Carlisle

[NorthSouth]

I see from the NOTAMs that Carlisle will be unlicensed from 11th to 22nd Feb due to no RFFS, and it seems ATC is not being provided at weekends - only A/G.

Is this a temporary thing due to firemen's holidays or something, or something more permanent?

NS

[mrmum]

It's purely a temporary thing.

Depends on your definition of temporary of course :E It's been like that with ATC and A/G Radio for 2 or 3 years now IIRC. The lack of RFFS started last year, conveniently, after the need for it to conduct PPL training was removed.

More to do with lack of staff, rather than them being on holiday.

Not sure if you can access historical NOTAMs, if you can, I guess you could check. Just had a quick look myself and you can go back to the beginning of January easily.

[Sir George Cayley]

What happened to the plans to radically update Carlisle by Stobart Airs backers WA Developments?

SGC

[N707ZS]

I think planning is causing all sorts of problems, someone local might know more.

[Johnm]

I really don't know what the fuss is about. The licencing of aerodromes and provision of all these exciting services is a strange British disease.

While I was in New Zealand I flew from Wanaka. No radio except safetycom equivalent, no approach procedures worth a damn.

However there was a regular commercial flight to Christchurch flown by a pleasant young lady. She turned up and announced herself, joined the traffic pattern, unloaded her passengers and their luggage. Reloaded and departed with similar formalities.

As long as we all follow the convetions and announce what we're doing on the correct frequency, where's the problem?

[Dave Gittins]

Much like a lot of "untowered" fields I fly into in the States. Just a runway and a load of hangers. Radio is Unicom, usually an "ATIS" on 3 clicks of the Unicom frequency and lights for 7 clicks.

Never thought to ask if they were licensed or wot ?

[Jan Olieslagers]

What's the implications for an aerodrome (or even a runway?) to be licensed, or not? (insurance, perhaps?)
I seem to remember there was a time when tuition was only allowed at licensed a/d's, but this is no longer the case? What relevance remains?

[RTN11]

What's the implications for an aerodrome (or even a runway?) to be licensed, or not? (insurance, perhaps?)
I seem to remember there was a time when tuition was only allowed at licensed a/d's, but this is no longer the case? What relevance remains? A licenced airfield should guarnentee a certain level of runway condition, mostly in the case of grass fields, but free from FOD and pot holes at least.

It also indicates a level of fire cover. For small GA strips this usually means training the girls who make the bacon sandwiches to use the fire equipment, and having a ropey old Land-Rover with a tank of foam and hose on the back.

[JW411]

Last time I went to Carlisle I was moving BNFL loads to Dounreay. Do these flights still happen?

[Romeo Tango]

I think Dounreay closed a decade or two ago.

[mad_jock]

Dounreay the runway is used as a car park now and the control tower is the visitors center.

[mrmum]

What happened to the plans to radically update Carlisle by Stobart Airs backers WA Developments?
Still theoretically in progress, but not as ambitious as the original idea which was referred to a public enquiry, then promptly withdrawn. Nothing much happening with the development since 2010, all the resource seems to be going to their other airport, at Southend.

[mrmum]

A licenced airfield should guarantee a certain level of runway condition......free from FOD and pot holes at least.
You've not had the pleasure of using Carlisle's tarmac then? ;)

[NorthSouth]

JW411:Last time I went to Carlisle I was moving BNFL loads to Dounreay. Do these flights still happen?Was that in DanAir 748s? Scary stuff! No radar cover, uncontrolled airspace chock full of mad Buccaneer pilots flying at anything from 100 to 10,000 feet and speaking to no-one, nothing but an NDB (no DME) approach, and only an 1100m runway with a 1.6% downhill slope in the prevailing 22 direction. Oh and 625ft agl radio masts at about 1.5nm final. MDH must have been something ridiculous. And all of this with what - spent nuclear fuel rods? - on board. I doff my hat to you for that sort of flying - I'm sure it wouldn't be allowed these days.
NS

[JW411]

No. Even worse. BAe146.

DanAir had it easy.

[NorthSouth]

Ah, right. Well, for whatever reason - maybe the obvious ones! - they moved those to Wick.

NS

[JW411]

One of the reasons we went to Wick was the horrendous cost of fuel at Dounreay. It was at least 3 times what it was elswhere.

[SWBKCB]

Stobarts have tied the development of the airport in with moving their other operations in the area onto the airport site - this has attracted a degree of planning scrutiny, public inquiry's, appeals etc and doesn't seem to be going anywhere fast

[rowly6339]

Stobarts still want to do at carlisle what they are doing at southend only the council are dead against it for whatever crazy reason????

