Can a Puma Crewmen help me please.

[Airborne Aircrew]

I am building a model of a Puma and it has a load pole, load pole hole and a pair of doors to cover the load pole hole. The instructions only allow for the load pole to be affixed through the hole in the closed load pole hole doors. I would like to leave the doors open and be able to see the hook and this is where my memory is failing me.

I remember, (or seem to remember), that the load pole was attached at the top with a pip pin to the MRGB but obviously it didn't just swing free. I seem to recall it also being pip pinned to the front of the load pole hole - but this is practically pure speculation. Also, I seem to remember the doors "concertina-ing" rearwards so they ended folded up against the frame of the most forward of the rear 8 seats, (12 seat fit).

Am I correct in my memories? If not, where am I wrong.

Thanks in advance.

[Tiger_mate]

Your memories are correct. The load-pole was pinned to the MGB and also to the leading edge of the hatch. The model may have a double sized hatch were the IFF lives, a hatch rarely seem open. The knuckle joint to permit swing is below the flloor soon after the lower pin. Nowadays there are bungies to limit swing and effectively stop a role change in flight from being possible. The hatch did concetina ala inverted 'V' to the stowed position just forward of the first bank of seats. In summary, as long as the load pole is vertical from the centre of the MGB, it is in the right place and if this means the hole is too large, it is an error in the model, even though there are a pair of doors in the floor at that point. The manual release is just above the floor mounting pin.

[Airborne Aircrew]

Thanks chaps... The model is wrong. The doors imply that they are hinged to the floor at the front and back of the load hole and there is a semi-circle cutout in each door at the center of the load hole to accommodate the load pole. I knew it didn't make sense because the load pole would, effectively, be free swinging if the doors were opened as they imply they would.

No problem, I'll adjust the way the pole hangs and fold the doors up as I remembered the.

Thanks for the pic Gweedo, I don't remember seeing those two in the pictures you sent me... :ok:

[lsh]

And remember, strictly, the pole is not quite vertical - as per top pic!
(And those strop ends should be clipped to the seat - stops it flailing around!)

lsh
:E
(nit-picking pain-in-the-arse!)

[Airborne Aircrew]

lsh:

I remember it wasn't vertical that's part of the reason I thought my memory was ok... :)

I'm still considering putting a strop in there... The model doesn't come with one...

Thanks:ok:

[St Johns Wort]

The model isn't wrong the load pole hole can be doubled in size. Under the floor boards, forward of the load pole, a section of the floor simply lifts up and folds forward. I've only ever seen it used for single point abseiling but that was a very long time ago, it may also have been used to house the IRLS kit.

[Airborne Aircrew]

St. Johns.

Ok... Sounds reasonable... But I recall that when the door was open in the picture Gweedo has provided there was a panel that was the front of the load pole hole. Opening the other half of a door wouldn't seem to facilitate through the floor abseiling... and whenever I dropped abseilers or did it myself we went on four ropes through the doors, much more efficient.

[St Johns Wort]

I have abseiled, fast roped and used a swarming rope from the gearbox, and dispatched from same, through the centre hatch. Puma SOPs did, at one stage contain photo's of how it should be done. The SOP changed early to mid 80's. I did say that it was a long time ago.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

AA,

If the Wort says it's so then trust me it is so :ok:

[St Johns Wort]

You must be on or near the 'last lap' by now.:)

[Seymour Belvoir]

St John's - thought I'd find you on here as soon as I saw the Puma Crewman request! How's things?

[St Johns Wort]

Retirement suits me no end:). Just off for a swim and a sauna, probably wont do the steam room as it makes my hair go 'frizzy' you know how it is;).

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Hair.........:p

Just over a year to my exit date but I have quite a few things lined up course wise so ealry next I should start the becoming a Mr process :ok:

[charliegolf]

Yeah, SFFP, I was buying it too 'til I saw 'hair'!:ok:

CG

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Seem to recall last time I saw him he had an "awful lot of face to wash" :p:p:p

[NutLoose]

Airborne Aircrew,

As one who tinkers in plastic and resin I can help out a tad..

