Day in the life of an Instructor v Day in the life of a charter pilot

[Roxy_Chick_1989]

Im approaching the point where that decision needs to be made. Would appreciate some 'testimonials' from those who have been there and done that with the above professions.

[The Bunglerat]

Yeah, but with a bare bones CPL, who's going to let you anywhere near a Chieftain? At the end of the day, you consider what type of qualification will maximise your employability - & go with that. And I'm not saying one is better than the other, although IMHO experience in both is ideal, as opposed to all of one or the other.

[empty_seats]

you'd be surprised actually these days

[Digaf]

If you want to be an instructor because you want to get something out of teaching people how to fly and you think you will like that type of work, including potentially watching 50 circuits a day from the rhs then go for it.

If it is purely a hours building and a 'i want to stay in a capital city' exercise then i suggest you are doing it for the wrong reasons. Charter can have its boring bits/moments but it is extremely character building.

How many pilots regret going up north or out bush as opposed to instructing? VERY FEW
How many instructors regret not doing ga in the outback? A LOT

At the end of the day it is your choice, you have to be happy with what ever you are doing. You will also find that as your career progresses your desire to pump out hours will slowly get replaced by your desire to have a good work / life balance.......and if you do get to experience it, you will make a sh*t load of mates and friends, and have some of the best times of your life doing ga as opposed to instructing.

And to whoever said that you wont get a job on a chieftain with 200 hours, yes that would be extremely unlikely but has happened to two mates of mine....came down to hard work, luck and who they knew......

GOOD LUCK

[Howard Hughes]

you'd be surprised actually these days
It would seem the requirement for two 'lunar landings' has been dropped as pre-requisite to fly the Chieftan...;)

[das Uber Soldat]

If you instruct, be prepared to put up with being viewed as incapable by muppet charter pilots and their CP's. There is definitely a stigma attached to instructors in regards to their ability to fly and operate in the 'real world'.

This despite the fact that once I moved into charter, it was immediately clear everyone is just as bad ;)

Instructing Pros:

- Good hours. Rarely start before 6, no 16 hour days etc.
- Often good people company. I fly boxes around these days so I pass my fellow employees like ships in the night. In contrast I still regularly socialize with my old instructor mates.
- 'You don't have to go'. Ill get to what that means in a bit.
- Can be good pay. Starts out bad, but I ramped up to 60K within the first 2 years, which is fine. Not many people in a chieftan making 60K.
- Rewarding - Sending a good kid first solo, watching them knock over flight tests, very rewarding. You form real friendships with these people. I still talk to so many to this day.
- The best place to develop your knowledge of Aviation. Provided you're not a slack ass, by going over the theory so often, teaching it in on the ground and in the air, you'll have an excellent handle on all things theory. Things that draw the blankest of blank faces on many low time charter pilots.
- Flyaways! Sounds stupid but the ability to just decide you want to go place X for the weekend, Hamilton Island or something, is fantastic. Students love it and you can have some magic experiences.
- Planes slightly less likely to kill you. This is in my experience only though, I assume there will be instructors who tell you that at place X the planes are pretty bad. I suppose investigate this before you start.

Instructing Cons:

- The paperwork. The endless, pointless, horrible paperwork.
- If you're in a sausage factory, can be significantly less enjoyable.
- You don't get to fly much.
- The circuit. You will learn to dread the circuit.
- The repetition can get a bit much. Doing the same lesson 4 times in 1 day. Bleh.
- Flying 6 times in 1 day. Also bleh.
- Absolute bastard to build twin time. Unless you're there forever.
- You won't progress as fast as a charter pilot.
- Sham contracting is everywhere.
- Putting up with muppet charter pilots who despite getting an ESIR the day before for blasting straight through CTA, will label you a circuit queen :ugh:
- Not very exciting aircraft.
- Sim supervision. I always hated sim supervision. You can't log it, its pointless for you professionally.

