Combat aircraft without combat

[Dr Jekyll]

I've been wondering how many military combat aircraft saw service without either using weapons in anger or making wartime QRA or patrols.

Obviously there are grey areas here but post WW2 ones that spring to mind include (as far as I know):

B36
B47
B58
Gloster Javelin (I think)
Victor (but did operate as a tanker for combat missions)
Shackelton
Scimitar
Supermarine Attacker (or did Pakistan use them against India?)

Any suggestions or corrections?

[Wander00]

I remember a QFI at Cranwell who won a DFC for using a Shackleton as a ground attack aircraft in the Middle East - "Daddy" Etches? Sounds like used in anger!

[VOD80]

Don't know if it counts as "patrols" but I remember watching Javelins flying in Zambia during the time of UDI in Rhodesia.

[Compass Call]

The Shackelton was used as a bomber in the Middle East. Quite effectively too I believe.
They were used in the Jebel Akhdar campaign in Oman in the 1950s. Take a look at this site by Laurence Garey.

The Jebel Akhdar War - lgarey (http://sites.google.com/site/lgarey/jebel-akhdar)

CC

[NutherA2]

or making wartime QRA or patrols.

I remember watching Javelins flying in Zambia during the time of UDI in RhodesiaI flew QRA scrambles in the UK and FEAF as well as many "combat patrols" in Singapore/Malaya and Borneo in the 1960s during the Indonesian Confrontation, all with full loads of weapons; do these count?:confused:

[Fareastdriver]

The Javelins were also sent to India during the Indo Chinese confrontaion in the Himalayas.

[Dr Jekyll]

So Javelin and Shackelton are off the list, any other amendments/suggestions?

[Krakatoa]

I do not think it was "in anger" but I remember dropping fifteen one thousand pounders from a Shackleton on a "target" and just to show there no hard feelings the front gunner joined in with two 20mm.

[sandiego89]

While not used in combat in the bomber role, the B-47 did have some cold war incidents that turned hot, including being fired on (and returning fire) while in Soviet airspace on spy missions. Some EB-47's wer also used in Vietnam for electronic support.

An interview with some crew members that were intercepted:

Secret War with Russia (http://www.netnebraska.org/extras/statewide/pers/sac.html)

[sandiego89]

Perhaps also in the gray area is the F-106, they did deploy to Osan to bolster air defenses, and were there for the Pueblo crisis.

[sandiego89]

How about the SAAB family? A quick search shows "no shots fired" by the Viggen.

Draken? Lansen? Think the Tunnan did some UN patrols.

[sandiego89]

Last one, CF-100 Canuck? Deployed to the Congo, but perhaps not "wartime".

[Loki]

Fairey Gannet?

[innuendo]

F-89 Scorpion. F-102.

[VX275]

EE Lightning? Certainly in UK service - although I await to be proved wrong.

[Dr Jekyll]

I think the Saudis used their Lightnings for a few ground attack missions.

[Harley Quinn]

I seem to recall reading in Rob Jacksons V bombers book that, contrary to the OP Victor was the only V to drop weapons in anger (the book was published in 1981 I think) so didn't cover Black Buck. Can't find it now but would it have been used during the Borneo conflict?

[ian16th]

HQ,

The Valiant's dropped live bombs at Suez, 1956. The Vulcan was used for Black Buck and the Victor was used for tanking for Black Buck and Gulf War I.

All 3 V's saw 'active' service.

[Ian Corrigible]

The F-102 saw extensive combat in SEA.

The P-59 can go on the list, as can the F11F (if the self-fragging incident is overlooked).

I/C

[bvcu]

Didnt the Victor do some radar recce sorties in falklands ? also scimitar in Aden shore based whilst carrier in area did some ground attack missions , sure those who were there will let us know !

[sandiego89]

A few more possibles from the Soviet side:

Myasishchev M-4 Bison
Tupolev TU-28, interceptor
Yak- series of postwar jets
Mig-9

Still active:
IL-38 MAY
TU-95 BEAR

Japan:
Mitsubishi F-1
F-2

[Exnomad]

Bearing mind that throughout the cold war many RAF and RN aircraft would have carried live stores on deployment and patrols in case the cold war became hot while on deployment.
At the start of the Falklands war certain weapons had to be sent home because the government did not want them lost as sea.
I know this was not combat, but could have become so while airborne.

[Ian Corrigible]

sandiego89:

Tu-28 is a good catch (analogous to the F-106). The M-4 and Tu-95 were both used in Afghanistan, though.

I/C

[havillandhornet]

The Ryan fireball made a few deployments between 1945 - 1947 without seeing any combat.

What about the Grumman Guardian ?

[sandiego89]

I/C, Good catch on the Guardian, F-89 and F-11 Tiger. Roger on the Bear and Bison, wasn't aware of those. Withdraw Bear and Bison.

Still feel confident with my SAAB Viggen/Draken/Lansen nominations.

My sources confirm the F-102 and Lightning (Saudi) with active use.

[dakkg651]

Was the Cougar ever used in action?

[N707ZS]

SAAB Viggen/Draken/Lansen nominations.

Were any of them involved in the Gulf War early days mass bombing.

[Brewster Buffalo]

How about the Mirage IV, the Aeritalia G91, Yak 36 "Forger" or the North American F-5E/F

[Harley Quinn]

Mirage IV as a nuke delivery system - no, but the later PR variants were used over Iraq Bosnia and Afghan.
G91s were used by Portugal in Portuguese Guinea, losing a number to SAM 2 missiles.
Four YAK38 were briefly trialled in Afg during the Soviet involvement in that country. Apparently it didn't do 'hot and high' too well, but combat sorties were flown.
Not sure if North American had anything to do with F5s but the Northrop F5E was successful in a conflict between North and South Yemen, the F5Es of the North being operated by ROCAF pilots.

Four Grumman F9F-8T Cougar (TF9J)- the training variant- were used to direct air strikes in South Vietnam in '66-'67

[Dr Jekyll]

Supermarine Swift?

[Mrs_Trellis]

A very interesting thread. May I offer (in my drunken haze) the:

Sea Vixen
Sea Venom

[Harley Quinn]

Sea Venom (& RAF Venom) Op Musketeer 1956
Sea Vixen & Swift good call

[sandiego89]

How about the Douglas F4D Skyray?

[Kitbag]

And the Washington?

[henry crun]

Washington does not count because it was just the RAF's name for the B29.

[Kitbag]

HC, you are of course correct, had it in my head that RAF Washingtons were the B50.
My head hangs in shame.
Now what about Su 15 Flagon, I know one was responsible for KAF 007.

[Brewster Buffalo]

If not the Venom how about the Vampire F1/F3 or FB6?

or F-84 Thunderjet/Thunderstreak/Thunderflash

McDonnell MF-3B Demon?

[Kitbag]

BB I refer you to this quote (lifted from the Mil thread about flypasts) from the classic aviation film Airplane (so it must be true, I saw it in a cinema)
;
Ted Striker: My orders came through. My squadron ships out tomorrow. We're bombing the storage depots at Daiquiri at 1800 hours. We're coming in from the north, below their radar.

Elaine Dickinson: When will you be back?

Ted Striker: I can't tell you that. It's classified. followed by footage of F84s which actually flew 86,408 missions in Korea.

Can't find a solid reference to early Vampires being used in combat, the F1 and 3 were British Commonwealth use only, apart from a few which went to that well known belligerent country of Norway.

You're right with the Demon too, more as a result of the speed at which aircraft were developed, deployed and retired than any failing of the type. There just wasn't any war for it to participate in between 1956 when it entered service and 1964 when it was withdrawn. I guess this is the same for a lot of types mentioned so far.

Edited to add If I was as clever as I sometimes think I am I would have said the Thunderstreak/Thunderflash had the same problem as the Demon, they just were't in service when the shooting started. If the Cold War had turned hot though... the Thunderjet did serve with a lot of NATO air forces.