Arospatiale Puma, XW212, RAF (http://www.jasu.org/pz/hw/hwa/alec_revelle/puma/index.htm)

Westland Puma HC.1 | Scale Rotors (http://www.scale-rotors.com/category/image-galleries/walkarounds/westland-puma-hc1)

Puma HC1 Walk Around Page 1 (http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/paul_tosney/puma_hc1/index.php)

Puma HC1 (ZJ954) Walk Around Page 1 (http://www.primeportal.net/hangar/ulrich_wrede/puma_hc1_zj954/index.php?Page=1)

Matchbox 1/32nd Puma (http://tedtaylor.hobbyvista.com/72-matchbox-puma/page-72.html)


Ohh and if your interested, one of my completed 200mm Resin kit figures.... :)

http://i536.photobucket.com/albums/ff321/taylortony/modelling/SAS%202006/sassmall.jpg

[Lukeafb1]

Apologies, slight thread drift.

When I was on 51 Sqn (yes, that one!), one of the airmen modified a plastic kit to resemble the shape of our B16s (long nose, accurate domes etc.), a damn good likeness it was, too!

Proudly bought it in to the hangar one day and all hell broke loose. Suffice to say that the model was confiscated and said airman had a very personal meeting with the Boss.:{

[Airborne Aircrew]

Nutloose:

Magic... I was familiar with the bottom link but had never seen the others. Gweedo, had already built the same 1/32nd Puma I'm working on and had a whole load of photographs, a CD with more pictures, moulds for additional parts etc. that he very kindly gave me so I am pretty well off in most areas but the load hole was bothering me.

St. Johns:

This is what I have for the hatch doors:-

http://www.hqrafregiment.net/images/loadholedoors.jpg

From what you are saying I should place the forward one in the closed position and I should cut the rear in half so that I can "concertina" it open against the rear seats. Then I would affix the load pole into the cutout of the closed door which would make it as close as possible to accurate, correct?

Thanks for your help... :ok:

[St Johns Wort]

AA Spot on! Dont forget the hook faces forward ;) Are you configuring the model to the mod state in 'your day'?

SFFP & CG. Sparing the rod with you 2 was a mistake I fear:) See you in Nov?

[charliegolf]

Sinjun,

Re: Nov, I have a chit, so I really hope so! Would I know SFFP? AA was after my time, I believe.

CG

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

St Johns I will certainly be there, have you a date yet?

[Airborne Aircrew]

SFFP:

I'm having a bit of a problem with that. The Matchbox model comes sans PIPS and I'm not sure of my ability to model a set though I have begun trying. Much of the rest of the model as it stands is pretty much as it was when I flew it.

What I do find a tad annoying is that I went to my log book to see when I had flown XW208 which is the supplied decals only to find I flew it just once for 1:15 on the 5th April 1985 while on 240 OCU with a Flt. Lt. Carpenter who I remember quite well. I was sure I had flown it a ton of times but it seems I did XW207 and XW209 a lot but 208 must have remained an OCU airframe or gone to 230 Sqn. so it avoided me...

[Seymour Belvoir]

It should be the last Friday of the month; well that's the day I've booked off work!

[St Johns Wort]

SFFP always the last friday of Nov

CG Both after your time; if you're there I'll introduce you to SFFP, you wont forget him:p

AA Strictly speaking they arn't PIPS, the Puma Iceing Protection System was three mods, the Polys, the cover for the T/R hyds and something else which slips my mind. I know a few guys who have fashioned a set of Poly's for models such as yours they may be able to help.

[Airborne Aircrew]

St. Johns:

That's odd, I was always told PIPS stood for Polyvalent Intake Protection System. :confused:

I'd love some advice on the construction... I'm pretty handy when it comes to things like woodwork, (built a room around an aquarium and a nice bar in my basement), but I have to admit that when we get onto small things my eyes let me down nowadays. I make the model with the aid of a big freestanding magnifying glass.. :{ My vision is fine past about a yard but closer in I'm utterly buggered even with reading glasses... I probably should get them checked professionally.

[cornish-stormrider]

Thanks for posting the piccies, as an unhumble ex liney on 33 for a year and a bit before I PVR'd it did bring back warm memories of a pan and ice creams.

much more relaxed way of working than fast jets or engine bays.

enjoy your quiet little drinky in november!!!
CS

[Could be the last?]