[NutLoose]

Carlisle and the Council still live in the stone age, the road system is dire, you get a smoother road surface on ruined sections of Hadrians wall than you do around the town centre and along Brampton Rd, the police as still shacked up in a shop in the Town Centre post the floods that hit the station several years ago, they built the new swimming pool 20 odd years ago about 2 ft short of Olympic standard, this ensuring it couldn't be used for competition, par for the course really and indicative of the Council and their planning.
Here is an example of the dogs dinners they come up with

News & Star | News | Carlisle bridge: (http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/carlisle-bridge-it-was-not-what-i-envisaged-we-finished-up-with-a-real-dog-s-dinner-1.927365?referrerPath=news)

Ohhh and I was born and bred in Carlisle, the airport and the possible advantages it could bring to the city are an on going travesty.

[rowly6339]

Both tinkler and stobart are getting fed up with it,they really do want to expand it and there has been rumour of ryanair and aer arran looking at possible routes so who knows they may just turn it into a haulage depot and consolidate all the local but spread out locations?

[stiknruda]

I was transitting to the north of Scotland from East Anglia a few months ago and phoned Carlisle for PPR.

The really nice guy suggested that my life would be easier and my wallet would be heavier if I actually went via Kirkbride.

I did.

In fact I had such a good experience that I routed via Kirkbride on the way home too!

Stik

[Dave Gittins]

I seem to recall the most interesting thing about Carlisle was the State Owned Brewery and cheap ale

[soaringhigh650]

I really don't know what the fuss is about. The licencing of aerodromes and provision of all these exciting services is a strange British disease.

I totally agree.

Gold plating and gold plating everything again is a strangely British thing.
The pilots of course, are generally too gentlemanly to give a dang about it.

Any public-use airport here has a minimum standard. If there's an accident the local fire department comes out and deals with it.

[mrmum]

I seem to recall the most interesting thing about Carlisle was the State Owned Brewery and cheap ale
Wow, long memory Dave. State management ended in 73/74, the brewery was run by Theakstons for a while, then became student accommodation for the new university.

[SWBKCB]

Saga continues to drag on

News & Star | News | Fresh delay for Stobart Group's Carlisle Airport planning application (http://www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/fresh-delay-for-stobart-group-s-carlisle-airport-planning-application-1.958992?referrerPath=home)

[thing]

Carlisle and the Council still live in the stone age,

Lincoln's a bit like that. Town and Gown. We have a bypass......it only bypasses half of the city and goes randomly from dual to single carriegeway. Then they wonder why the traffic is at a standstill morning and evening.....it's not known as Lincoln's longest car park for nothing.

Also which large city has a rail link that doesn't go under or over all of the major arterials...but crosses them? Thus bringing the whole city to a standstill again every time a train enters or leaves the city which in the morning and evening is obviously quite a few commuter trains, never mind the goods trains. The mind boggles.

Still one of the nicest places to live in England though.

[rowly6339]

This is becomming a standing joke, i think stobarts would be better off selling it now and try to get as much back as possible.

[sammypilot]

Flew into Carlisle a couple of weeks back. Must have some of the most expensive Avgas in the country at £2.05 plus VAT per litre.

[NorthSouth]

Carlisle and the Council still live in the stone ageBut if you bother to read the press report in post #26 you'll see it is Stobarts that have twice requested the postponement of the decision, not the council. If this proposal has already been through a public inquiry and a judicial review it's clear it has been seriously flawed in the past. Little wonder, with that history, that all parties are treating it with extreme caution.
NS

[Airlinepilot1687]

All things aside Carlisle is a lovely airfield in a great location, not to mention the high quality runway it provides and there is a lot of it too. I would recommend it any day. The whole development saga will go on for some time until the right amount of cash is laid on the table so let's enjoy Carlisle while we can. :cool:

[mrmum]

Must have some of the most expensive Avgas in the country at £2.05 plus VAT per litre.
Indeed, not really much excuse for it either. It's not exactly Oban or a Scottish Island is it? Can't say it's logistically difficult to get to with a tanker, about 10 minutes off the M6.

[ShyTorque]

Must have some of the most expensive Avgas in the country at £2.05 plus VAT per litre.

The Reivers are alive and well!

[snchater]

'Do Kirkbride have Avgas? Anyone know how much; it's certainly more remote than Carlisle from a road transport point of view'

Kirkbride does have avgas: £2.00/litre and a landing fee of £10 to include tea and bickkies!

The last time I was at Carlisle it cost £32.40 landing fee (C182) and because it was the weekend the airfield was notamed as A/G with navaids unavailable.

I was the only aircraft on the apron and the only customer in the cafe on a glorious sunny day - I had the impression that it is only a matter of time before Stobart turn the site into industrial units - they certainly don't encourage GA visitors with their pricing structure.

[mrmum]

the high quality runway it provides and there is a lot of it too
:eek:Have you actually been there this century? Okay, the main's a mile or so long and the N-S about half that, but it's a patchwork quilt of temporary botch-ups, waiting for the big development spend.
It has other problems with the surface breaking up, can quite easily get prop. damage if you're not careful, also has a pretty restrictive weight limit for transport flights.
IAIP AD 2-EGNC-1 - 2 12 Remarks: All runways have a public transport weight limit of 12500 kg.

[Gulfstreamaviator]

landing next to the power station was rather awsome.......

glf