TA Aviation/ MK Flying School Cranfield- Ops Suspended

[S-Adams]

Not posted on pprune before, but couldn't find anything on this and wanted to warn other potential customers.

I will shortly be moving to the Milton Keynes area and was looking for a flying club to hire from and just heard some disturbing news from a friend. Apparently all TA Aviation/Milton Keynes Flying School operations were suspended by Cranfield on thursday. My friend tells me that rumors have been circulating Cranfield for some time and that the owner was recently MOR'd by Cranfield ATC. I'm amazed at what a short phone call to a friend has revealed and seems to have been common knowledge at Cranfield for some time.

Hopefully no unsuspecting students will be out of pocket due to this suspension... Has anyone else heard more?? Might start looking elsewhere!

[Genghis the Engineer]

I think if I was looking for "sensible" (reasonable price and reasonable aeroplane) rental at Cranfield, having hung around there a fair bit over the last few years, and flown the aeroplanes of most of the "FBOs" at Cranfield, I'd look at Billins. (http://www.billins-air.co.uk/) All companies have their faults of-course, and Cranfield itself is far from perfect, but they seem the least problematic of those I've had any dealings with there. That said, the company you've mentioned, I've so far missed - looks like I have done for good now :}

As for common knowledge - first I'd heard of it, and I'm there a lot, and there's never a shortage of airport gossip at EGTC. Possibly somebody's just been bending your friend's ear at some point and I wouldn't discount the possibility that what you're hearing is all nonsence.

If it's a permanent move, the best deals at EGTC tend to be a share in a syndicate who lease their aeroplane back to one of the flying schools when it's not being used by syndicate members. I certainly know of a C150, AA5 and PA28 operated that way at Cranfield, and there are almost certainly some others that I don't know. Typically the schools tend to have first call at weekends, but if you do most of your flying in the week, you can generally do very well.

G

[S-Adams]

Thanks for the recommendation Genghis. As I said new to the area, so any information is appreciated. I'll have a look at Billins, also thinking of popping into Bonus for a look as well.

[Genghis the Engineer]

Feel free to PM me if you want to meet over a cup of tea sometime and chat about flying at Cranfield. As I said, I'm around fairly regularly and know the place as well as most.

G

[Miroku]

I would suggest you consider Turweston. About 40 minutes from Milton Keynes and a great deal less taxiing than Cranfield!

[trebor_hub]

Hi Sadam,
I've just found this post on TA Aviation Ops Suspension. I had a trial flight with them only last month! I had a superb time and its really increased my ambition to become a profesional pilot. Infact I might start my PPL training with TA Aviation after I've got a bit of cash together.

TH

[Genghis the Engineer]

From what I'm hearing around Cranfield over the last couple of weeks, it is a lot more than just a rumour. Sounds like some fairly sound reasons behind the school being closed down as well.

Doubtless more official stuff will come out in due course, so I'm not going to repeat what I've heard since doubtless some of it is exaggerations, just say that if any of it is true, the CAA were quite right to contribute to the school's closure.

G

[ziggy88]

Hi All,
This is my first post here, so hello everyone!
I am really gutted that they have been shut down! Here's my story.
I had a trial flight booked (was a xmas prezzy!). I thought I would wait until the "summer" to take the flight when the weather was clear and sunny etc. I spent about two weeks trying to get through to them on their phone number, and by email and heard nothing.
Finally I contacted the airport administrators and they told me that they have had their buiness suspended by the CAA.
The lady said that it will be atleast three months before they are up and running again?
Will they be up and running again?
What has happened to them? It all seems shrouded in secrecy. No message on their website and no information at all!!
I obviously want my money back so I can get flying at another school at Cranfield!:)

Anyone with any info please pm me as I am interested. Thank you.

[Sir George Cayley]

Ziggy,

The money you want back, is that for the trial flight or have you paid more up front?

SGC

[ziggy88]

Hi SGC,
It's just for the trial Flight. Do you think this might be a problem?

[Sir George Cayley]

I honestly think you can wave goodbye to your money, sorry. The way these things tend to go is the business folds and leaves creditors out of pocket. The VAT man is usually 1st in line to pick over the bones and unfortunately you are way down at the bottom.

In order to get anything back the business would have to go into receivership and then you lodge a claim as a creditor. I've heard of major insolvencies where 10 pence in the pound gets paid out.

That's why I asked if you'd paid upfront for the course as that would be a very bitter pill to swallow.

The only thing I can suggest is to visit other establishments at Cranfield and see how willing they are to help. Meanwhile keep trying with the school to see if they will honour your booking at some time in the future.

Good luck,

SGC

[ziggy88]

Hey SGC,
Thank you for your quick reply.
So the company have gone bust essentially then? I thought there was some sort of breaking of the CAA law or something.
That is such a bummer! I am glad that I didn't have thousands paid upfront for the full PPL!
What I have managed to do, as I was getting no response from the company telephone number or email, is get a letter sent to the milton keynes flying school's owner (Terry) I believe. The administrators at Cranfield have been really helpful and have said they will forward it to his address as they cannot give it to me because of data protection, which is fair enough.
I just hope that I at least get some response, the one thing that really gets my goat in these situations is the lack of information available to the customer! Rumours and here say don't satisfy me!
Anyone else who is looking to try and get their money back may find the above information helpful maybe!