Charter Pros:

- Exciting aircraft (at least compared to a C152)
- A real feeling of being out there and doing what you've trained for.
- Challenging and interesting flying.
- Developing your decision making skills.
- Enjoyment of seeing the correct heading, and altitude, for extended periods of time. That will only make sense to instructors I feel ;)
- Autopilots!
- Fast hour building. Faster progression. From my viewpoint, charter pilots definitely seemed to progress onto airlines faster than instructors. This may not be fact, just the way I saw it happen over the 4 or so years I instructed.
- Much easier to build twin time once you're endorsed.

Charter Cons:

- The hours can be horrid.
- 'You're going'. Contrary to what I mentioned above, its not like instructing where you spy a bit of weather and cx the flight. You're going. Obvious things like fog etc you're going to sit on the ground, but other than that, you're expected to go. Cells? Fly around them. Sev Turb? Do up your seatbelt. You get the idea. Now I'm not saying 'you have to go', i'm saying 'you're expected to go'. Note the difference. What you actually do is up to you.
- Easy to let your knowledge and standards slip. Ask the average low time charter guy/gal to describe the difference between power and thrust, or draw the power graph with all the relevant points on it. There will be always be an argument as to how relevant all this is, but you get the idea.
- Pay is generally bad. Not until you're in the left seat of a turbo prop do you really face the prospect of being payed anything approaching livable.
- More difficult to get a job in a major city.

I always wanted to pursue both forms when I started out. So I started in instructing, moved through and ticked all the boxes then transferred over to charter starting on a little piston twin and working my way up to the left seat of a > 5700kg turbo prop. I feel richer for having done both, however I acknowledge that the people who started at the same time as me, but avoided instructing, all progressed into a big plane much faster than I did.

All the above is my opinion only. Good luck with your decision.

[aileron_69]

Why just limit the Choices to Charter and Instructing? Its a very narrow minded take on aviation. Last time I looked there are a lot more different types of flying out there you can do and most pay better than both these options.....just a thought

[engine out]

No charter today? Wash the plane
To windy for circuits today? Was the plane
To wet outside for either? Turn on the photocopier or letter box drop fliers

the joys of GA whichever way you go

[aileron_69]

No survey today cos its too wet/cloudy/plane broke? Not to worry, stuff washing the plane, might just watch tv for the day and still get paid $380

[AussieNick]

customer can't see you today, out comes the phone, WAC/ERC/GPS :) and see someone else.

Add working for a private company to the list, can be more exciting than flying darwin-snake bay-darwin 5 times a day, or OEN-JAB-OEN 10 times a day (NT pilots will get the references)

Remember, there are alot of other options to get a good career in aviation besides circuit bashing or charter like Ag, Survey, Spotting, Photography, Private companies (i'm a CPL working for a private company, as a private operation) Freight just to name a few, and the pay can be much better

[mcgrath50]

Aussie Nick,

What sort of experience are the 'private companies' usually looking at? The ones I have seen are all operating at least a 208 all the way up to business jets, which isn't exactly entry level jobs (unless you are lucky as pointed out earlier).

[AussieNick]

depends on what you definition of private is I guess.

I fly a lance and got the job with 320tt. You can find private companies that fly anything from 182's, 206 & 210s, Lance's some piston twins (CSG in darwin run a few lances along with a Partanavia and a jet) right up to corporate jets.

Generally with these companies you'll be required to do more than just fly. I am a representative for the company as well as the pilot, therefore when I'm not flying I also deal with customers etc. Hours may not be as good as charter but the cash and conditions, plus not having to deal with the myriad of egos that exist when you first start out in GA more than make up for it.

These companies don't generally advertise on AFAP or in the paper etc but can rely alot on word of mouth, but if you ask around, do a few CASA register searches the information isn't hard to find

[rmcdonal]

Having done both I would recommend Charter. More fun, you get to see more places (albeit they may not be exactly tourist quality) and once you get onto a proper charter mob (not just laps around the bungles/ wackadoo) then the cleaning of aircraft becomes a once a week thing with a quick vacuum after each flight. You will end up on larger faster aircraft within a year and twins shortly after that. Yes the hours (Working, not flight) are no where near as good as instructing, however if you want to build night hours then you have to fly at night. If you want to build IF time then you have to fly when the weather is a poor.

