O'Leary Would pay €350m to buy a terminal in Dublin.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

O'Leary offers €350m to buy a terminal at Dublin Airport - Irish, Business - Independent.ie (http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/oleary-offers-euro350m-to-buy-a-terminal-at-dublin-airport-2847946.html)

He would even by T2 after all the giving out about it.

[NorthernCounties]

I seen this today, but would we like to see mol have the monopoly on both aer lingus and ryanair and a large stake in Dublin airport... No. I'm personally not a fan of selling of state assets either. Yes it'd get us through now, but what happens during the next recession in 20-30 years time? What do you sell then?

[eu01]

O'Leary would buy the terminal as Michael O'Leary himself or on behalf of Ryanair? It's a big difference to me.

Anyway, to drink some beer one does not have to own an entire brewery, they say.

[j636]

He would be buying it for Ryanair if the following is to go by:


The low-fares airline will have a €3.8bn cash pile at the end of the year, analysts say, meaning it could easily afford to buy a terminal.

[airbourne]

Im sure he could get a terminal in Latvia for a couple of million!!! All this is more bullsh!t to get the Ryanair name in the paper!!

[Jamie2k9]

Dublin Airport would be regarded as a key strategic state asset and is very unlightly to be sold. Many people are opposed to Dublin Airport being privatized. Cork and Shannon will most lightly be sold off in time.

Ryanair will never be able to take over Aer lingus because of competition rules let alone being allowed to own a terminal at a capital city airport.

If MOL had his facts right he would know that T2 didn't cost 1.2billion to build. It cost 600million.

Its very hypocritical of MOL to say break up BAA/DAA monopoly when he would be creating one of his own with Aer Lingus, Ryanair and own a Terminal in Dublin.

As said above its MOL talking a load of Bull****

[NorthernCounties]

Well said Jamie.

[vkid]

While I agree it is O'leary talking waffle again..

but how would him buying a terminal in Dublin be anti competitive ?

As it stands the DAA are the ultimate monopoly...

[aer lingus]

But the EU/IMF/ECB are calling the shots now, they have told the gov that they have to sell off state assets. The reason Greece nearly went down the tubes is because they wer'nt prepared to sell state assets.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Without getting to political, members or the current government have said an attempt to sell it off to be resisted. Dublin airport will not be sold but Cork and Shannon most lightly will.

[ILS25]

He could come up north and buy BFS for £3.50

[Jamie2k9]

Look at it this way the DAA has a death of 1.2 billion and if Dublin Airport is sold the new owners will have to pay off the death and the Gov have said it will be hard to sell Dublin Airport because of its death. So the EU/IMF can demand for it to be sold but they can't tell somebody to buy it. Who would pay 7 or 800million for the airport and then take on the death of 1.2 billion.

[BHD2BFS]

anyone is better than belfast's current owners, i would be happy if MOL bought belfast

[vkid]

I can't ever see Dublin being sold as a whole unit, but parts of it quite easily could be. The IMF/EU won't give a crap if there is money to be got from it and as pointed out they are running the show these days. Would bring down the total debt or death as Jamie2k9 calls it.

I have always thought a competing terminal would be no harm to be honest...not sure O'Leary is the man but it would definitely break up the hold the DAA have over everything.

[Jamie2k9]

I think it will be sold all together or not at all. It wont be top of the list of state assets to go and I don't think it will be sold at all. The Gov don't have to sell all state assets. The airport would make far less than many other state assets.

We agree on one thing O'Leary is not the man.

[racedo]

So the negotiations are starting then..............interesting

Dublin an airport with 1.2 billion in debt with less than 20 million passengers a year
Cork spent €200 million on an airport with less than 3 million passengers...

FR spends €350-500 million on the terminal makes sense because in effect instead of the money being used to line DAA pockets it pays off the loans used to buy it.

No idea how much FR pay DAA in fees per year and other charges but reckon it would pay back in 7 years or less for FR.

