WOW Airlines (Iceland)

[jabird]

Apologies if there already is a thread, I'm afraid I couldn't find one using site search (the one part of pprune which I'm afraid I really hate!).

WOW is billed as a new startup from Iceland, with routes including STN-KEF, starting in June 2012, using 2 x A320s, leased from Avion.

Website looks superb, but only small amount about the owners. Can pay be credit or debit card with same surcharge (1.2%), so some level of consumer protection, but I would still hesitate about any new carrier in such a crowded market, especially when U2 have since announced they are doing their own LTN-KEF service.

Thoughts?

[Groundloop]

Mentioned here in post #145.

http://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/469670-astraeus-no-more.html

[jabird]

who is now starting a new airline called 'Wow' with Canadians now- as the new owner reported: 'Wow' upside down is 'Mom', giving you a nice warm cuddly feeling, and I think he added 'wrapping round you keeping you warm' or something like that, but I was feeling rather ill at that stage and couldn't really absorb it.). Also, a significant number of KEF based Astraeus pilots, both British and Icelandic, have also been seen off. I'm not sure the IEX cabin crew status- they had already lost temporary summer staff, and the new operation is smaller, so I would guess more have gone.

It's not a good record- 4 airlines sent to the chopping block by this company, and another patsy being lined up. IEX will have to contend with Norwegian, WOW or MOM or whatever it is, and EJ on the routes as well now.

Thanks - I think they deserve their own thread, and I really don't want to see any airline logo turned upside down!

[brian_dromey]

Showing a wide variety of destinations across Europe from KEF. Seem to be using the Code X9 at the minute, which is Omni Air International.

[jabird]

Yes, I was just looking at it from UK perspective. But just how big is the market for flights t/f Iceland? Population about same as Coventry, but they can't exactly jump on a train with their beachtowels.

Inbound, the scenery is stunning, totally unique, but still needs a lot of marketing to tempt people away from their usual mentality of heading south.

Is there really room for four airlines on the LON-KEF market?

[sxflyer]

One thing going for Wow over EJ is the flight timings, especially for weekend breaks - EJ departs at crack of dawn and returns 10ish from KEF, Wow is at more leisurely afternoon/evening hours. Already booked a trip (but did use a credit card!)

As someone with great experience of the Icelandic market with numerous visits through employment and as a tourist, I would be very extremely nervous about booking with IEX right now, and WOW's network looks mighty similar to IEX's....perhaps a bit too conveniently similar.

[jabird]

sxf,

Yes, a very good point. Sometimes a new airline is a safer bet than a dying one!

But I would still rather get up a bit earlier for the security of an established player - except that I have a natural tendency to try out companies I haven't flown with.

If only AA routes some of their LHR-JFK services via KEF, maybe that would be a safer bet :ugh:

[Notso Fantastic]

Oh alright- like a slippery Moray Eel, I can't stay in my slimy little hole, so here I come. Let me give you the saga of KEF-UK air operations. Loftleidir for many years, then Icelandair to LHR. Iceland Express starts up ops to Europe using one or two weird ACMI operators from Europe. Owners of IEX buy Astraeus and use them for services ex KEF to Europe (LGW), and eventually US- infrastructure struggles to handle. Executive of holding company owner of IEX and Astraeus takes clever decision (after demand for further charge from ground handlers KEF) to decline further revenue for handling US flights and sacks said ground handlers, precipitating immediate crisis for recruitment and training of new staff at KEF for start date of 1 June (good one!). 3 hour delays trying to reconcile transfer bags US>KEF>Europe, and no duty frees (no bonded warehouse). Said executive sacked, sued by holding company for fiddling, plans to start WOW in comp with IEX. All made up, in time for November, flow of funds to Astraeus cut off. New carrier ready same day to cont ops, reduced IEX op covered by CSA Holidays A320s. Latest episode in this saga from the northern lands is smaller IEX operation, WOW allegedly coming with a Canadian operator flying services, EJ flying to LTN 3 times a week, Norwegian and SAS appearing. Is there room? My posterior!

Now if you are going to put up money for a ticket- don't consider relative cost Credit card/Debit card- just go for total safety! The owner of IEX/Astraeus has driven 4 airlines under, and one of the directors has branched out on his own while he still has a virgin record and has yet to follow the usual course of airline ownership up north! Meanwhile, one understands nobody has any money coming- staff, taxis, training organisations, contractors, aeroplane leasors, property landlords, navigation charges, landing fees....you get the picture? Meanwhile, the 30+ ground handlers at KEF, up to 170 Astraeus staff, many Icelandic 737/757 pilots at KEF employed by Astraeus....all redundant, whilst the owners totally walk away from all liabilities. It's almost funny.

If I were you, I would not invest in airlines near the Arctic Circle. Only buy tickets with a credit card. Beware it is still (even after a big devaluation) stonking expensive up there. The country is very beautifully scenic, but so is Scotland, but the volcanoes are a bit short there. But good luck!