On a side note, I will obviously be looking to go elsewhere, I spoke to a chap from Cranfield Flying School last night and he seemed good, they said I could do my PPL pay as you go. Are they likely to go bust, lol? One bad experience has scarred me now!

Thanks for all your help.

[UV]

ziggy
I suggest you very quickly read up on the many posts on Pprune about not paying anything up front in cash.

[ziggy88]

Hi UV,
Yeah thanks for that, as mentioned it was a Christmas present so it was like a voucher.
But I will inform people not to bother in the future and just write me an IOU or something lol:ok:

[wsmempson]

If your flying lesson was paid for with a credit card, you have protection under the consumer credit act, and should be able to recover the money.

[Genghis the Engineer]

In perspective, we're presumably talking about a 30-60 minute trial flight costing somewhere in the range £100-£200. Painful, but a tiny amount compared to a whole PPL course of £6k or so.

G

[Sir George Cayley]

Just to be fair and clear I don't know this organisation's solvency and its current trading position.

What I was trying to spell out is an oft told tale found here with regular monotony. Hence why the last line about keeping on trying should still stand until any official notice appears.

Keep us all posted if you make progress.

SGC

[Camion]

Yes - Terry Ackeryod has taken £155 from me for a one-hour flight for a friend on her retirement knowing full well he couldn’t provide the service. The man’s little more than a thief.

[Duckeggblue]

Yes - Terry Ackeryod has taken £155 from me for a one-hour flight for a friend on her retirement knowing full well he couldn’t provide the service.
That is certainly not good news - but maybe it is all just a "paperwork" problem with the CAA and will be resolved - at CAA pace :zzz:

[Genghis the Engineer]

I'm no expert on law, but isn't this something called "theft", and can and should be reported to the police?

G

[Duckeggblue]

Possibly is theft, but was looking at what Ziggy said The lady said that it will be atleast three months before they are up and running again?
and wondering if Camion was looking at a delay rather than worse.

[znww5]

Just as an aside for people in the MK catchment area, there is also Pilot Flight Training at Hinton in the Hedges - about 35mins from Milton Keynes.

They have recently expanded their fleet, adding a Piper PA28 and PA38 Tomahawk to the Cessna 150 and T61 motor glider. According to a pal of mine who visited recently, the aircraft are well looked after and the hire and training rates are very reasonable.

Clive Stainer who runs the operation, has an excellent reputation and is a highly experienced flying instructor who is also an examiner. The school number is: 01295 812775.

And no, I'm not a member of the school!

[VictoriaB]

My husband also bought me the one hour flying lesson for Christmas and I also was waiting for the Summer.

I have left messages but neither of the phone numbers are being answered, the website page does not appear to exist and the email address is bouncing back as delivery fail. Not looking good.

[ziggy88]

Hi Everyone,
Just wanted to update you all on the situation.
I have sent Terry Akeroyd a final demand letter to his home address first class recorded. I have evidence that he received the letter personally, he actually signed for it himself.
Basically trading standards have informed me that if he doesn't respond to the letter within 28 days of receiving it, I can proceed to a small claims court.
So far it has been a week and nothing.....I think I know the result of this, however it is a process that has to be done before proceeding to court!

Unfortunately leaving messages on answer phones or emailing is not the way forward, I have been to Cranfield on several occasions to see if anyone knew anything, the hut from which TA aviation were operating is completely empty and all phone numbers were routed there.
Best idea is to try and get his home address and do what I have done. It's a little tricky to find but a good bit of detective work and I promise you it is out there!

At the end of the day, the half decent thing to do would be to contact all the people for whom he had booking and explain the situation.
Not to be a COWARD and disappear off the face of the planet!

VictoriaB you are in the exact same situation as me, also you had the same idea about summer, I am glad I am not the only one!

Also after speaking with many people at Cranfield the rumour is that Terry Akeryod "folded the company". Not sure why when or what the CAA have to do with it, but maybe we'll never know!?

Piece of advice for anyone wanting to buy a trial flight for a christmas/birthday present.
Just write in a card that this is what you have bought them, and don't pay until the day they are ready to fly!

If anyone has had any other luck please let me know.
Good Luck to everyone!

[cockney steve]

It's my understanding that if Mr. T.A. is a director of a LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY, he cannot be held personally liable ,UNLESS the company was being traded fraudulently ( knowingly insolvent)

If he was a sole trader or a partnership, the buck DOES stop with him.- That's why it is a lot easier to get bank-loans/finance for a business that is not limited.....you risk everything you own if it all goes t**s up.