I found that charter work made me far more independent as a pilot than instructing. As an instructor you tend not to drift to far from known routes and training areas, most of the problems you encounter you can ask your CFI about and pick up advise, with charter you have to make all the calls yourself, often with only cursory advise from the ever busy CP.

I also found that charter enabled better connections in the industry, you may run into a fellow pilot out in the middle of nowhere who informs you of a twin job up for grabs, or you help out a stranded pilot only to run into them 4 years later at your airline interview.

Yes charter was harder then instructing, but it was worth the extra effort. Yes it often included VERY early starts with late finishes but that's how you fit an 8+hr flying day in. :ok:

[PA39]

Do both, you need the experience. after you hour build with abinitio move into advanced multi ifr training....great reward. Do charter when it comes up.

We used to do instructing all day and the mail all night.... pax carrying charter to remote islands on week ends. LHI NFI

[RENURPP]

Having done both, I found instructing the most rewarding and enjoyable by a long stretch.

It makes the world of difference who you work for, not just financially, in fact not even financially, more the type of instructing available and other life style issues. I worked 5 days a week with the same 2 days off a week, I could plan and enjoy life. I did this on a fixed salary. (above award) I flew all around Australia in all sorts of aircraft.

I was fortunate enough to be able to instruct abinitio, PPL, CPL, instructor ratings, Aero's formation flying, CIR's, and also do some charter work for a friend in Barons chieftains and aero commanders. On weekends I had the opportunity to tow banners over Sydney and the Central Coast. All this was part of my job as an instructor.
Instructing is far more than "circuit bashing", those comments come from people who have either never been an instructor or worked for a sausage factory, or possibly just have a tiny penis I suspect.

The comments that suggest an instructor simply sits and watches the student day in day out without flying the aircraft them selves are also naive.

land a job with a good school and it can be the best job, (money doesn't allow it to be a career unfortunately.)

Charter
It can be fun too, depends on who you work for again.
Most charter tends to have a fair bit of time sitting on your bum in remote places. The aircraft maybe faster if thats what blows your hair back. Speed just determines how far you go rather than make a trip shorter in a lot of cases. i.e. if a customer wants to go from Brisbane to Brirdsville, they are unlikely to hire a C210, (too slow) if the want to fly from Brisbane to the Gold Coast, speed doesn't really matter.

If your lucky you may get a charter job that runs more like RPT, i.e. fly passengers to a destination, drop them off and pick up another bunch and fly them home or even better, come home empty. im sure you get the idea.

Survey work can be fun, generally long hours in straight lines, again long periods away from home.

Charter is more a means to an ends, its not at all career orientated.

Then you have airlines.

Well that used to be the end goal due to $$$$ and lifestyle. Thats changing of
course.
If you are lucky enough to land a job with any of the airlines, the money is better, the life-stye is better, the flying in general, well from my perspective is boring as bat ****. I can't wait for retirement. It (airlines) simply allows you to live better away from work.

[das Uber Soldat]

Instructing is far more than "circuit bashing", those comments come from people who have either never been an instructor or worked for a sausage factory, or possibly just have a tiny penis I suspect.

The comments that suggest an instructor simply sits and watches the student day in day out without flying the aircraft them selves are also naive.

Where exactly in this thread has any of that been suggested?

[Roxy_Chick_1989]

Thanks for the posts, especially das Uber soldier and renurpp.