FR aren't to blame for DAA mismanagement and as for the cost of T2 well the write off of previous investment brings the cost close to €1.2 billion.

[racedo]

We agree on one thing O'Leary is not the man.

So you would prefer it be sold to some hedge fund whose only aim is to make as much as possible out of it rather than pretty much the most sucessful Irish company over the last 20 years who hates the politicians with a passion.....

Airport owners keep investing because they want to charge more where a FR would do the opposite.

[Jamie2k9]

So you would prefer it be sold to some hedge fund whose only aim is to make as much as possible out of it rather than pretty much the most successful Irish company over the last 20 years who hates the politicians with a passion.....

Airport owners keep investing because they want to charge more where a FR would do the opposite

Dublin doesn't need any investment for many years. Thats why they have the death.

[clareview]

What is this death Jamie2k9 keeps talking about?


The issue of selling state assets is quite simple and has been played out many times in many countries. Every politician agrees that assets need to be sold to help reduce the government debt but once an asset is suggested, they say it should not be that one - the principle is agreed but not the individual case - no politician wants to be unpopular or to make hard decisions.

However, British Airways was sold and has gone from strenght to strenght. The Brisit Airport Authroity was sold and has made major investments since (and has sold Gatwick on with Stansted to follow). BFS was sold to staff etc. and then sold on again.

So selling assets has worked. The issue with airlines is EU competition rules - FR owning EI gives it too big a share of the Irish market. Selling individual terminals does not seem to have been tried much

[JSCL]

Look to Tiger airways in Australia - I remember seeing their own terminal at Gold Coast Airport they had bought off the airport and it did indeed, lack ongoing investment and turned in to a bit of mess, probably still is. I hate flying merely due to the fact I think most airports have an awful experience to offer, imagine Oleary terminal and how tacky it would become, ala Ryanair. If the Ryanair inflight interior is anything to go by, I'd sooner use EI in to Dublin to the main terminal than FR to Oleary terminal.

[clareview]

But do we want fancy buildings, expensive fittings, gold plated taps or do we want to fly as cheaply as possible. Not many bus or railway stations, or even ferry terminals are expected to have the bells and whistles that some think airports should have and which, of course, cost money and the passenger has to pay for

[JSCL]

But bus and train stations don't require me to be there a certain time before departures and have certain security processes to go through before I can travel on them.

Airports are already average experiences. I'm sorry but just because a fare is cheap doesn't mean I'm prepared to be cattle in the FR abattoir.

[EI-BUD]

The debates have raged since way before the 1st sod was turned on the site of T2 at Dublin airport. MOL could have had his own terminal at the airport funded by Ryanair and existing T1 could have been modernised to house all other carriers and alas this new LOCO terminal could have been exclusively Ryanair. Similar to what AirAsia have in KL (bit of a shed that example), and the terminal in Frankfurt. In this way the airport would have a relatively inexpensive journey to modernising T1 and at the same time giving Ryanair a vested interested, i.e. Ryanair somewhat less likely to be doing major scaling back of operations when another row erupts. It's too late for that if FR bought a terminal at DUB it would have to be 1 and there are lots of other carriers who would in effect be FRs customers and would EU rules mind this? Somebody will know better than me...

Baldonnel would have made it all very interesting in terms of FR etc.
I cant see any changes to Terminal ownership at DUB any time soon!

EI-BUD

[NorthernCounties]

But do we want fancy buildings, expensive fittings, gold plated taps or do we want to fly as cheaply as possible. Not many bus or railway stations, or even ferry terminals are expected to have the bells and whistles that some think airports should have and which, of course, cost money and the passenger has to pay for

We don't need gold plating like you'd see in the Emirates, but we need something that makes a good first impression of a country. I think T2 provides this for long haul travels arriving. I remember reading a quote from SAS saying that a well polished cabin crew tells the customer they service their planes well. I think this is transferable on a larger scale. A well designed and professional terminal being your first experience of a country tells you that business is easy in this country.