St Johns,

Let it go and enjoy the sauna!!!!

[St Johns Wort]

Tried 'cold turkey' too painful! therapy is going well:)

AA I'll see what I can do.

[Airborne Aircrew]

St. Johns:

I don't care what the rest say about you, you're OK! :ok:

Thanks.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Oh no he's not :p

[Airborne Aircrew]

Ohhhhhh yes he is... ;)

[NutLoose]

There is a way around the intake issue but you would have to buy another kit, Revell took over the moulds from Matchbox and reissued it as a German BGS variant with extra sprues for the intakes and the enlarged sponsons amongst other things, this will show you the one I mean, though again it is rare.

SA 330 Puma "BGS", Revell Nr. 04412 (http://www.scalemates.com/products/product.php?id=120879)

Just keep a look out on evilbay for one.

They also actually did it as an RAF version too, but again rare

SA 330 Puma, Revell Nr. 4499 (http://www.scalemates.com/products/product.php?id=120924)

Thomas used the first to produce this, shame the flags are upside down.

SA 330 Puma, Revell Nr. 4499 (http://www.scalemates.com/products/product.php?id=120924)

Decals and markings, these are not a problem, if you have an inkjet printer you can get decal sheet and print out your own. I actually do some of my own ( though I use an Alps printer which has white ink) which is needed if you are doing anything containing white unless you use white decal sheet and trim it well.

see
Experts-Choice® Decal Film - Bare-Metal Foil Co. (http://www.bare-metal.com/Experts-Choice-Decal-Film.html)

I have the Matchbox Puma so can measure the codes and serial sizes, if you want I could run you off a set that you could print out..... It's not a difficult job to do.

As an example of what I can do, these are my Chinook ones I was working on for the 1/35th Trumpeter kit....

[St Johns Wort]

Check your PMs

[Wiretensioner]

Interesting AA. I have just checked my log book and April 85 I was on the crewman staff of the OCU and often flew with Chips. Interesting to see some of the students names for that period, both pilot and crewman.

Wiretensioner

[Airborne Aircrew]

Nutloose:

I saw those models with the PIPS and have seen them on Ebay... Unfortunately, they are going for $50 or more meaning that, effectively, I'm paying $50 for the PIPS... :eek:

Wiretensioner:

We know each other then... :ok: It's funny, I don't recall for sure any of the pilots on my course. The crewmen were Dave A*****, John W*****, Niel E****, John O** and myself. I have spoken to Dave and Neil in the last year or so, I know what happened to John W and the last I heard of John O was him being shipped home from Belize and subsequent move to Hercs.

St. Johns:

See yours... :ok::ok::ok:

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Wee Jock Poo Plop McPlop was last seen on VC10's...........shame a certain VC10 Pilot had left by then as they would have been ideally suited to each other :p

[NutLoose]

Buy it, take a mould off it, then re ebay it :rolleyes:

Having probs with photobucket so cannot upload decal sheet image

[Airborne Aircrew]

Nutloose:

You are clearly an experienced modeller. The last model I made was somewhere around 40 years ago and not very well at that. I have a source that, seemingly, makes them irregularly so I'm going to try going down that route first.

SSFP:

I went from Biggin Hill through AAITC, Shawbury, and 240 with him. He have me a lift from Biggin back to Hullavington and when I got out of the car I thought "If the RAF wants him as aircrew I have absolutely no chance"... When I met him at Finningly I was shocked. I still can't understand how he got to 230 but he did. I'm quite sure that the only benefit the RAF ever got from employing him as aircrew was to make the rest of us look good... :}

[TheWizard]

Just buy one of these and customise it yourself!! A lot easier! :E:ok:
Corgi Westland Puma HC Mk.1 ,XW219, 230 Sqn, RAF Benson, November 2009 (http://www.corgi.co.uk/shop/1085/westland-puma-hc-mk1-xw219-230-sqn-raf-benson-november-2009-aa27001/?from_categories=corgi-direct/corgi-catalogue--october-2011--march-2012/the-aviation-archive)
http://www.corgi.co.uk/_images/assets/product-directory/product-large/AA27001-main.jpg