Instructing Pros:

- Good hours. Rarely start before 6, no 16 hour days etc.
- Often good people company. I fly boxes around these days so I pass my fellow employees like ships in the night. In contrast I still regularly socialize with my old instructor mates.
- 'You don't have to go'. Ill get to what that means in a bit.
- Can be good pay. Starts out bad, but I ramped up to 60K within the first 2 years, which is fine. Not many people in a chieftan making 60K.
- Rewarding - Sending a good kid first solo, watching them knock over flight tests, very rewarding. You form real friendships with these people. I still talk to so many to this day.
- The best place to develop your knowledge of Aviation. Provided you're not a slack ass, by going over the theory so often, teaching it in on the ground and in the air, you'll have an excellent handle on all things theory. Things that draw the blankest of blank faces on many low time charter pilots.
- Flyaways! Sounds stupid but the ability to just decide you want to go place X for the weekend, Hamilton Island or something, is fantastic. Students love it and you can have some magic experiences.
- Planes slightly less likely to kill you. This is in my experience only though, I assume there will be instructors who tell you that at place X the planes are pretty bad. I suppose investigate this before you start.



Interesting points das uber, especially the ones in bold.

[RENURPP]

das Uber Soldat asked - Where exactly in this thread has any of that been suggested?

Answer
1. Remember, there are alot of other options to get a good career in aviation besides circuit bashing or charter
16th Apr 2011, 02:29 #11 (permalink)
AussieNick
2.If you want to be an instructor because you want to get something out of teaching people how to fly and you think you will like that type of work, including potentially watching 50 circuits a day from the rhs then go for it.
15th Apr 2011, 19:31 #5 (permalink)
Digaf

[MattGray]

I can't wait for retirement. It simply allows you to live better away from work.

I had a job like that once - a business actually.

It's simply not worth it.

[Mr. Hat]

Interesting part of charter:

Telling boss you're not going: Weather/Maintenance/Overweight/Underfuelled.

Standing your ground on the big ticket items.

[Piano Man]

Flying bare feet with salt water on your legs or sitting with a student telling him/her how to fly a circuit.

I know what I would rather :O

[Towering Q]

Let me guess Piano Man....you're a Pelican!

[Piano Man]

How did you know!

[flyboy_nz]

It all depends where you do instructing, what kinda students you get and the same applies to charter. Everyone has different experiences. I have enjoyed instructing, but I will be moving on soon to charter. During Instructing, I have met some wonderful people who I had the privilege to teach and now they have their PPLs and moved on to Aerobatics rating. The paper work can drive you nuts at times and some students can really test your patience.

If you are just after hours, or in a rush to get into the Airlines, charter would be the quicker way. Although, I would recommend that both charter and instructing experience can really benefit any pilot.

In regards to getting your first job, if you have an instructor rating, you are opening your options, you can instruct and do charter.

[crwjerk]

Somebody referred to washing planes before, as being a negative thing. You'll find that whatever road you take, be it Instructing, Charter, flying for a Cotton cocky, you'll be looked upon much more favourably if you are enthusiastic about such a task. It's character building, gives you a sense of pride, and teaches you to look after your aircraft. All good stuff, which cannot hurt a young Gen Y'er. Don't be scared to do a bit of hard yakka.:ok:

[muffman]

If you elect to instruct, you need to want to instruct. People like avturbound, who get into it purely for their logbook, are never going to be happy teaching someone else how to fly. If that's how you feel (and be honest with yourself - it's not a problem if you don't want to teach) then charter is your answer.

On the other hand, if you think you would enjoy teaching, it can be great fun. The main thing is to keep pushing yourself. Don't settle for flying around the circuit for hundreds of hours. Seek out more advanced types of training as your experience allows, upgrade your rating as soon as possible and teach a mix of IFR and VFR flying, aerobatics if you can stomach it, and try to make yourself as useful to your students as you possibly can. I had a ball instructing and feel genuine satisfaction about all the careers I hopefully got off to a good start.

Oh, and don't work for sausage factories for any longer than you absolutely have to. You will end up questioning your will to live.

[Capt Mo]

I have done both and thoroughly enjoyed instructing and charter for different reasons.

