrow. In light of these commitments, the Commission concluded that the transaction would not raise competition concerns.

Commission Vice President in charge of competition policy Joaquín Almunia said: "The Commission could clear this transaction in the first phase given the commitments package offered by IAG which addresses the competition concerns we identified. The commitments package includes an appropriate number of very sought-after slots at London Heathrow as well as far-reaching feeder arrangements as regards connecting passengers. We are therefore satisfied that the competitive dynamics will be maintained so as to ensure choice and quality of air services for passengers."

The Commission’s investigation found that the transaction, as initially notified, would have led to high market shares and even monopolies on a number of domestic, European and international routes out of London Heathrow airport. The Commission also analysed whether there was a risk that IAG would prevent passengers from connecting on long-haul flights operated by competing airlines out of London Heathrow.

During the first-phase review, IAG submitted commitments to release 12 daily slot pairs at London Heathrow which could be used on the specific routes of concern, including the UK domestic routes, as well as on other European routes. In addition, two Heathrow daily slot pairs will be leased to Transaero for use on flights to Moscow. These slots and other incentives such as the acquisition of grandfathering rights after a certain period of time should facilitate new entry. Furthermore, IAG committed to entering into special agreements with competing airlines which operate long haul flights out of London Heathrow to provide these airlines with connecting passengers, including from UK domestic routes and other European routes. Passengers will therefore continue to have a choice to use other airlines than IAG when connecting at London Heathrow.

These commitments adequately address all competition concerns identified by the Commission. The Commission therefore concluded that the proposed transaction would not significantly impede effective competition in the European Economic Area (EEA) or a substantial part of it.

The transaction was notified to the Commission on 10 February 2012.

Companies and products

The undertaking International Consolidated Airlines Group ("IAG" - United Kingdom) is the holding company of both BA and Iberia Líneas Aéreas de España, S.A. bmi is currently owned by Deutsche Lufthansa AG.

Both IAG and bmi provide air transport for passengers, air transport for cargo, airport ground handling services and maintenance, repair and overhaul services.

Merger control rules and procedures

The Commission has the duty to assess mergers and acquisitions involving companies with a turnover above certain thresholds (see Article 1 of the Merger Regulation) and to prevent concentrations that would significantly impede effective competition in the EEA or any substantial part of it.

The vast majority of mergers do not pose competition problems and are cleared after a routine review. From the moment a transaction is notified, the Commission generally has a total of 25 working days to decide whether to grant approval (Phase I) or to start an in-depth investigation (Phase II).

A non-confidential version of today's decision will be available at:

Europa - European Commission - Competition - Mergers - Official Journal (http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade) ... e=2_M_6447

[xray one]

Toothless :=

How much will it now cost to fly to those only served by BA...i guess there won't be many future sales :ugh:

[Alan Partridge!]

What a joke. 14 slot pairs. The EU should be ashamed. I'm guessing lots of back handers have been involved. Sad day for British public.

[LiveryMan]

Best outcome in my humble opinion.

I'm fairly certain Branson/Virgin would have raped BMI for their LHR slots and shut the airline down if they'd got their fingers on them.
LH would have just shut the airline down and sold the slots if the sale was blocked.

This way, BMI will most likely be absorbed into BA and fewer jobs will be lost.

Still, shame to see BMI go.

[gas path]

The next target is already in the sights!:E
And look out for a change of name on the BMI hangar it may not be BA!

[overstress]

gaspath, that is too cryptic for me. And I do the hard crosswords. :confused: Give us a clue?

To those wagging fingers above, how much competition on those routes would there have been if BMI had been allowed to go bust? err - the same as there will be now. :ugh:

Can we look forward to the startup of a shorthaul VS operation, say, LHR-ABZ as their boss seems so keen on competition?

[Doug E Style]

Now, will all those parties who want to operate domestic routes into Heathrow please form an orderly queue.....

The name on the hangar? My money's on Lufthansa Technik.

[bvcu]

Why would that be doug ? After all , who is lined up to handle LH engineering support at lhr ? the clue is in a teacup.....

[Human Factor]

What a joke. 14 slot pairs. The EU should be ashamed. I'm guessing lots of back handers have been involved. Sad day for British public.

Why?

