View Full Version : Traveling on cargo aircraft. How are your company reqs?
14th Apr 2011, 20:12
We have an issue in our company about taking spouses or friends on an ID ticket in our aircraft. At LCAG on the MD11 it works in some countries but USA, China, India don't allow pax on freighters. The reasons seem to be obscure.
I would like to know how your company handles the issue? Do you get support from you airline?
1. where can you take a pax with you on tour?
2. how limited is the circle? only spouse? or anybody?
3. what countries are not permitting to take anybody?
4. what TIX do you buy? ID90, ID50?
5. can you put your spouse on the crewlist, get a company ID, list them as courier etc to overcome some hurdles?
5. type of A/C and company?
Thanks a lot
19th Apr 2011, 11:29
Nobody dares to share some information? The beancounters and management can only BS us as long as we dont know better.
If we ask in our company why nothing happens, its always the STD answer:"
this issue is very important to us, thanks a lot for pointing it out. We are working hard to make an improvement and will let you know ASAP if anything changes "
i would like to know what your experience is and how does your company handle this issue.
or are you afraid that if you share the information, your benefits get worse?
dont think so...
20th Apr 2011, 07:09
In simple terms, the Companies that I have worked for installed a blanket ban on non-operating crew or personnel (other than couriers) travelling on board since 911 and the associated security issues.
20th Apr 2011, 08:17
Partner/spouse and kids only.
Travel free of charge.
Priority on trips over xmas and/or new year.
They even get something to eat...
No USA, no China.
Must take care of visa requirements.
20th Apr 2011, 16:43
Why in God's name would you ever want to take your wife and kids to Thailand, for example?
21st Apr 2011, 02:45
Is it because it is an inexpensive place to visit, has kind people, beautiful beaches and good food????
21st Apr 2011, 12:47
Regardless of what your company policy is, don't bring your pax to India and expect to take them home again, even with visa's.
The bureaucracy is totally insane to say the least. Even crews are having trouble getting to their aircraft at times.
23rd Apr 2011, 07:25
I got Some PM's and mostly the tenor is the same.Our companies make it difficult to take anybody on our flights.
TSA restriction is another issue. What's the reason for this? Missing bullet proof door? My wife is for sure more trustworthy to me than some unknown Person accompanying a horse.
What are the TSA's rules in the USA. Tough to find anything official in the web
25th Apr 2011, 19:32
If you carry cargo that is "cargo aircraft only" how does your company explain passengers who aren't crew?:confused:
25th Apr 2011, 20:04
CAO does not mean per se that no passengers or extra crewmembers are allowed.
Certain Icelandic cargo airlines allow anyone onboard, including family members and friends. It is Captain's discretion:D:ok: and ops. need to be informed, in order to be issued a boarding pass to cross security.
Passengers on Cargo aircraft are not "Passengers". They're "Persons".
Sound like bullshit? Yup, it is... Who cares. If you you get your wife and kids on board, legally defined as "cattle"... pffft. Call them "chickens or dogs" if it amuses the authorities.
Thousands Standing Around stop all this anyway. Personally seen a female TSA agent (who would need help to spell "TSA") confiscate tampons from a teenage female "person" on my aircraft. Dangerous & forbidden.
Others saw sense, and said was given back to "person" on board.
26th Apr 2011, 11:20
Ok, if nobody is interested in sharing information about what your company allows, then maybe you dare to share what's forbidden?
1.Why does TSA not approve pax on cargo a/c?
2. What about India and China?
There is so much BS about what's allowed, what the other operators do and don't. I would like to gather the facts and make our union and management aware about our shortcoming in the travel issue compared to collagues on pax the fleet.
26th Apr 2011, 13:28
At least for the USA, Google the FAA CFR 121.313 and 121.547 and you may find some guidance.
Some of part 121.547 describes requiring seats to be made available in the passenger compartment for riders. On many planes like the 747, there is no cockpit door or even cockpit walls (bulkheads). Thus, the entire upper deck is described as the "cockpit" and there is no "passenger area," even though there are courier seats and bunks. Thus, no passengers unless they are qualified by the regulations or the company.
26th Apr 2011, 14:53
thanks for the info.
for some A/C this might be a limiting factor, but for example it does not restrict at all to take pax on a MD11.
26th Apr 2011, 15:58
ID travel not possible with us, and since we can't reciprocate don't have ID deals with any other airline. Positioning crew, approved* staff on company travel and cargo attendants are the only people allowed to travel on jumpseat. No spouses allowed at all, under any circumstances.
USA is possible for persons falling in the above categories, but visa waiver is not possible even if your citizenship would normally allow for it. It's a major pain which can and will cause problem during both inbound and outbound immigration, and is thus a CPA and not a TSA issue. India is out of bounds, for reasons of obscene bureaucracy and the almost limitless number of possibilities for something to go wrong and cause major delays to the flights. Don't have any info on China, but generally speaking (and with the notable exceptions mentioned) we carry staff wherever we go and gendec them as whatever will ease the process of getting them to/from the aircraft.
* You've got to apply via the correct channels to be placed on the list of staff eligible for jumpseating. That doesn't mean you'll get to travel though - the actual booking of a seat is another matter all together.