How did you do it... the work/family juggle.

[knox]

Gidday everyone.
Just wondering how other pilots have got on with finding jobs in the early stages of their careers with a young family in tow.

My current situation is that I have a young family (wife + 1 infant and i'm in my very early 40's, yes a late career change), I have all the usual aviation trimmings - CPL MECIR ATPL(papers only) 1200+hrs TT.
Currently working full-time, but on a low salary and flying single engine only aircraft. I think at this stage of my career I really need to move on to something with more potential for advancement.
The only problem is i'm not sure of the best way of achieving this.

Is there anyone in cyber land that has travelled this path in the past and can offer some sound advice on the best way of moving on ie. leave the family behind travel solo to find work vs taking the family along for the ride, also when applying for a position do i omit some details like dependents etc?

I guess at this stage i should put it out there - if there is anyone out there that is looking for a mature and responsible pilot that will commit for a decent length of time. I'm happy to work anywhere in Australia or New Zealand.... actually i'd consider pretty much anywhere in the world;) PM me.

I thank you for any info you may have offer on this matter.

Knox.

[DUXNUTZ]

I knew a guy who was in his mid to late 30s while we were in training who was in the same situation as you. He got in as a flight instructor (1st job) and stayed on that route before getting hired into an East Coast regional.

Currently Captain at said regional and by all accounts has a pretty good "balance".

IMHO the major thing your gonna run into is trying to make decent scratch the first 5 or so years of your career.

As I said the instructing deal can give you a base in a larger city if that's what your after but there are still options. I would think with 1200 hrs you'd probably be able to get a go in Darwin or similar where you could have a decent career progression from singles to twins to turbine in the one spot.

I also think your age, life experience etc is a definite advantage in the employment search.

-Dux

[rocket66]

G'day Knox,

It's the age old question on how this works. I'm in a similar position but am looking for a first gig. I also have a young baby and wife and shifting around has been discussed. I think it depends on your preference really. The journey can be something to look back on in a few years to laugh about.

If it were me I'd pick an operator where you would like and regularly visit and update hrs. Nothing moves fast in aviation as you know so. Your chances may get better around the hiring season in the north. In the mean time no time like the present to get your ATPLs started if you haven't already.

Best of luck mate

rocket

[Homesick-Angel]

Not having done it myself (Kids, wife or the trip north:}) im probably not all that qualified to help much. But I did come into aviation late in life, and had/have to make choices to stay locally for other reasons which has/will limit my earning potential for a few years at least .

Speaking to friends who made the trip north and got jobs, being there full time was a bonus, but as was stated earlier, being an old fella will be a tick for you I would think, as many operators will know you have commitments other than chasing tail on a friday night.

You could possibly do an initial meet and greet trip, and then if you get any bites at all, head up for a few months during the hiring season. My guess is that doing all this before the little tacker goes to school would be the best??

Good luck.:ok:

[mattyj]

Don't tell them you've got a wife n kids at the interview..spring it when you've got the job..they like you to be "fully flexible" :yuk:

[The Bunglerat]

Agree with all of the above, however no-one has said anything about what the wife & kids think about you pursuing the whole flying circus - & I think that's the clincher. Furthermore, it isn't something you can plan for. Either you get lucky, or you don't. In my case I just got very lucky, because Mrs. Bunglerat was my biggest fan/supporter when I embarked on this crazy adventure. A lot of partners simply wouldn't have put up with all the crap she had to endure for the first few years (I know I wouldn't!), but she stuck by me all the way. When I was feeling the strain, she propped me up. And on the few occasions when she felt it, I reciprocated the gesture.

How do you do it with wife & kids? By having an awesome wife & kids. I hope you're as lucky as I was/am in this regard. :ok:

[ardmorehardcore]

Reminds me of someone at my organisation. He seems to be carrying on like a broken record. Will let you know how he gets on.

[NOSIGN]

Knox,

my advice is to be patient. Something will come along that you know will be right for you and your family.

I wouldnt recommend busting a nut, going solo, leaving your loved ones for an adventure unless either they are unimagineably understanding, you need a break from them, or nothing is going to stop you from getting an airline job.

Youre family will need to be fiercly independant if they follow you on your escapade.

If you are more of a personality described in the second paragraph, understand that it may be a month flying a twin, or it may be ten years before you get a look-in to a... well I was going to say, well paid Pilot job...

cheerio

[knox]

Duxnutz - Thanks, I have some mates in Darwin (single and no commitments) they are struggling to find work at the moment. But I won't let that put me off:cool:

Rocket - Nice to know i'm not alone. A lot of very difficult decisions to make.
I wish you luck in your journey too.

Home sick - The meet and greet would work for me, maybe do a quick trip and leave the fam at home, but then I guess I need to decide how long should the trip be - keeping the fam in mind... fairly tough decision with a new born and first kid to boot.

Mattyj - As much as I'd like to be up front... I think the "oh, did I forget to mention this is my kid" line might be of benefit when one is competing with free and easy youngins:(

The Bunglerat - I very blessed that the wife is very supportive of my career and will follow me where ever I need to be, but not to sure if the next step (job/employer) would be so understanding... however she is very qualified in the finance/accounting sector, so maybe she can score a job near by.

ardmorehardcore - keep me posted.