[VOM1T]

I Can only add..
Það er skammgóður vermir að pissa í skóna sína.

(Trans. Pissing in your shoes won't keep your feet warm for long.)

[aztruck]

Icelandic folk v nice. a few w.......s but same as down south. I'd go Icelandair if I were you, or even better(and cheaper I suppose) Easyjet. Most Icelandic people despise the bank robbers and wannabee oligarchs

[BOAC]

Iceland Express starts up ops to Europe using one or two weird ACMI operators from Europe. Owners of IEX buy Astraeus] - a correction to your potted history - don't miss the fact that one of your 'weird (but not ACMI) operators from Europe' was Astraeus which was busy with IEX (and had been for a while) flying KEF-STN and KEF-CPH (4 services a day) when I joined in June 2004 until IEX switched to the Spanish carrier.

[Notso Fantastic]

VOM1T, "Það er skammgóður vermir að pissa í skóna sína." I thought I gave a fairly dispassionate review of Iceland's non-Icelandair recent commercial history? Despite feeling upset for what the 'wannabe Oligarchs' have done to the smaller people.

There does seem to have been unethical behaviour by these people up there, and anybody who goes up there for work should be warned, or trades with them in various ways- there are a lot of people counting their losses (again) right now. It does not leave a good taste seeing so many out of pocket (and jobs) whilst these individuals claw their way over others frantically restarting the same old music! The whole question of guaranteed bank deposits has also not been addressed, but I never deposited money in a foreign bank I'd never heard off before. Maybe I have a surprisingly strong ethical streak, but whilst these same people are allowed to continue running the same old music and acting as 'airline slaughtermen' (Sterling, Mytravel, Astraeus), then it appears from outside their behaviour is officially condoned by the country. Their record of employment is best described as 'excrutiatingly-execrable'. Like it or not, they are the face of Iceland.

[VOM1T]

Notso Fantastic, my apologies if my aim was off, the comment was intended as an insight into the behaviour of other characters involved, rather than directed at your informative posting.

[CabinCrewe]

AA LHR-JFK via KEF ...? I wouldnt have thought so, who is going to want to go on that without significant discount

[Notso Fantastic]

I see- I mistook your meaning. There is little we can do now but watch the same old wheels turning again. At least this time it won't be done on the strength of a UK AOC. But we can start making enquiries as to the status of the CAA deposit and whether this now may go towards the liabilities of the organisation?

[jabird]

AA LHR-JFK via KEF ...? I wouldnt have thought so, who is going to want to go on that without significant discount

Noone. It was simply a sarcastic comment on the risks of flying with start up airlines, suggesting that an 'established' airline like AA would be a 'safer' bet (which they clearly are not).:ugh:

[davidjohnson6]

AA LHR-JFK via KEF ...? I wouldnt have thought so, who is going to want to go on that without significant discount If I had a day or two to spare, I'd be up for a stopover in Iceland, and given that Icelandair make a fair go at plugging a transatlantic stopover in their marketing, I suspect quite a lot of other leisure passengers who are not too time poor are up for it as well.

[jabird]

If I had a day or two to spare, I'd be up for a stopover in Iceland, and given that Icelandair make a fair go at plugging a transatlantic stopover in their marketing, I suspect quite a lot of other leisure passengers who are not too time poor are up for it as well.

The vast extent of FI's US & Canada route network (relative to population) suggests they handle a fair volume of transfer pax through KEF. Adding DEN next?

However, serving this market should mean there is spare capacity on ptp too, although my experience has shown that when an airline operates from a spoke to its hub, it can often still be cheaper to take a connecting service with someone else between these two points. Hence, there should be room for a loco on this route, but 3?

[SalesConsult]

Notso Fantastic (http://www.pprune.org/members/20363-notso-fantastic)
I see- I mistook your meaning. There is little we can do now but watch the same old wheels turning again. At least this time it won't be done on the strength of a UK AOC. But we can start making enquiries as to the status of the CAA deposit and whether this now may go towards the liabilities of the organisation?


Is it not the case that deposits are requied by UK CAA for shceduled airlines or carriers with their own direct-sale holiday programmes? Has Astraeus deposit with CAA- any one knows? :confused:

[Notso Fantastic]

As an ex-employee of Astraeus, one heard that a deposit was required by the CAA, and the CAA required regular increasing amounts. If such a sum was required and held by them, I hope it will be retained pending payment of staff and all suppliers. I understand nobody was paid at all for work, services or goods supplied to Astraeus. Yet the travel company Astraeus was flying for (Icexpress- also owned by the same holding company) had a standby airline ready to take over the return flights of the cancelled services and CSA Holidays all set to continue operating IEX services. Meanwhile, numerous people in the UK are counting their losses. Very tacky.

But this is not Astraeus or IEX, it's WOW, but the dividing lines do seem vague sometimes!

