Help needed re JSP on housing

[umbrella1]

Hello,

I'm away from work with no access to JSPs and the like and am due to move soon to a station that has a total lack of OMQs and getting SSFA is common. DIO (the new DHE it appears) has told me I'm No11 on the list for a quarter and its an 8 week wait for SSFA. I start work in less than a month; I need a quarter by the end of Sept as I can't move in the Mess as I'll have my baby with me. DIO have intimated that its my problem and that the RAF are not obliged to find /provide me with families accommodation. My husband's in the RAF but away somewhere. Can anyone help with finding me anything in the JSPs that states the responsibilties (or not) that the RAF has in housing their personnel?

Many thanks in advance

[5 Forward 6 Back]

If you have Internet access, Google "JSP 464." It's available on the MOD's regular Internet site.

Best of luck!

[umbrella1]

Great! thank you

[SirToppamHat]

Just in case you haven't found it yet:

JSP 464 Part 1 (UK Fams Accom and SSFA) (http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/3C09CB15-E95C-41CF-8A06-13027254A03B/0/jsp464part1.pdf).

STH

[umbrella1]

I found it thank you :). I am definitely entitled. I do not know if that means that DIO are obliged to accommodate me. It appears that they'd placed me on the waiting list but did not inform me and I think that they assumed that I would just move into the mess while I waited for SFA to be made available. I have explained that thats not an option (in any case the mess struggles to accommodate the singlies) and they are reluctant to find me SSFA on the basis that it is difficult as I have dogs ( I have had SSFA in that location with dogs a year ago and they found me 3 houses to look at). They said 'we don't know what to advise you really'. I don't want to appear prima donna like, but I was surprised by their attitude that its my problem and not theirs to find me accommodation. There are no quarters available comensurate with my rank. I asked about the next grade up pointing out that my husband is a rank higher and they told me that as he is not at this station I am not entitled to the housing grade commensurate with his rank. He will be living there when he returns from being away. The JSP does not mention anything about entitlement where there is a difference in rank between the 2 married serving personnel. I think the next few weeks are going to be lots of fun.

[occhips]

Can i suggest that you touch base with the following at your new base if not done already, try SCSO or OC PSF or even OC PMS. They normally have a direct link to their counterparts in DIO and will or should be able to make this problem go away. I have done it myself when at a base near York a few years ago and it works and i have seen the SCSO put DIO to the sword at a base on the A40 near London. Trust me there are people on a RAF Base who will sort this for you.

Good luck! PM me if you need any more info.:ok:

[umbrella1]

Thanks occhips my next plan was to find the number for the SCSO there in the morning. Its very pleasing to hear that the SCSO was good at that base near the A40....! DIO said they would call me back so if no joy I will get some help on the station <crosses fingers>.

[McGoonagall]

I read and re-read the OP with disbelief. Then I clicked on the supplied link and found after a bit of scrolling down and semi-paralysis of the index finger this little gem.

It is a condition of service in recognition of
their inherently mobile lifestyles, frequently remote bases and terms of service, that
Regular Service personnel are provided with a satisfactory
accommodation solutionIt is not a 'satisfactory accommodation solution', its called looking after your own.

I have been out of the services now for over 15 years but I can not believe that a serving member who is the wife of a serving member who has been posted/drafted to accommodate the service needs, is told 'not our problem mate, sort it'.

Times have certainly changed.

:(

[umbrella1]

Ooh, thanks for pointing out that particular quote McGoonagall! I was going word blind reading through the JSP and that will be very good to quote at DIO in the morning!! It seems that the offices in this particular area struggle with their customer service.....

[Duncan D'Sorderlee]

Mrs D'Sorderlee used to deal with this sort of stuff. She suggested that you call the RAF Families Federation - they are on t'internet. Alternatively, call DIO head office or Yetti Dutton, the head of HIVE GB.

All the best,

Duncs:ok:

[crashtest]

Hi u1. You are not alone in being so poorly treated. A mate of mine is part of a unit that recently moved from 'a secret base in Wilts' to a similar base in Oxon. They have also experienced their own problems housing the influx of new personnel, as I suspect you are well aware. Anyroad, said Mate puts his house in Wilts on the market & clears off on det. for a month leaving Mrs Mate & Matelets at home. House sold within the first week, & Mrs Mate called the appropriate folk to get sorted with SFA. 'None available', came the reply. SSFA? 'Nope'. What do I do? 'Best get yourself on the list for a council house - but don't worry: you'll have quite a strong case because you'll technically be homeless...'. Horrifying, no? All sorted now, but only with the intervention of at least one Wg Cdr. Don't take 'no' from these clowns for an answer. Well done for getting some regs to hit them with; now be ruthless in fighting for what you & your family are entitled to, & don't be scared to ask for high-ranking help. Good luck.