If IAG had been required to give more than 14 slot pairs, they would have pulled out of the deal and Lufthansa would have allowed BMI to fold - to all intents and purposes tonight, with the associated job losses and all round grief, which has thankfully been avoided.

Yes, their slots may well have been distributed elsewhere but it would have resulted in IAG having a monopoly on a number of routes simply because no one else would or could fly them. As for SRB taking on some of the extra slots, he can't acquire new longhaul jets any quicker than anyone else so likely as not wouldn't be able to operate them anyway - and that's assuming he has the money, which I doubt. As always, lots of noise and not a lot else.

[Hussar 54]

Was there ever any doubt if Lufthansa are involved ??

Let's see.....

You wanna buy Swiss ?? No problem....

You wanna buy Austrian ?? No problem...

You wanna buy Luxair ?? No problem....

You wanna buy BMI ?? No problem....

You wanna buy Germanwings ?? No problem....

You wanna buy SN Brussels ?? No problem....

Now you wanna sell BMI to IAG ?? No problem....

The only thing to wonder about is whether IAG would have been allowed to buy BMI if it had not already been owned by Lufthansa....

[willisstorm4]

These airlines are obviously key players in opposing alliances, does anyone know what kind of implications this will have on the acquisition?

[Count von Altibar]

That's a very good point Hussar 54, the Lufthansa peeps obviously have a lot of sway with the EU regulator, what a corrupt world.

[ScotPilot]

Remember the EU Regulator ONLY had to consider where the sale might impact on competition. The hard reality that the public fail to recognise time and time again is that NO airline can make money operating domestic services out of LHR. Not BA, not bmi and most certainly not VS. RB will have to put his money where his mouth is now or forever hold is silence. The sale INCREASES competition at LHR to the far east. A little but significant point which most seem to miss.

If bmi had gone bust the slots would have been lost and there would have been a far bigger impact on competition between Scotland and Heathrow. Thank god it did not.

[Midland 331]

A sad day.

[NutLoose]

You wanna buy BMI ?? No problem

More like, we have you over a barrel, cough up..

Thought they were bound by contract to buy it, even if not wanted.

[Hussar 54]

SCOTTIE & NUTLOOSE....

You're correct, of course....

Although the same EU ( totally unbiased, of course ) authorities seem to belive that there is adequate competition between Frankfurt and...oh, let's think....Zurich, Geneva, Vienna, Linz, Luxemburg, Brussels....And probably others that I can't think of just now, because slots at Frankfurt are just as difficult and expensive to acquire as at Heathrow....

I think the point that I was trying to make, but re-reading my post this afternoon, didn't make it as clear as I was thinking when I posted, is that I'm sure that Lufthansa's desire to sell BMI made it an awful lot easier for IAG to complete a deal rather than if IAG had wanted to buy BMI directly from Bishop a couple of years ago when Lufthansa first did the deal with him, as Lufthansa seem to have very good friends in much higher places inside the EU than just about any other European airline....

[merlinxx]

Do you want to be in a job ? do you want to them to be in a job ? You want one or the other:ugh: Tis peoples lives here Members:mad:

[Flypuppy]

I'm sure that Lufthansa's desire to sell BMI made it an awful lot easier for IAG to complete a deal rather than if IAG had wanted to buy BMI directly from Bishop a couple of years ago when Lufthansa first did the deal with him

The deal for DLH to take control of BMI was done more than 10 years ago, and there were no competition issues with a German company buying a UK company. It is slightly different with a UK company buying a UK and the loss of competition on certain routes. The Scottish Government had valid concerns about the number of services from Heathrow to Scotland and the rise of fares where no competitor exists. Virgin's concerns were purely of self interest.

It should be remembered that Lufthansa did all they could to wriggle out of the deal with Bishop and took the case to the High Court, where they managed to reduce the final price from 450million to 340 million. SAS then forced them into buying their shareholding. All in all BMI has been a hugely expensive exercise for Lufthansa costing them over a Billion euros in 3 years. They just wanted out as quickly as possible and there was only one party that had the money and wherewithal to take on Mainline.

The human cost of this is that a very large number of people will be losing their jobs as BMI is integrated into BA. We still have no clear picture as to what is happening with Baby and Regional, maybe next week will bring some concrete information but I wont be holding my breath...

