ATPL Schools/Instructors/Courses...teaching the subject, not the exam

[Biggles266]

I'm sure this topic has been raised before so before i get started i apologise in advance.

I have completed ATPL MET and Human Factors and am about to complete my MECIR upon which i shall sit Air Law.

I am wondering if anyone out there knows of any good schools/instructors/courses which teach ATPL subjects.
Now when i say this i mean teach the subjects to the point of actually understanding it, not teaching the exam and how to pass it. I want to understand these for use in the future not just for the exam.

I greatly appreciate any information you may have!

[Aeromuz]

AFT with Nathan Higgins does a very good job of teaching the subject not just the exam however he also gives some pretty good tips for the exams.

It may be expensive but you get what you pay for and finish up with some great texts for future reference.

[ChaseIt]

AFT teach the subject, but they also focus on teaching how to read through all the CASA bull:mad: to pass the exam...

Take flight planning as an example... we all learnt and understood that your fuel burn changes greatly with a difference in weight/temp/FL etc... however we also learnt how to understand what the question was REALLY asking, to then methodically work our way through quickly and accurately so that we didn't have to resit the exam and pay CASA another cent more then required...

Otherwise Rob Avery goes pretty in depth with it all...

[beechie]

Got a 727 job lined up? If not just worry about passing the exam otherwise your wasting your time getting into too much depth. A majority of the information you will rarely ever need to use.

Another vote for AFT

[john_tullamarine]

Got a 727 job lined up

A somewhat short sighted view.

(a) the exercise involves interpretation and manipulation of data. The origin of the particular data set is irrelevant .. it is the technique and strategies which are important. The first aim should be to learn the topic.

(b) the second aim should be to pass the exam. Practice, practice, and past papers is the trick here.

He who omits the first short changes himself. He who omits the second gets to come back for another go.

[ChaseIt]

I have to side with beechie! Although John you have some very fair and vaild points... the Flight planning exam is aged, We are in a computer age and have people sitting in an office punching these numbers into a computer for us, otherwise we have the FMC to help us out in flight...

So except for learning the concepts and understanding why we enter in the information we do, whats the real point in figuring out all the :mad: we have to in the exam? I'd like to hear of anyone in a modern airliner that during an emergency similar to the questions has actually taken the time to work it all out on paper...

Its cause CASA are to lazy to update the exam i say!

[Windshear_ahead]

AFT 100%. I am currently studying Flight Planning at home on my days off. I cant get time off work to do a course full time (Typical GA operators). NH is very helpful over the phone to any little things you may not understand. Otherwise his books go into enough depth.

Got through Sytems and Performance first go so far.... So nothing but good comments about AFT. :ok:

[john_tullamarine]

whats the real point in figuring out all the http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/censored.gif we have to in the exam?

If your interest lies in just passing the exam .. fine.

Sometimes, however, out of left field emergencies can arise where the chap with the background might just be able to perform a little better.

I'm sure others can come up with more than a few examples.

One which comes to mind happened quite a while ago. Bird was a Starlifter (as I recall - but the memory may be a little rusty on that point) from one of the Antarctic bases to NZ. Had a problem on departure and ended up with some of the wheel assemblies down. This became a one off on the run planning and implementation exercise.

They finally recovered to NZ - no doubt with a goodly quantity of sweaty palms.

Now, the other category of fellow who just swots for the exams, passes, forgets the little he may have learned along the way .. might be a bit at sea if faced with such a set of circumstances perhaps ?

[ReverseFlight]

B266, I note you are based in ML. As far as I'm aware, Lionel Taylor is still teaching from his classroom in Bini's at MB.

Sure, Lionel will help you pass comfortably. More importantly, he's a great story teller of topics which will save your bacon later in your career. That's worth more than its weight in gold. :ok:

[waren9]

Agree with your sentiment JT, however the thinking pilot is slowly being regulated out of civil RPT ops. In my time as commercial pilot, flight planning has either been on the back of the fag packet or something electronic fired out by some software.

The variables beyond the legal requirements which rely on experience to judge are the biggest factors concerning flightplanning nowadays. Domestically anyway.

Example. Why bother planning to the nearest 20kg when ATC holding can be anywhere from zero to 25 min on any given SYD arrival.

Having said all that, its a good idea to be aware of all the factors that affect fuel burn and how they might affect you on the day. Keep the study up. Its free and it might just save you some paperwork one day. Or worse.

[ChaseIt]

Sorry JT but warren9 summed it up a little better for me... I Have to also reiterate what i said about learning and understanding the concepts... of course we are going to make a quick calculation however 20kg limits is a little extreme

[Biggles266]

Thanks for the help peeps. AFT is a common answer im getting, any options within the Melbourne area as i have just received a job prospect so if could would love to stay in Melbourne.

[Gmac115]

If Gavin Secomb out at Bankstown can get an idiot like me with no mathimatical ability a pass first go in the very high 90s in flight planning he can do it for anyone. :ok: