Plane for 8-10 passengers!?

[Alexander Pichler]

Hi guys,

we are looking for an aircraft which is not older then 15 years (otherwise no registration is possible in Egypt for AOC), and fits 8-10 passengers. Preference would be METP but SETP is also okay.

Has anyone of you got any ideas which turboprop aircraft fit these requirements?

Please let me know.

Cheers,

Alex

[737-NG]

Beechcraft King Air 200

[The Ancient Geek]

Cessna Grand Caravan

[737-NG]

Pilatus PC12

[Alexander Pichler]

Premier I compared to King Air in a cost model?

[flyboy2]

One can continue speculating, but you need to state
budget
mission requirements

Very popular is the Beech 1900.

[Contract Dog]

The mighty Twotter is still in production. all depends what you want, Hawker 850XP?

Dog

[tomcat320]

Take a Q400 and Remote 60 seats :)
Easy, isn't it ?

Greez,
Rainer

[Ghost_Rider737]

Cessna Caravan - PC 12 - King Air 200 - Beech 1900

All the above can do the job. The cost increases up the chain

[cavortingcheetah]

I can't see why you'd have any difficulty finding which aircraft fit the bill for a twin or single reasonably new aircraft that seats 8-10 pax. If you want advice on an aviation forum as to which to buy then you'd really need to provide a lot more information. After all we are not all free aviation consultants and some of us are not even pilots anyway. That having been said and guessing that you'd be operating on an Egyptian registry I would have no hesitation in suggesting and recommending the EMB110. You can Google all the information on the machine that you want. The rugged combination, technical simplicity, PT6 engines, passenger and cargo/baggage flexibility make it a strong contender especially supplied in the simpler, cheaper and less troublesome configuration without a glass cockpit.

[perceval]

Let 410 as usual !!

[Solid Rust Twotter]

Until you define the mission you're just blowing hot air.

[saywhat]

A380 will accommodate 8, 9 or even 10.

[cavortingcheetah]

These chaps could perhaps devise something that would fit the bill and could probably provide a finance plan that won't blow a hole in your budget.

Israel Aerospace Industries Ltd. - Home page (http://www.iai.co.il/22031-en/Homepage.aspx)

[Baron Von Mildred]

You could also consider Cessna F406 Caravan II

[brisdude]

What are you using it for?

Could be anything from a Caravan to a Citation X and everything in between.

[mogas-82]

You should give AN-3 a try. Just get a turbine conversion for an AN-2 and off you go!

If you insist on not using this old and reliable piece of soviet engineering you could try finding a PAC 750

[cavortingcheetah]

Alexander Pichler has flown away? Is that rude of him?

[EladElap]

What about one of these... you could even get free fuel for it off this very forum! :}:}:}

http://www.touroldhamcounty.com/images/ride_balloon_flight-CrawfordHotAirBalloons.jpg

[Alexander Pichler]

Hi guys,

sorry, but I was extremely busy with flying the last days and tomorrow I am leaving for North Africa to meet some people and eventually arrange further things there.

The aim is to tranport tourists with it in the North of Egypt, that's why I was looking for a proper multi turboprop, but considering the current market situation, buying a jet doesn't cost that much more than a proper turbo prop, plus affording the jet comes cheaper with the time than the turbo prop.

The problem is, that it's not allowed to be older than 15 years, otherwise we can't get it registered in Egypt, so many turbo props unfortunately fall out of the segment.

Thanks for your feedback until the current stage, I will get back when back from Africa in 10 days.

Cheers,

Alex

[The Ancient Geek]

Things to consider :-

1) Number of seats - You have already decided.
2) Field types and length - Are any short or rough strips expected
3) Sector length - STOL capable types tend to be a tad slow for anything over about 250 miles
4) Support - generally better for big names like Cessna or Beech, what do the local FBOs and workshops support.
5) Turboprop or jet - Small jets use more fuel, have very cramped cabins and poor short field performance - only consider for longer sectors.
6) Crew availability - Plenty of Caravan or KingAir pilots around.
7) Load capacity - If you are taking tourists to & from hotels they will have a lot of heavy baggage to consider so you may need a larger aircraft.
8) Competitive pressures - If seat price is an issue you need to keep costs down with something like the Caravan.

[Solid Rust Twotter]

Also, what kind of operation are you planning? Will you require all weather ops? Day/night ops? SE IFR may place limitations on you under local regs that could affect how you operate. ME may be a better option, possibly also for passenger insurance purposes.

[Alexander Pichler]

1) Number of seats - 8-10.
2) Field types and length - Long concrete runways, all IFR approaches equipped.
3) Sector length - maximum length of 400nm, flying time maximum of 2 hours.
4) Support - Beechcraft, Cessna and Piper fit best, due to the high proximity of local workers that are familiar with these manufactures, especially Beechcraft.
5) Turboprop or jet - As said not older than 15 years, turboprop not that expensive when buying it but affording and using it mostly ends up with higher costs than for the jet. Affording the jet costs more but using it comes mostly cheaper, thats why I thought of the Premier jet.
6) Crew availability - Certainly a good thought, though I would be flying myself and other crew, doesn't matter on which type is available from my side!.
7) Load capacity - Yes this is true with the tourists, that's why a turboprop would be better in that case, without thinking of any bigger jets like CJ3 or else.
8) Competitive pressures - Yes, and this is another thing, but the hardest is to find a plane that fits apart from the King Air, which is not older than 15 years.

Flying day and night would be planed, IFR of course, all weather ops, well weather in Egypt, mostly not expecting visibility around 200 meters like in Europe, but certainly CAT1 approved commercially.

I am back from Africa, at the moment as you know, August is the Ramadan month, so there is not much going on at the moment with the project. Step by step.

[Iron Duke]

I flew the Rheims Cessna F406 Caravan 2 in the early 90's, and it was a fabulous A/C. 2 500hp PT6A's, giving great reliability and performance.
CAT 1, with a simple but effective Auto-pilot and very straightforward and forgiving to fly .. but equipped with everything you need.
Good baggage capacity behind engine nacelles, and in the long nose.
Unpressurised .. therefore cheaper, but still cruised at 240kts TAS (retractable gear)
Handsome aeroplane as well ...
I don't know too much about availability, or lease rates at the moment but I could not recommend it highly enough ..

[Propellerpilot]

If you can find a Beech 1900D that is not older than 15 years in good condition, I would go for that since you are planning to fly tourists - then you will not run into payload problems in terms of luggage and will give you more flexibility. The operating costs are only marginally higher, than operating a B200. Another option if you want to trade the space for a little more speed, is the B350 - and those are still being produced - brand new.

[Alexander Pichler]

@ I. Duke: That is a very nice plane, indeed, I was looking now for it on the internet, but found out, that only about 100 of them exist, and then ones which are for sale are all older than 15 years, so looking for something which is newer than 1996, can you help?

Yes, 1900 is still the best ciioce, though there is a difference in the purchase price of up to 1,5 - 2 millionens $.

[scarrymike]

A little slower than the Caravan and only eight passenger seats - the Quest Kodiak. Made in Idaho. Send them a check and I will fly it over for you!

When you're not flying tourists you can fly missionaries and convert all those heathen over there. (it was designed with the missionary pilot in mind)

[Alexander Pichler]

Thanks, this is another good advice, though we are trying to focus on a ME due to a lot of facts. Caravan is certainly a nice aircraft and that one as well. Maybe you can think of such an aircraft, a ME that we are looking for!

[Kamalasound]

We have gran caravan's 9 to 12 pax availlable during the winter season on a valid commercial passenger transport EASA AOC.
We have them in Italy but cold relocate one in Egypt if the project is well worth.
Night operations are a problem though unless you get a special permit or derogation from Egypt caa.
Other planes with 9 or more passengers I would say are difficult to find with less than 15 years.

[Alexander Pichler]

Hi,

thanks for the information. In case it is possible to find anything suitable (METP), we will have to step down anyway onto SET. If that is the case, it would be nice to get in touch with you. Thanks again for the information.

Cheers