[Hussar 54]

A few years ago - my apologies, I didn't realise that it is now ten years ago since the original deal....

And just to be clear - I'm genuinely glad and happy that BA's intervention will save jobs because like lots of us here, I've been on the receiving end myself in the past, and huge sympathies for those BMI people who don't get lucky....

Those who care to search through my profile will see my own concerns over Lufthansa's monopoly, and obvious lack of EU interest over these particular competition issues, have been regularly stated over the past three years or four years....

[fmgc]

Virgin desperately need a short haul feeder so they can then market outside of the London area and into Europe.

If I was RB I would look at setting up a Low Cost(ish) A320 carrier out of LHR to Scotland and European Capital cities.

What are the implications of this now for Baby and BMI Regional?

[Yellow Sun]

Low Cost(ish) A320 carrier out of LHR

Sorry fmcg but that's a real contradiction in terms, in fact the route to perdition.

YS

[The Ancient Geek]

Virgin desperately need a short haul feeder so they can then market outside of the London area and into Europe.




It would make more sense to operated the long haul out of AMS which already has excellent feeder services from regional airports and also has less slot restrictions than LHR.
A short haul feeder into LGW would be possible but expensive to set up and demand may be limited.

[Granite City Express]

Regional & Baby to be brought into the bigger IAG deal (assume the Baby discount applies and that Regional is a freebie), neither to be integrated into BA at all, and then sold off or shut down. I guess that the unions and management will start the 90 consultation period very soon after the 20th of April.

Anyone know if Granite are still looking to buy?

[fmgc]

Sorry fmcg but that's a real contradiction in terms, in fact the route to perdition.

Why? And what I mean by Low Cost I mean as a separate company with lower DOCs.

It would make more sense to operated the long haul out of AMS which already has excellent feeder services from regional airports and also has less slot restrictions than LHR.

True but what they really need is a feed into LHR with bags checked in the whole way through.

Setting up in AMS opens up a small market for them, feeding into LHR opens up a massive market for them.

[The Cleaner]

@Granite City Express.
Regarding Baby and Regional, do you know this or just your opinion????

[Granite City Express]

Second hand news, from a management bod who had a briefing this morning.

[Say again s l o w l y]

GCE is correct. Baby and Regional are to be part of the deal with IAG. They will not be integrated into BA and will be sold off if possible.

I very much doubt whether Granite would buy Regional now. They've had virtually an 8 month run at it so far and haven't managed to raise the required capital to buy it and as we all know, buying it is one thing, having the cash to carry it on a completely different matter.

Hopefully there will be some others willing to purchase it.

As for Baby, I'm not sure that this changes anything, just that the seller is now IAG not Lufthansa. Hopefully the interested party is still interested.

[Yellow Sun]

Quote:
Sorry fmcg but that's a real contradiction in terms, in fact the route to perdition.
Why? And what I mean by Low Cost I mean as a separate company with lower DOCs.

OK, if you could explain how to lower the DOCs operating in and out of LHR I am sure that everyone would like to know. I should also be very curious as to why no one has done it already?

YS

[Sygyzy]

Also try turning an aircraft around in 25 minutes at LHR. You'd still be waitng for the bus(es) for your arrival pax let alone the departing Pax. What about those taxy times (on another thread). Why not have a stand alone terminal whilst we're about it. To be ready for THIS summer's rush.

I don't think so somehow.

S

[lamina]

Prediction time-

Granite to get funding, as there are some LHR slots needing an airline!

Based on no knowledge, but stranger things have happened.

[Say again s l o w l y]

Operating Emb 145's into LHR is commercial suicide. bmi have already proved that... So the reality of a small business being able to absorb those sort of losses just doesn't make sense to me.

I might be wrong, but unless Granite refleeted with bigger aircraft asap, then I don't see how they'd make it pay. I doubt whether Virgin would cover the cost for them.

Refleeting isn't exactly the cheapest thing in the world.

[Say again s l o w l y]

The accounting system and the way the regional aircraft were contracted in, have absolutely nothing to do with how a stand-alone operation would work in the future.

Those aircraft helped the bmi group to the losses that have been achieved more than they helped regional to a profit.

[Flypuppy]

Operating 50 seat aircraft into Heathrow is a non-starter. You need a minimum of 100 seats and connecting services to make a service viable.