[fergineer]

Put the dogs into kennels that will solve one of your problems and youthen will have more options, I dont think having dogs is a good excuse for not accepting accomodation offered.

[umbrella1]

Thank you all for your comments. Fergineer you will note from my previous posts I did not comment that I was using my dogs as a reason for not getting accn- but that DIO were. I have not refused any accn. None has been offered. I do not think it is acceptable to put my dogs into kennels for 2.5 years. Personal preference and all.......

[Whenurhappy]

Perservere with DIO and OC PMS. If the facts of the case are as you presented them, they are obliged to house you in appropriate accn. However (as colleagues of mine have recently experienced) there can be considerable difficulties in obtaining 'appropriate accommodation' on the open market (ie SSFA or hirings) becasue of the rental ceilings. Bear in mind the reducing 'Home to Duty' support if you are housed off-base; furthermore, unless it has changed recently, you normally can't get government furniture to outfit your hiring.

The staffing process to 'vary' the rules is via your parent unit to PACC Glasgow, and that can be very painful. Increasingly there is little that can be done at local level - ie fewer 'drug deals' can be done these days in order to resolve probelms - especialy oen that involve central contracts such as movement of effects and hosuing.

[airpolice]

From reading of the issues this family are having, you'd think was rocket science trying to work out where to post people!

Did nobody consider that with the OP needing a house, perhaps they should not post her to where there are no houses, or at least not until a house is available?


Obviously if a posting to this particular unit is career advancement by training, then that is different to just a posting. I think it is unreasonable to offer someone a career and then put obstacles like this in their way. Hardly a reasonable way to treat the staff. I wonder if this is just the tip of an iceberg?

There is a separate issue of whether or not a mum with a young child can actually hold down a fully operational job in a modern, lean and effective RAF. My own old fashioned and out dated prejudice aside, the RAF have made a commitment to allow this so they need to make it work.


Umbrella1 deserves to be better treated than this, as do all serving people who are told they need to move. You can’t be part of an enlightened, modern, 21st century, world class business and still expect the troops to put up and shut up.

In the “bad” old days, this situation would not have existed as the OP would not be able to be in the RAF as she has a child to look after.

Nowadays, and I do accept that the current system allows the RAF to have some very good quality people who would otherwise be lost to the service, the top brass need to accept the consequences of allowing this situation to have come up.

Someone at the top seems to have taken their eye off the ball. A look through any of the current back slapping press releases from HQ will show that there is time and effort being expended on less important issues than this.


Perhaps someone from an AFCO would like to comment on how they would respond to a potential recruit asking how this situation would be resolved.

[Clearedtoroll]

I don't think that having a child or having a dog is exactly unusual or unreasonable. If accommodating such circumstances is beyond DIO then we really are stuffed...

[cazatou]

airpolice

It does not appear to me that "someone has taken their eye off the ball". On the contrary - it appears that they have deliberately kicked the ball "into the long grass."

[umbrella1]

Thank you all bar one for the assistance and advice. After some help from the Families Federation (who I had forgotten about until they were pointed out on here :D I have been allocated SFA at a nearby station. The downside is the date of march in is 4 days after I start my handover so I'm currently doing some jiggery pokery to sort out where we're staying in the meantime. 4 days is better than waiting 4 weeks! :) DIO told me they moved heaven and earth to sort it out. Did anyone feel the earth move today?!

[Pontius Navigator]

[COLOR=#000063]Did nobody consider that with the OP needing a house, perhaps they should not post her to where there are no houses, or at least not until a house is available?

All part of life's rich pattern of change.

In the olden days of static establishments, Bloggs retired, Snooks was posted in to replace him and everything was roses, apart that is from the under 25s living in caravans etc.

Then came home ownership, blooming house prices and empty quarters.

Then came the sell off to Annington homes and the run down in the forces continued.

Then came high priced housing areas where you could not buy and lost cost areas where you would not sell and quarters came back in to demand.

Then came the single HQ and the increase in establishment and the tail not so much as wagging the dog and the dog having lost its tail.

And final shot, in the olden days it was quite possible for an RAF officer to be married and have children and dogs and a husband not in the RAF.

[Two's in]

DIO told me they moved heaven and earth to sort it out.

That's code for "somebody actually did what they are paid to do".