NoSign - Yep very understanding wife.. she can see that I have limited time to climb the ladder. Have been in my current job for 4 years now and can go no further, airlines are not what I am really aiming for... my dream job would be corporate or working for a private company flying staff around or a gig flying floats would be sweet too. I feel I am more suited to the GA sector.

Thanks for the replies.... please keep the suggestions coming... it does make me feel there is some light at the end of the tunnel.

Knox.

[The Green Goblin]

I wouldn't start whinging yet.

At 1200 hours you have a long way to go. That's the problem though, every pilot is very ambitious and wants things to happen now. They get impatient and moody when they perceive nothing is happening, or they think their career is stalling because they haven't got employers lining up to hire them. It's a bit like fishing, you just need to wait it out.

Enjoy the flying you are doing. I miss the freedom of single engine VFR ops and the random interesting places you go. No two days are ever the same.

None of that happens when you are flying the bigger stuff. It becomes boring, regimented and routine with minimal variety.

[norwester33]

Do you have a wife and kids?

[Captain Nomad]

Do you have an understanding of how the industry works?

[Howard Hughes]

Ditched the first wife and found one that was more caring and understanding, it also helps that she has always known me doing what I do now.

Sadly I am not the only one who has gone down this path....;)

[The Green Goblin]

Do you have a wife and kids?

That is affirmative :ok:

[knox]

GG - I don't think i'm whinging, just after some sound advice from others that may have been down this path before. I'm not in a huge rush to get to the pinnacle of my career but would like to move on to something that offers some form of advancement ie. light twin maybe some turbine time.

NW33 - yes

Capt Nomad - I'd like to think I have an OK understanding of the "beast" ;) But with 1200hrs i'm no expert.

HH - I'm happy its all working out for you now.

Knox.

[The Green Goblin]

GG - I don't think i'm whinging, just after some sound advice from others that may have been down this path before. I'm not in a huge rush to get to the pinnacle of my career but would like to move on to something that offers some form of advancement ie. light twin maybe some turbine time.

Just put the resume out there and see what it brings. You need to get 500 multi command before you get on a turboprop. So I'd be aiming for an operator with this type of progression. Obviously you don't need 500 multi to fly a turboprop, but if you want a hassle free command upgrade I'd be aiming for it pretty quickly.

The usual suspects are there to send your resume to for that next step. Wait till you get a bite.

Age means nothing unless you want a command before you die at Qantas. I know guys that got into Jetstar/Virgin in their 40s (admittedly during the hiring boom) after starting late.

Chin up, you'll be right :)

[Di_Vosh]

Some pretty good advice here.

My thoughts:

First and foremost:

You need an understanding and supportive partner/family. By this I mean that they'll be willing to have you work at some remote location and see them a few days per month. Or that they'll come with you and are happy to live in, say, Tennant Creek, while you're there flying. Without a supportive wife you'll either not succeed in aviation, or you will succeed but as a single man.

Second is finance.

There is no point in sacrificing your existing career to become a pilot if you become bankrupt before you acheive your goals. Do your sums as to whether you can leave your family behind while you're up north or if you can bring them with you. Similar for paying off home loans, etc.

With both of the above, assume that you're going to be up there for twice as long as you'd like to be, and earning around 2/3 of what you'd like to earn.

In my case, I told my partner that I'd probably be away from Melbourne for around 18 months before I could get a flying job in Melbourne. In all, it took me 2 1/2 years. (Four years if you include an overseas trip with the army which helped to fund my time in Darwin and Mildura). The added costs of me living in Darwin and Mildura over 2 1/2 years was around $30,000.00.

It can be done.

DIVOSH!

[Howard Hughes]

HH - I'm happy its all working out for you now.
Thanks Knox, I am very happy now and have two kids to boot!;)

On a serious note, my only advice would be always put your family first.:ok:

[PA39]

For me it was an enormous strain on my marriage and family but something i was prepared to sacrifice all for (young and stoopid!). hOWEVER THANKS TO A VERY UNDERSTANDING WIFE we got through it. Funny thing my three children could recite the phonetic alphabet by the age of 3 and identify morse code by the age of 6. By that time they had been to almost every airport or airfield or ALA throughout Oz!!

Now at the dinner table and ages 36, 34 and 32 with 5 grand kids the conversation often evolves around their childhoods being spent at airports!! PLUS they can all still recite the phonetic alphabet and remember tail numbers of aircraft they had travelled in. Lost count of how many times on short finals my wife would say "hurry up, she's green" only to wear a load of vomit to the back of my head. If only i could turn back the clock......I'd do it all again!!

[knox]

GG - Cheers mate, chin is up :ok: CVs in the post... well a work in progress. I tell myself age means nothing all the time, normally just prior to falling asleep on the couch at 2000hrs;) much to the amusement of my much younger flatmates.

Di_Vosh - I agree there is some awesome advice in this thread and i'm very thankful for that. Luckily I have a very supportive lady, but I can't help but feel a bit of a assh:}le, leaving her and the wee one to chase the dream, mind you my old man was air force and he was posted all over the place and my mum did a pretty good job. As for the finance, that could be a problem, barely making ends meet on my very small salary (wont tell you how much.. you would never believe me:O). But i'll make it work somehow... thanks for the advice.

HH - I hear you mate... will be keeping them in first place.

PA39 - Great yarn, sounds like you had a excellent time. I hope to have some stories like that to tell in another few years.

Knox.