I understand that rumours of Granite's demise may be greatly exaggerated :ok:

[fmgc]

Also try turning an aircraft around in 25 minutes at LHR. You'd still be waitng for the bus(es) for your arrival pax let alone the departing Pax. What about those taxy times (on another thread). Why not have a stand alone terminal whilst we're about it. To be ready for THIS summer's rush.

OK, if you could explain how to lower the DOCs operating in and out of LHR I am sure that everyone would like to know. I should also be very curious as to why no one has done it already?

What I mean by this is not the same model as EZY or FR. I have not made myself very clear.

For a start the short haul operation I would imagine should be a separate business with different contracts to mainline VS. They will need to operate from the same Terminal so as to be a proper feeder system.

Branson has wanted this for years and I would imagine that he will not give up. Buying the Scotland slots would be a very good start. Then from there expand the operation across Europe.

I should also be very curious as to why no one has done it already

What other Longhaul based UK operator needs a feeder airline? VS is the only one!

[ScotPilot]

You've got to remember that LHR, just like any other airport, is a shopping center with a few runways attached. The BAA do not want little aeroplanes in LHR. Look at an A380 next to an EMB 145 on the ground and you will see what I mean. They take up roughly the same 'space and time' on the airfield (within reason) but they have massive differences in terms of revenue for the airport operator. They have been trying for years to price small aeroplanes out of the airport. They even charge them all the same landing fees. You can't get enough people on a 'small' aeroplane and get enough from each seat after deduction of charges to make a profit. No one can and Virgin will not be able to either.

Getting BA to hand back slots to protect services to Scotland was a big mistake. A better outcome would have been to get BA to protect all the slots and maintain the same number of seats. As has been pointed out somewhere else if the slots don't get used they will probably go back to BA who will then have no obligation to operate the service. Either way BA are going to win.

[Van G]

Fly puppy - Spill the beans. What have you heard RE granite?

[Lord Bracken]

Mainly down to the egos of their founders but VS and Bmi missed a golden opportunity about 10 years ago to join forces to challenge BA. That chance is gone and there won't be another. Branson operating flights to the North is just hot air...there'll be pigs flying over LHR before a VS A320 to EDI...

[itwasme]

How about this...

Beardy contracts another carrier to operate some 100+ seater on a trial basis to feed his operation, if it works out he keeps it going, maybe buys his own equipment, if not he has grandfather rights to use the slots for something else...

It's not clear in he EU press release - do these slots have to be paid for or are they free to anyone wanting to operate the routes? The full judgement doesn't seem to be on the site yet.

[Jonty]

How about a 145 into Northolt? Its only a short bus ride then to LHR. And you could turn the aircraft round in 20 mins.

No..... I'll get my coat.

[ara01jbb]

How about a 145 into Northolt? Its only a short bus ride then to LHR. And you could turn the aircraft round in 20 mins.

No..... I'll get my coat.

If we lived in the sort of country with a government that could get behind an idea like that and properly execute it ("sterile" air-side departure rail link), then yes.

But we don't live in France. Or Japan, Germany, the UAE, China, etc etc etc. :}

[EastMids]

I doubt Branson can afford to maintain a domestic/short haul operation out of LHR - it'll be just too difficult to get a foot in the door now and build O&D traffic against long-term incumbent BA, and online connections alone will not maketh a viable market. I can't see there being [m]any takers for the domestic routes - who would take on MAN-LHR when most of that market has now moved to rail? And whilst it will no doubt stick in Virgin's throat initially, haven't they got their domestic feed fixed anyway? VS codeshare on BA domestics anyone?? :}

IAG committed to entering into special agreements with competing airlines which operate long haul flights out of London Heathrow to provide these airlines with connecting passengers, including from UK domestic routes and other European routes.

Whilst VS placing their domestic connections with BA might seem strange at first sight, lets not forget that when BD operated MME-LHR and LBA-LHR it carried BA's domestic traffic on those routes to feed into BA's long haul operations - at one time, wasn't BA BD's biggest source of interline traffic as well as being their biggest competitors? I think that if VS can open their minds a bit, it's possible that they could have their domestic feeds without the commercial and financial risk of actually running their own flights. Block seat allocation and VS controlling their inventory on BA domestics - stranger things have happened! And if BA were to play funny/difficult with VS over the short haul passengers condition, I bet Virgin would go running to the EU so so very quickly...

If the EU had wanted to make sure the acquisition was in the travelling public's best interests (personally I think the acquisition is in the best interests of the travelling public anyway), it could have issued mandates about BA maintaining combined frequencies and capping fare rises on the domestic segments, and not about releasing slots with conditions attached to them that mean that that no one is really going to want to take them on.

Emotionally as a past employee I'd have preferred bmi to have continued as a viable going concern, but clearly that wasn't going to happen. So I'm really glad it's ended this way - many bmi employees [mainline at least] will now find a new life and income with BA, competition that was arguably in some ways counter-productive for both BA and bmi in these difficult times has been removed from the market, and some limited route growth potential has been opened up at LHR for a UK airline.

Andy

[Drink Up Thee Cider]

I can't see there being [m]any takers for the domestic routes - who would take on MAN-LHR when most of that market has now moved to rail

Er, apart from the 770,518 pax that flew MANLHR in 2011, you mean?

Please don't fall for the trainspotter spin that everyone's upped and left MANLHR for the choochoo-train. There's still a lot of feeder traffic amongst that 770k pax........:rolleyes:

[Skipness One Echo]

Er, apart from the 770,518 pax that flew MANLHR in 2011, you mean?

Please don't fall for the trainspotter spin that everyone's upped and left MANLHR for the choochoo-train. There's still a lot of feeder traffic amongst that 770k pax........

True, like point to point London-Paris is now Eurostar dominant with BA feeding LHR from Paris and Air France feeding CDG from London. Virgin has nowhere near enough long haul to make a MAN-LHR feeder profitable, they are a fraction the size of BA yet would have to have MAN-LHR at 2/3 or 3/4 of the BA operation to compete.

[EastMids]

Er, apart from the 770,518 pax that flew MANLHR in 2011, you mean? Please don't fall for the trainspotter spin that everyone's upped and left MANLHR for the choochoo-train. There's still a lot of feeder traffic amongst that 770k pax........

Yep 770k, which according to the CAA is down 4% from 2010, which in turn was down 12% from 2009, and 2008 was down 6% on 2007... So well over 20% down four years then. 770k pax is around 2100 a day, around 1050 each way. And what proportion of those 770k passengers are Virgin transfer passengers anyway? Virgin LHR departures are spread through the day so they'd have to offer several frequencies on domestics to make their connections attractive to passengers. BA putting six or seven Airbus aircraft each way a day into that market can soak up the vast majority of those passengers. Even Virgin's own spin says "Virgin Trains has seen its market share of the Manchester-London rail/air market increase from 38% in 2003 to 80% today" The domestic routes aren't going to get any better in the short term because of the economy, and in the longer term true high speed rail will do more damage. The overall market is much less attractive than when BD originally pitched into it. I can't see a viable market for a new entrant with an Airbus sized aircraft, and for reasons already gone into elsewhere the market isn't viable with an Embraer. And if they believe their own rhetoric, Virgin won't go anywhere near that route in particular!

I really can't see the slots BA have given up for domestic routes being well used. Having one carrier on these routes means a single potentially realistic and viable operation versus two that struggled in the past due to the affect of competition. As I said, if the EU had really wanted to protect "passenger interests" (whatever that means) they'd have been better off putting fare rise caps in place.

[Yellow Sun]

What I mean by this is not the same model as EZY or FR. I have not made myself very clear.

For a start the short haul operation I would imagine should be a separate business with different contracts to mainline VS. They will need to operate from the same Terminal so as to be a proper feeder system.

Thank you fmcg, silly me for not realising that it is a simple as that, just put them in a different company on different contracts. All those years I flew out of LHR and couldn't see how easy it would be to reduce the costs.

You ought to jog off and see SRB and let him know. There might be a few bob in it for you as well!:rolleyes:

YS

[Aero Mad]

And the sarky comment of the year award goes to...

[fmgc]

Yellow Sun,

Why the aggression? Why not debate a considered argument rather than just being rude. So far all you have done is say no, and not given any reasons why not. Unlike the well considered post by EastMids.