I began instructing with little experience but made up for this with enthusiasm and doing the best I could for each student. Despite the lack of hands on flying - I found that I gained experience through teaching and my stick and rudder skills actually improved. I worked best at smaller flying schools and flying clubs, where I was able to dedicate more time to each student pre and post flight. I got alot of satisfaction from sending a student solo and helping them overcome difficulties and obtaining a licence. Some are even working in G/A and a few are in airlines. They keep in touch and I'm still proud of their ongoing achievements.

I have left instructing for now, but would consider returning to it one day - to bring some experience back as a CFI, ATO or even get a little flying school started. I left with a S/E Grade 1 rating. I chose not to pursue Multi engine and IFR instructing as I had minimum experience in both areas - and so chose to move into a charter role to obtain it.

With some charter experience I had obtained during my instructing years, I went into a M/E charter job 13 months ago and have loved it. Yes it has its moments - living out of a bag for days at a time, early mornings, long days, challenging weather conditions at times, unforseen changes - like extra pax or gear turning up, pax running late, sitting around in remote communities for hours ... waiting. But the flying is fantastic! It is interesting - you meet interesting people, stay in different places and will see different landscapes, seeing parts of the country you never knew would be so picturesque.

If you dont have the passion for it, and are just doing it for the hours - dont instruct. Its unfair to students paying $$$ for their training, makes life difficult for other instructors who have to do remedial with the students you didn't have the time for and gives young/less experienced instructors a bad reputation - including amongst charter operators, many of whom now are not keen to employ ex instructors due to a lack of skill and airmanship shown by some who probablly didnt put much effort in, evident by the claim that they 'didn't get anything out of it'

Good luck with the choice and have fun doing whatever path you take!

Mo :ok:

[Xcel]

If your full-time at both and love it then their both great paths to take.

If your casual or worse contracted then both can be nightmares.

Both can teach you alot.

Better yet save your money and go charter... Then when you got your hours up and feel like you could give something back with your experienced gained do instructing.

Done both and can't fault either experiences except in my opinion (Just mine leave me be) Instructing taught me the rules and charter taught me to get home alive.

[Ixixly]

Ok, figured i'd throw my 2cents worth in!!

I'm still a low-timer myself but at the start I considered Instructing or Charter work and in the end decided that whilst Instructing could be rewarding, I personally found that my instructors whom had Charter experience from companies outside of the flight training school I was with were able to teach me a lot more and its the things they taught me that have kept me alive so far!! I also found those with actual charter experience were able to teach me a lot more in a far smaller period of time and generally made better instructors and decided to go charter so that if in a year or two time I still have an urge to go in as an instructor I'd feel like I have something to pass along to my students and would be preparing my students for the types of situations they would actually come across.

Knowing the rules and the black and white is great, but when it all hits the fan following those rules to the letter could get you killed. A very wise very experienced instructor once told me two absolute gems:
1. You can break any law you want, but you'd better have a bloody good reason for doing so!!
2. Rules are there to keep you, your passengers and your aircraft safe... until they can't or don't!!

[apache]

from one who has been there and done that.... ?
get your ATPL.
get your hours up.
and GET THE HELL out of GA!

whichever way works out quickest... do it!
airline flying MAY be repetitive. it may be monotonous.... but it beats the hell out of GA!!!!!

[morno]

from one who has been there and done that.... ?
get your ATPL.
get your hours up.
and GET THE HELL out of GA!

And THAT, is why GA in this country is going backwards so quickly.

Hope you did get out of GA as quickly as you could, simply so you didn't ruin it for everyone else!

morno

[Skynews]

Airlines provide a better lifestyle (generally) and that's it!

Even the better lifestyle is disappearing, soon GA will be the chosen career for many.

Look at companies like the RFDS and Surviellance Aus.
A Dash check Capt with sA is making more$$$$ than most airline capts these dats.

[apache]

And THAT, is why GA in this country is going backwards so quickly.

and I always thought that GA was going backwards due to ageing aircraft, dodgy management, and indifference from government.

[MikeTangoEcho]

What's wrong with apache's comment? People shouldn't feel obliged to stick it out in GA if thats not where they want to be, just for the 'greater good'.

[The Green Goblin]

If I could get 100k to fly a Baron, l'd be back GA tomorrow.

The way the experience requirements are heading though, I wouldn't be surprised if a Baron driver will be commanding this type of money!

As for the charter vs instructing thing Roxy it's like Boeing vs Airbus, or Ford vs Holden. Both sides think their choice is better, and are just as passionate about it.

I suppose what is best, depends on what is best for you. If you want to teach and stay home, instructing is a good start to a career. If you want to get some life experience and interesting flying, you can't beat charter.

As you're getting your grade 1 approvals a charter pilot is generally getting his first command on a turboprop. Can the instructors stomach it?

GG

[Three Greenz]

If you have a genuine passion for teaching and wanting to see your students succeed then instructing is good for building total time. The downside is unless you instruct for a sausage factory the progression to twins is in most cases slow.
I can't wait to finish my study and work hard in GA.

[SgtBundy]

What are some of the other opportunities out there for a low hour or fresh CPL, specifically jobs that might be available in say regional NSW rather than up north (family reasons). Jobs like survey, spotting, photography, ag work etc.

Maybe I just have watched too much Flying Wild Alaska, but I quite like the idea of working in GA as it seems like the flying might be more varied and a bit more "hands on" than RPT.

[Aerodynamisist]

Instructing is awesome just doing the rating itself improves you flying, I miss the interpersonal aspect of the job and the satisfaction of seeing someone grasp a concept and progress. on the downside I don't miss working for a flying school with instructors who were a student one day and an instructor the next, running around with a Rambo attitude and Donald duck capabilities, turn up late never wash an aircraft or write up a fault and never do today what can be put off till tomorrow.

If I had my way I would put a min hours requirement on instructor trainee's like they do on helicopters, say 400 or 500 hours before you can do an instructors rating. Give the instructor some experience to pass teach them how to work as a pilot and weed out those that don't really want to instruct and improve the conditions for those that do.

Charter and airwork I find much less stressful, chief pilots are far easier to deal with than CFI's. If you ask a chief pilot a question you get an answer, ask a CFI a question you get another question. When you park the aircraft and do your time and duties at the end of the day the job is done and you don't have to worry about it till your next shift.

[The Green Goblin]

Ask a CFI a question you get another question

Oldest trick in the book.

Half the time, the CFI does not know themselves. To keep up their 'godlike' demeanour, and to persist with their own myth that the can fly anything, anytime. Along with the self perpetuated scam that their knowledge of the regs is unequalled, they will throw it back on you with a 'where do you think you will find the answer to this?'

Whilst you go away, frustrated, and begin to the hunt for the answers, the CFI is sitting in his/her ivory tower finding the answer for him/herself.

CPs out in the charter world are generally much more street wise and are happy to pass on what they know. They invest in their troops and gain pleasure from watching them progress. CFIs seem to delight in holding people back. "You need 3000 hours to fly the partenavia", "You need to be a Grade 1 before you can teach stalling".

CFIs often are bitter, have a big bloody chip on their shoulder, and delight in telling you why they didn't make it into Qantas because of the 28 year old cut off and how they turned down the interview to care for their mothers sick dog missing the cutoff, or insert some other bull**** here.

[layman]

TGG

sorry have to disagree. I'm not in aviation but in education for 15+ years. Giving the answer is "easier" than playing "20 questions" to help them work out the answer.

If you "tell" them they ask again next time.

If they find out for themselves, they remember and work out how to find the answer. 'Learning how to learn' is a life-skill whatever the profession.

I agree, there are those that don't know and hide it, but most times it's about helping them understand how to develop an answer.

The question might not change, but the answer will often be just a bit different next time.

And it's not always easy to do when they say "I've paid my money. Just give me the [expletive deleted] answer." ...

cheers
layman

[RENURPP]

CPs out in the charter world are generally much more street wise and are happy to pass on what they know. They invest in their troops and gain pleasure from watching them progress. CFIs seem to delight in holding people back. "You need 3000 hours to fly the partenavia", "You need to be a Grade 1 before you can teach stalling".

Absolute drivel.
What experience does this come from?

[Xcel]

Drivel but funny...

When I read that I immediatly thought of 2 old cfi's I had- but then again a few cp's too.

[The Green Goblin]

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story :ok:

Unfortunately flying schools tend to harbour these types. I've met some great CFIs, in fact I still keep in touch with two that I met along the way.

But I've met some arrogant wankers too. Not mentioning any names of course :E

[Skynews]

I think the truth of the matter is that if your smart and some on here are not, you will find more experienced and useful CFIs than you will chief pilots. Why?

CPs for the type of organization you are considering starting with are usually guys who have been around a few years and either haven't had the ability to move on to bigger and better things or are just medium term seat warmers.

Very few (although there are exceptions) GA single engine charter organizations have "experienced" CPs.

The same is similar at flying schools, however there re plenty of high time CFIs who have returned to instructing after very interesting careers in all types of aviation. The CFI at every school I worked at and trained at were very experienced. One had a DFC from Vietnam, the other well into the 10,000 hrs, the likes on Ken Andrews, Trevor Howie the lsit goes on.

I don't recall any CP of start out organizations that has done more thatn a few scenics and indigenous charters out of some **** hole like Kunuurra. No comparison really.

There are exceptions to both these scenarios of course. If you intend making. A career out of either chose your employer carefully, you don't have o work for the first company that offers a job.

[Cessna 180]

Skynews how would you like it if people refered to where you chose to call home as a "****hole"?

Kununurra is an extremely beautiful part of the world and like anywhere, is what YOU make of it.

The people are friendly and the flying is interesting. Bungle scenics are only a small percantage of the work that goes on around the region.

Roxy, for what it's worth, go and explore the country for a year or so, see where that leads and then do your instructor rating if you wish.

[JMEN]

It really depends on what you want to do. What lights the fire in your belly?

If doing an instructor rating and staying home is it then that is fantastic, do it.

However if you want an adventure then pack the car, go and have the time of your life on your way to starting a fantastic career. Where to go? Wherever you feel is right.

Now if you are even more adventurous there is South Africa, South America, Indonesia... the world is your oyster.

What ever you decide, have fun, most importantly enjoy, be disciplined in your flying and as I said have fun. A great time to be starting. You have the opportunity to get some great experience and accelerate through to wherever you wish to end up.

:ok:

[RENURPP]

Since when did instructing mean or require staying at home?

I suspect from some of the responses here, some of these charter pilots have seen none of the real world.

The majority of pilots go the charter way as it is easier.
These same pilots' knowledge of instructing and where that takes you and what it allows you to do, were to work, appears to be almost zero.

Flying in circle around Kakadu, Bunlge Bungle or any other scenic operator is NOT seeing the world. Neither is flying indigenous people around Arnhem Land.

The fact is most GA charter pilots only venture within a few hundred miles from their base. Big deal guys!

AS I said earlier I have tried them both. Started RPT RHS, then instructing 6 6 years (combined with some charter, then charter for 7 years (combined with instructing) and then flying jets for 16. The instructing lead to more opportunities, it was by far the most rewarding, and it lead to the most travel were I could actually stop and see places.

Charter was OK, but mostly sitting around waiting. Not as rewarding.

I understand that instructing is not for everyone, but don't try and sell Roxy based on your biased opinion, if you haven't tried it, then you are not really equipped to criticise are you?

Instructing gets a bad rap from people who were not suited to it and also those who want to sell their own choice. In reality if you get a job at a good school it can be much more enjoyable than scenics, freight and passengers.

The argument will go on well after this thread is lost, so make your own mind up. You will know inside what you really want. If instructing isn't it, the best thing you can do for future potential students and CPL's is join the masses and fly 210's and 206's around for a while and leave it to people who want to be there.