[SalesConsult]

Notso Fantastic

Thank you for the clarification. I believe that the deposit was requested of Astraeus when they were into their own scheduled ops before the Icelander came to cannibalise the company. CAA will hold deposit to protect the public as part of Consumer Protection Group procedure. They will not hold deposit to protect staff or creditors.:ok:

You are very correct about the tackiness of the whole thing - WOW should be fingered regardless of all the jargon of separate legal entity, for all the mess.:rolleyes:

[Notso Fantastic]

Thank you for that- I sincerely hope the deposit is returned to the administrator for settling company bills and not back to the holding company Fengur!
There are lessons here leading to a short version of Iceland's modern history! It goes like this. Many volcanos surrounded by lots of haddock. people living proudly in a trying climate- shame it wasn't 30 degrees further south. Some businessmen decide to buy up each others shares talking up all their share prices. Suddenly they really start hitting paydirt, opening up large international bank loans to buy up shoe shops in the UK high street (and much more, like a doddery airline). Icelanders starts getting reputation as incredible business people (and they truly start believing it themselves!). With apparent 'growth', more loans available, more retailing purchases in Europe made. If the businessmen are so good, the banks must be too! To feed the rapacious businessmen, the Ice banks must get deposits, so offer slightly better deposit rates and attract BIG money from abroad- hey, with a government guarantee, what can go wrong? The people bask in a strong, appreciating currency, but funnily enough, when they get loans or mortgages, they have to be in Euros or Dollars (I used to ask whether that raised any suspicions), not Crowns. The first recession in 2008 brought the whole edifice down- the plumped-up share prices were exposed as vacuous, all loans in default, all bank deposits severely hurt as the assets they were loaned to were shown to be vastly reduced, currency falls, billions in deposits unable to be repaid.

However, it was all in the tea leaves right from the beginning. The businesses of the wannabee oligarchs were quite sad all along- just their share prices were boosted out of all proportion to the underlying assets, and it all led from there. Put weak Ice banks (in league with the businessmen) into the mixture, and the effect was magnified and sucked in outside banks. It's sad to see those same businessmen come through it all, I won't say unscathed, but still flaunting their wealth and desire to play airlines, whilst the little people (in Iceland and Europe) count their (enormous) losses whilst Iceland comes to terms with its gigantic debts and the billions of UK and Dutch money which was sent up there mysteriously 'evaporated', as well as the realisation that Vikings don't suddenly make swashbucklingly amazing and successful business pirates!

Now another one of them imagines 'he has it' with a new start up (in this recession?) whilst the one already in business contracts his ambitious ideas as he shrugs off some liabilities. The lines between the two are blurred, especially as the first was a director of the second, in dispute and now cosy again. The picture will undoubtedly change again. But I have no wish to look at them any more, or even the rock from whence they came. My sympathy and attention is with the staff trying to get by now and find new employment in this market, and the suppliers taking a hit from such foolish ambition (which continues unabated!). This is the tragedy of Iceland- a nation of just over 350,000 that should have stuck to making yoghurt and dried puffin meat and keeping warm.

[jabird]

So are we all set for the off on Sunday (STN-KEF)?

[LGS6753]

WOW has announced its acquisition of Iceland Express, following that airline's demise.
According to Travel Mole:

Iceland's low-cost airline, WOW air, has acquired its 'rival' Iceland Express.
It has taken over all operations and schedules and is promising no disruption for passengers.
"The move is not a merger, it is a takeover, with WOW air acquiring the Iceland Express route network, branding and customer base; as well as gaining access to all knowledge and expertise acquired by the company in its years of operation," said a statement.
Some agents and operators had become frustrated with Iceland Express because it kept cancelling routes and switching airports (see previous story).
Discover the World stopped selling flights with Iceland Express altogether several years ago "due to the extremely unreliable way they operated".
But it said today that it had noticed recent improvements with the Iceland Express service and had watched WOW air operate well since its launch in June.
Discover the World continues to sell exclusively with Icelandair and easyJet but said it would now consider using WOW air as a overflow airline.

[sxflyer]

See my post #6 from December last year - unsurprisingly accurate

[BOAC]

Indeed sxf - the writing was on the glacier the day WOW launched at KEF - there was NO room for 2 Icelandic lo-cos there, especially on similar routes.

Knowing a tiny bit about Icelandic 'ways' of investment, I do wonder if the underground investment 'root structure' might be worth investigating? Where is 'Titan Investment' financially based? Caymans, Luxembourg.................? Anyone know?

I wonder if the recent Canadian 'interest' in Iceland and the connections of Titan with Canada will trigger some new lo-co routes?

[Boeing737_IL]

Do not waste your time with this company . 18 pilots were interviewd within 3 days all of them between 10 and 12000 hours ,however they failed all of them , because the 18 were stupid.
No ticket ,no hotel ,no transport nothing

[Hotel Tango]

Perhaps the company has high standards and is not willing to just take on anyone. As for reimbursement of costs, are you kidding?! My son was unemployed for 10 months and travelled up, down and around going to job interviews during those 10 months. All was at his own cost which, being unemployed, he could ill afford. Sign of the times.