I tried to be conciliatory and admit that I wasn't making myself clear. I really don't think that there is any need for you to be like this.

But *sigh* here goes:

Is there something that you would like to talk about that might help with your anger? Maybe something in the past that has happened, even in your childhood? You know what Freud might say, or Jung? Oedipal issue maybe, you haven't ever tried ripping your eyes out have you? If we can isolate a specific event I think that some Cognitive Behavioural Therapy might do the trick.

Or,

Even worse, are you:

ex Fast Jet????

[fmgc]

Hey Hey, I've checked out your previous posts!! You are ex RAF!!!

I do love to be right!!!

[TakeNote]

Hi folks, following on from Friday's news; here are some key point updates:

The BA integration team were at Donington Hall on Monday for a meeting with bmi mainline’s extended management team.

BA's CFO will be at Donington Hall tomorrow (Wednesday 4 April) to speak to various staff.

The [bmi] Commercial team have all been issued their 90day consultation. This includes: Sales & Marketing, Network and Revenue Management. I suspect the latter will be made instantly redundant.

bmi will leave Star Alliance (obviously)

The BA flight code will be added to the following BD flights: Yerevan, Baku; Addis Ababa; Tbilisi; Almaty; Bishkek; Beirut; Freetown and Khartoum

Expect changes to the bmi hangar at EMA very soon, details are sketchy but it appears it's linked with bmibaby.

It's alledged that the 'Granite' deal for bmiR is off meaning IAG have WW and bmiR to get rid of ASAP

[runway30]

TakeNote, are you suggeting that a deal has been done for bmibaby that include the hangar at EMA?

[crewmeal]

Having seen all this before at BHX what's the betting IAG will get rid of baby and BMIR at the end of the summer season? Timing would be all important based on forward bookings for both carriers.

[shamrock7seal]

They will most likely get rid of bmibaby. Perhaps Jet2 would be interested?

But bmi regional is a very profitable business. They won't want to get rid of that. I think it could become part of the BA Cityflyer brand?

[toledoashley]

If I were Virgin - I would buy baby for next to nothing (if they want to have a feeder at Heathrow). Use some aircraft as a feeder at LHR, and the rest to create an airline similar to Jet2, where they can sell a holiday product as well.

[Aero Mad]

Just realised how ironic it would be if Virgin bought Baby.

[mart901]

It would be a big shift in direction given how short lived virgin express and virgin sun were, and it wouldnt give them any extra slots in heathrow surely? Mind you, virginbaby does have a certain ring to it!

[RHINO]

Aero Mad.....I think you mean ICONIC!

[Aero Mad]

Neither of you understood my post. Virgin buying a baby? Oh never mind... I'll get my coat :hmm:

[FLAPS 10-100]

It really would be an imaculate conception. Virgin having a baby. I don't think so some how.:confused:

[FQTLSteve]

In IAG and BMI press releases it is stated that BMI's summer schedlue will be operated in full. So, will BD still appear on LH, LX,SK etc? flights as code share and vice versa, and if not how will this go down with pax, like myself who would choose BD over BA because of the former's membership of Star? I think this could be rather an issue. Does anyone know how this will pan out, and will Diamond Club members have an option to remain in Star and/or transfer and what value to one world?

From 20 April what will happen to the BD flights from MAN/BHX to FRA covering for Lufthansa?

These isssues have not been aired much unless I've missed them.

[toledoashley]

Just mearly suggesting that if Virgin was serious about doing the domestic/european flights, then baby is a ready made airline which is up for sale which could operate straight away (even if the fleet is a bit old and needs replacing).

[CabinCrew747]

I guess we can look forward to an overall reduction in MAN-LHR and the loss of MAN-EDI, LYS and ABZ :(

[EI-BUD]

Does anyone know how this will pan out, and will Diamond Club members have an option to remain in Star and/or transfer and what value to one world?




Hi FQTLSteve,

I had an email from bmi stating that the diamond club were still going to be available to use over the summer season, and some changes were happening to make effect to allow the miles to be accepted on BA, cant remember the exact wording, it wasnt certainly clear. My expectation is that my diamond club balance will be 'translated' into Avios and available going forward. Though none of that seemed concrete.