[rmcdonal]

I guess I will play the devils advocate to RENURPP, my experience of Instructing was completely different from RENURPP as was my experience in GA and charter.
I found a charter gig that had me fly a grand total of 10 scenic flights, the rest being charters. And not just the into the local community and then to Darwin charters, but the one side of the NT and back again type. It included low level Dingo baiting (not for the squeamish) fruit bat tracking and landing on some of the most interesting strips in the NT (well in my opinion, I haven't been to them all so am not an expert). I was able to transport a wide range of items from the mail to groceries all the way to medivacs just because I was the only one within 400K with an aeroplane.
Yup I sat in some very isolated places waiting in the 40c heat for a Doc to finish his clinic, however I also had the opportunity to sit on the bank of a billabong having been flown in by helicopter just to have a go at catching a Barra (fishing fail, but at least the chopper pilot managed to find us lunch).
All this before 500hrs

My instructing experience however was not as favourable, I did not work in a sausage factory however still found myself going around and around in the circuit (it takes a student on average 10-20hrs to go solo, 5hrs of ops eff/SL/turns/ Stalls etc, followed by 5-15 hrs of circuits. On average you can do 6 or so circuits in an hr, so 30-90 circuits per student, this is where circuit bashing comes into play).
While instructing I was also flying twin charter, however as I had an instructor rating and the other casual did not I was often bumped from the charter to instruct and sent to do circuits, having an instructor rating actually reduced my income as S/E work pays less than twin work.

I do agree on one point with RENURPP, if you don't really want to instruct then don't do it.

[Xcel]

Rmcdonal - good old vrd hey... You almost had us convinced it was good!!

Seriously all going to be what you make it!

rmcdonal - I had one bloke last a whole beer at vrd before demanding we take him back to "civilisation"... This was the 2nd time as the first trip he didn't even make it to have a beer.

Done instructing in 2 countries - charter in 3 and rpt in 2 and would say all have ups and downs... Both will be rewarding if you let them!!

[Jose Cuervo]

Charter Cons:

- The hours can be horrid.

And just wait until you get into an airline to find out what horrid hours are like.

[Homesick-Angel]

Im enjoying this thread..Thank you all..

Im not really qualified to talk about anything other than the instructing side of things, but what I can tell you is that Ive enjoyed the teaching, and more importantly the learning.
I think it helped me being a bit older when I started, but I really enjoy seeing people get the most out of themselves..I dont think I could have said that at the age of 20 (Im now in my 30s) as I was far too much up my own ar$e.

Saying that,I do have plans to get out and charter in the next few years, as I would like to have more freedoms, or should i say different freedoms. I see my friends hooning around the outback, and do have a certain amount of envy
it was always my plan to instruct first, because I wanted to be around a lot of different pilots of different experience levels and just pick the hell out of their brains.

I have no interest in the airlines, but do have a lot of interest in flying seaplanes, something as yet i have not done..Possibly choppers as well.

Do whatever feels right, then be prepared to work hard and you'll get a lot out of it.

[Wildpilot]

I went to Africa flew bush for a couple of years then got into floats on the mighty beaver and now the van on amphibious floats. My mates who went the instructing route still are at the same field most of them learnt at flying very average machines. Or according to them not flying just sitting there.

One or two of them get to fly the very odd scenic or charter in a crappy Seneca or something like that.

They all know loads more facts and figures than me but none of them know how to deal with anything real world, loads, weather, tight time frames etc etc.

IMHO You can be a pilot or an instructor, if you could do both then that would be good I guess. But where I used to work in Africa instructors were not liked by the companies as they generally I say again generally were slow on turnarounds, flew huge circuits and just took ages to get into a commercial frame of mind and wasted allot of time.

I'm not saying this to upset anyone just telling you the truth as I have seen it.

So for me hands down charter/bush etc over instructing for the experience and great places you will go and people you will meet.