View Full Version : Aircraft and Wifi
nomorecatering
3rd Mar 2012, 10:02
There was an article in the last Oz Aviation that said that new inflight entertainment systems wil be wifi.
Has wifi been tested on aircraft? tested to make sure it doesnt interfere with the ships electronics?
FE Hoppy
3rd Mar 2012, 10:19
I used it on LH a few years ago. It's not new.
ross_M
3rd Mar 2012, 10:37
Boingo has had WiFi on some US carriers (AirTran, some flights of Delta and American too etc. ) since 2009 at least. So this isn't uncharted territory.
has the potential to save a lot of money/weight/power consumption. Wi-fi plus pax with own device , ipad etc and a charging socket , got to be the way forward .
I know of a certified WiFi device, was rather new in 2010. They apparently had to block parts of the frequency spectrum normally used though. Rather peculiar if others have been using it without restriction since 2009... got more info on that one?
The wifi system trialled on one of 767s comes with strict guidelines. Only specific avionic component part numbers can be fitted to the aircraft (those that have been tested with this particular wifi system).
As I recall, deviating from this necessitates the deactivation of the wifi system.
Rgds
NSEU
Mike-Bracknell
3rd Mar 2012, 21:05
The wifi system trialled on one of 767s comes with strict guidelines. Only specific avionic component part numbers can be fitted to the aircraft (those that have been tested with this particular wifi system).
As I recall, deviating from this necessitates the deactivation of the wifi system.
Rgds
NSEU
That's probably more to do with the US military owning that part of the spectrum than anything else. There are different channels used in different parts of the globe for 802.11: List of WLAN channels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_WLAN_channels)
grounded27
4th Mar 2012, 04:34
Under FAA governance, it's a simple process.
The system will be operated for approval while a FAA designate monitors all aircraft systems in operation to determine that there is not interference for STC approval in said aircraft type.
ross_M
4th Mar 2012, 04:54
I know of a certified WiFi device, was rather new in 2010. They apparently had to block parts of the frequency spectrum normally used though. Rather peculiar if others have been using it without restriction since 2009... got more info on that one?
Just to clarify, I meant Boingo has provided WiFi for Internet Access from PAX devices since 2009. Not sure if anyone is using WiFi in-seat entertainment devices yet but sure sounds like a good idea.
This article covers some bits of the certificaion process: Clearing WiFi To Fly: Aviation Week Article (http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_channel.jsp?channel=mro&id=news/om/2010/07/01/OM_07_01_2010_p51-229890.xml&headline=null&prev=10)
MurphyWasRight
4th Mar 2012, 17:15
Not sure if anyone is using WiFi in-seat entertainment devices yet but sure sounds like a good idea.
I would be a bit skeptical that -all- in-seat entertainment including on demand movies could be provided via available wifi bandwidth.
A multicast/broadcast scheme with local buffering for pause etc could work but that would require compatible user device apps, which may/may not exist or be commonly available.
In any case not all passengers will have/want to use their own devices so a seat back display would still be needed.
What I want is for the airline to provide a jack that allows the seat back display to be used by the i-phone/pad/whatever.
ross_M
4th Mar 2012, 17:30
What I want is for the airline to provide a jack that allows the seat back display to be used by the i-phone/pad/whatever.
My last IST-TXL flight on Turkish had a USB jack that one could use to play own movies or listen to own music. Not sure if it could connect Iphones etc.
I would be a bit skeptical that -all- in-seat entertainment including on demand movies could be provided via available wifi bandwidth.
Movies etc. could be cached locally at seat. Storage is cheap and small. The WiFi link would be more command and control, announcements, updates, flight position, weather etc. None of which is very intensive on bandwidth.
New movies can be pushed out as and when needed but need not take up link capacity.
Has wifi been tested on aircraft? tested to make sure it doesnt interfere with the ships electronics?
Norwegian here in Europe is operating with free wifi access for the passengers on about half the fleet. There is apparently a bulletin addressing DU instability on Honeywell displays.
MurphyWasRight
4th Mar 2012, 19:46
ross_M:
My last IST-TXL flight on Turkish had a USB jack that one could use to play own movies or listen to own music. Not sure if it could connect Iphones etc.
Cool, may work for Iphones for music, not sure about movies etc.
As long as the USB connected device pressents a file system view to the seat back it should work. I suspect Apple/copy paranoia may interfere. (I had more of a A/V input idea in mind.)
I Movies etc. could be cached locally at seat. Storage is cheap and small.
Totally true and probably do-able, even less a "users device" model than my "broadcast with a bit of cacheing" though.
That's probably more to do with the US military owning that part of the spectrum than anything else. There are different channels used in different parts of the globe for 802.11: List of WLAN channels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Not sure I understand. There is a lot more to compatablity than final transmitted/received frequencies.
Aircraft system components (computers, radios, etc) from different manufacturers should have similar characteristics to suit their intended purpose (e.g. navigation and communication systems should cover the same frequency spectrum), but the regulators are not willing to take the chance that components not on the "tested ok" list behave exactly the same as the (already) tested ok components (i.e. tested in conjuction with this brand/model of wifi system).
Instead of having to prove that the wifi system is harmless to every known aircraft device/component (from every manufacturer), the wifi only has to be proven to be harmless to a limited range of aircraft devices/components (from specific manufacturers).
ross_M
7th Mar 2012, 03:29
Instead of having to prove that the wifi system is harmless to every known aircraft device/component (from every manufacturer), the wifi only has to be proven to be harmless to a limited range of aircraft devices/components (from specific manufacturers).
In the long run, wouldn't it be a more robust strategy to require component manufacturers to prove that their avionics can withstand external interference of a wide variety of generic waveforms and frequencies?
stockdam
21st May 2012, 09:43
In the long run, wouldn't it be a more robust strategy to require component manufacturers to prove that their avionics can withstand external interference of a wide variety of generic waveforms and frequencies?
Systems and component manufacturers do have to do EMC susceptibility (and radiation) testing.
X_atc
23rd Jun 2012, 18:09
Does anyone know if the Honeywell DU 2 wifi-induced blanking has been resolved? Can't seem to find any references online since about March 2011.
Wi-Fi interference with Honeywell avionics prompts Boeing action (http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/wi-fi-interference-with-honeywell-avionics-prompts-boeing-354179/)