EI-BUD

[VentureGo]

We’d like to advise you that the EU Competition Authority has today approved the sale of bmi to IAG. We are very aware that Diamond Club members want to know what will happen to their accounts when bmi is acquired by British Airways.
The deal between bmi and British Airways is due to be completed around 20 April 2012. We would like to reassure you that we plan to operate our summer schedule as normal and you can continue to earn and redeem Diamond Club miles during this period.
We are working together to announce a Diamond Club partnership with British Airways. This will include the ability to earn and redeem Diamond Club destinations miles across the bmi and BA networks.
We will be communicating regularly with you as more information becomes available and flybmi.com will also be updated with the latest information.
Regards
http://www.flybmi.com/Images.Net/emails/2008/flybmi/en-gb/20081104/keeley-signature.jpg
Keeley Downing
Diamond Club Manager

[giblets]

The EU commitments (http://ec.europa.eu/competition/mergers/cases/decisions/m6447_20120330_20212_2323262_EN.pdf) are quite complex, but interesting that they essentially state that the 'entrant' cannot obtain the slots if they have leased out their own slots (since the EU slot regs came into force), or 'exhausted' attempts to gain slots through the normal procedures.

Am sure Virgin will claim this is specifically aimed to stop them!? (how many slots do they lease?)

[Mister Geezer]

Is VS really going to be a big enough operator to merit its own dedicated feeder network at LHR? Compare the size of the BA operation at LHR and Virgin's twenty odd departures from LHR a day. The figures just don't seem to add up!

[Cyrano]

The EU commitments (http://ec.europa.eu/competition/mergers/cases/decisions/m6447_20120330_20212_2323262_EN.pdf) are quite complex, but interesting that they essentially state that the 'entrant' cannot obtain the slots if they have leased out their own slots (since the EU slot regs came into force), or 'exhausted' attempts to gain slots through the normal procedures.

Am sure Virgin will claim this is specifically aimed to stop them!? (how many slots do they lease?)

Giblets, my reading of the agreement is that a carrier is excluded only if it signs up to lease out slots after this IAG/bmi merger approval is ratified. In other words, if VS or someone signed up last year to lease out some slots for several seasons, they would not be prevented from applying for these IAG slots.

I'm sure that Virgin will find other reasons to be volubly unhappy...

[fmgc]

Is VS really going to be a big enough operator to merit its own dedicated feeder network at LHR? Compare the size of the BA operation at LHR and Virgin's twenty odd departures from LHR a day. The figures just don't seem to add up!

This is the issue that VS has. They have pretty much reached as big as they can get without a feeder airline and so can't grow big enough to be an airline that needs a feeder without having a feeder!!

[Kittiwake]

Then start with an Embraer and if you can make it work, fine. If not you can prove it and apply to have the slots de-restricted. VS needs reguonal to make this work!

[FQTLSteve]

Thanks VentureGo for the Diamond Club info. It still seems unclear, if the current BMI summer schedule is to be continued will Diamond Club points remain as Star (many of BMI's schedules are clearly operated as a Star airline and feed etc.) or One World or will members have a choice until the end of the summer season?

Seems to me that BMI will still be feeding Star if the current schedule remains?

[diggablue]

INFO FROM FLYER TALK FORUM THAT MAY SHED A LITTLE MORE LIGHT


LH Partnerplusbenefit states today in a newsletter:

With the EU approval of the sale of Lufthansa Alliance Airline British Midland International, the airline will only participate in the PartnerPlusBenefit programme until approximately 19 April 2012. Therefore, starting 20 April 2012, BenefitAwards (free flights and upgrades) cannot be redeemed, nor can BenefitPoints be earned, on British Midland International flights. Flight awards (free flights and upgrades) already booked are still valid or can be rebooked or cancelled free of charge up to one business day prior to departure. BenefitPoints will be awarded for flights on British Midland International that take place up to and including 19 April 2012. BenefitPoints earned on British Midland International flights will still be valid. If you have any additional questions, the PartnerPlusBenefit Service Centre will be happy to assist you.

[VentureGo]

FQTLSteve (http://www.pprune.org/members/367186-fqtlsteve) Understand Bmi may be leaving Star Alliance on 18th April & joining Oneworld (this was on another thread) Not sure re. Star Alliance codeshare flights that maybe committed to for summer. Guess all will be clear in a couple of weeks.