Even if he took your money personally, provided it was a solvent limited co., he was acting as an employee. not a morally correct mode of conduct, but probably a legal one.

NEVER pay all up front, dodgy people don't just do building work, double glazing or repair cars :}

[ziggy88]

The other day I was driving in my car and my mobile phone rang, I pulled over to answer it (as everyone should!) and it was a solicitor calling on behalf of Terry saying that basically he has declared bankruptcy and that his assets have been sold.
So the porta-cabin and his three planes have been liquidated into cash.
Obviously I asked the burning question, "will I get any money back?", the lady assured me that there would be some form of payout, but was unsure of exactly what that would be. She asked for my address and yesterday I received a letter outlining his entire business debts and assets, let me just say it is not looking pretty!
It was a rather long legal piece of jargon and I can't quite make out whether I will be seeing any of the money, however it would appear to probably be around 1p/£1 or something ridiculous like that.

I am actually really frustrated because it says in the letter a little sob story about how the company struggled back in April or something, blah blah. It's all just really frustrating.
I think the law or whatever should certainly be changed in these area's because consumers, which is what we are not creditors, are getting shafted. Some big companies have fallen and affected many customers.

But anyway, if anyone hasn't received a call or a letter and would like the address/phone number of the company dealing with it then please PM me and I will be happy to give that to you. You might end up getting enough for an ice cream to enjoy on this hot hot weekend which would have been perfect for flying :mad::ugh::{

Thanks for all your advice help and support regarding this!

[benppl]

I wouldn't count on seeing a penny back unfortunately. If the business books were that bad then HMRC will have first shout on all there money (including any fines, which rack up at a unbelievable rate)
There is a basically a hierarchy of debtors who get paid from whatever assets are tied to the LTD company then they throw a few penny’s at the public who put there hard earned in.

Don’t let it put you off flying though!
:ok:

[ziggy88]

Hi Benppl,
Basically I asked this when the lady first called me and she seemed to think that there is no longer this hierarchy as you describe. I was pleasantly surprised when she said this and thought there mat be an opportunity to get a little bit back.

However you are probably correct regarding the HMRC, oh well fingers crossed. I am just happy to hear SOMETHING, rather than the nothing-ness that was heard until this phonecall, despite several letters to Terry's home address, with proof of him signing for them!

If anyone is still interested in atleast attempting to get some money back then please, PM me and I'll give you the details of this company.

It certainly won't be putting me off flying, accept for the fact that I will probably have to wait to be able to afford a flight now!

Will still be persuing British Airways next year also once I have my degree!

[flyinhatter]

I would be interested to hear from any members of what was the Falconer Flying Group (run by Terry Akeroid). A number of us paid £4,500 to join the group which provided an a/c to fly at group rates. In September, TA told me that effectively the shares in the group "died" when he crashed G-AVGD and it was written off. If that was the case, are there any members out there that received their share of the insurance payout?

[AC-DC]

If you OWN a share in the aircraft then you should have an equall share of the insurance pay ouy. If you paid for a share in a 'Non Equity' group then treat it as a club membership, you are not an owner andno one owns you anything.

[captain_flynn]

Is that the same company that owned G-BMVL (An ex BA flying club tomahawk) ? I had wondered why I hadn't seen it about recently.
Abit of a bad time of late for flying schools at Cranfield it appears.

[billiboing]

What is interesting is that the PA38 BMVL was transferred and sold AFTER he stopped flying. Surely he knew by then that he was bankrupt.

IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT REGISTRATION OF AN AIRCRAFT DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY MEAN OWNERSHIP and if it could be proved that BMVL was sold when the administrators should have been called in then that might be interesting

[znww5]

Looking at Companies House records, neither TA Aviation nor MK Flying School have ever been registered - so it appears that neither were limited companies.

The Individual Insolvency Register shows that a bankruptcy order was made at Bedford County Court in regards to Terence Akeroyd on 17th August 2011, an automatic discharge of the bankruptcy will be made on 17th August 2012.

G-INFO shows that the PA38 G-BMVL was owned by Mr Akeroyd and there were two other aircraft on site as I recall. G-AXIO (a PA28 -140 without toe brakes) which was also owned by him and an unstrutted high wing Cessna, registration and ownership status unknown.

Both the Pipers appeared on the flyer.co.uk sales site for £15k each and the ownership of both passed to the same individual in Leighton Buzzard on 14/09/11.

So it would appear that he operated as a sole trader, the business failed, he was rendered bankrupt and the assets were sold off.



As for G-AVGD from the Falconer Flying Group, this is shown as having been solely owned by Mr Ackroyd on G-INFO, the details describing him as the 'Trustee' of that group. If the record is accurate and he was the sole owner, presumably any insurance payout would have gone to him.

[smeegal]

For those of you who wish to see Terry Ackeryod I have been informed that he has started a share group at Shuttleworth with G-AXIO (confirmed by Shuttleworth on the phone)

Personally I would use any of the schools still based at Cranfield and can definately vouch for Cranfield Flying school