If MOL owned a terminal on the other hand, adverts would place constantly over the tannoy, there'd be credit card and perfume touts pacing the floors made all the easier by the fact that in the whole of the airport there's only 10 seats which you'd have to pay hourly for. After all, if everyone stands, you can get more people in the terminal. Id dread to think what hygiene procedures are in place.

FYI, don't get me round, I've always enjoyed flying FR and will continue, but I think terminal ownership would be a step to far, albeit a very profitable step to far.

[vkid]

" If the Ryanair inflight interior is anything to go by, I'd sooner use EI in to Dublin to the main terminal than FR to Oleary terminal."

Personally I'd prefer to have the choice.

[racedo]

Dublin doesn't need any investment for many years. Thats why they have the death.

Really ????

So how long is the runway again ?

[racedo]

A well designed and professional terminal being your first experience of a country tells you that business is easy in this country.

Well thats London well and truly :mad: then, given LHR.

[racedo]

It's too late for that if FR bought a terminal at DUB it would have to be 1 and there are lots of other carriers who would in effect be FRs customers and would EU rules mind this?

EU rules would be irrelevant provided that carriers weren't being discriminated against.

If it was such a big issue for EU then no doubt they would have investigated the way Air France get whatever slots become free at Paris airports and everbody else gets SFA.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Really ????

So how long is the runway again ?

The cost of the runway is included in the 1.2billion death. Any work on the runway can't start until 23.5 million passengers is reached.

[eu01]

[off-topic]
As a non-native speaker of English I just wonder... equating debt with death... is it so common thing that already two of you use this association? :rolleyes: - seems somewhat dramatic...
[/off-topic]

[racedo]

The cost of the runway is included in the 1.2billion death. Any work on the runway can't start until 23.5 million passengers is reached.


No it is not because were that the case then DAA would be sitting on a huge cash pile awaiting the runway extension and they aren't.

The DEBT of €1.2 Billion is exactly that.

[EI-BUD]

If it was such a big issue for EU then no doubt they would have investigated the way Air France get whatever slots become free at Paris airports and everbody else gets SFA.

I am in agreement on this re France, and there are so few French Airlines since AF has over time taken many over...

AF seem to get away with murder and have intervened at every turn to interupt FR getting any sort of contribution at French airports.

EI-BUD

[Jamie2k9]

As said the runway cost is not included in the 1.2 billion. It should of being.

When the new runway was announced the planned cost was 255 million but in 2009 the runway was then extended so the cost is gone up to 325 million.

[Sober Lark]

€350,000,000. Sounds like a dream figure picked out of the sky and even at that I'm surprised it didn't even prompt a suitable 'plummet' response in media commentary. So what's the math behind the figure?

[EI Premier]

As said the runway cost is not included in the 1.2 billion. It should of being.

When the new runway was announced the planned cost was 255 million but in 2009 the runway was then extended so the cost is gone up to 325 million. How do you mean it should have been? There is a limit to what any entity can borrow to finance capital investment. Money can't just be borrowed with no guaranteed returns to service the debt.

Whilst the DAA have a long period over which to pay off the debts in question, we will, all else being equal, quite likely see the need for a renegotiation of its' loan covenants in the medium term.

Unless there is a dramatic upturn in the volume of passengers travelling through DUB and associated revenues - something that is HIGHLY unlikely - then the DAA debt levels are correctly classified as disproportionate to their revenue base.

How many years would it take to generate Revenues arising specifically as a result of the runway extension, just to break even on the associated investment Cap Ex costs to lengthen the runway? 20 or more?

I am in agreement on this re France, and there are so few French Airlines since AF has over time taken many over...

AF seem to get away with murder and have intervened at every turn to interupt FR getting any sort of contribution at French airports.It's France unfortunately. France seems to engage in protectionist policies, providing an edge to its' national companies at every turn. ''En France, Nous soutenons seulement les Français'' - or something along those lines.

EI Premier