FAA/JAA certification- why the disparity?

[shon7]

Just wanted to get some comments on the FAA/JAA training differences mostly b/w FAA/JAA.

We were having this discussion earlier and someone pointed out that even though one might argue that JAA requirements are tougher the safety record on both sides of the atlantic (US/Europe) is comparitively the same.

It seems to me that JAA stresses more on theory and writing whereas the FAA wants to see sold actual flight time/experience.

Which is a better approach to certify pilots?

[Oyler]

well I can tell you one thing, I took the initial cert. by FAA, and they are OK, its only to protect the European marked that they do not accept this license, and I think it is understandable, but JAA is more books, the FAA is more about flying hands ON, the Simulator in Europe you can connect the Autopilot almost at all times, but in FAA sim checks, you will have to hand fly alot more.

I am personally more a fan of the FAA,but that I think is what you prefer.

get down well

[inverted flatspin]

The FAA are a government agency and like all government agencies there is good and bad, however there is a significant difference in attitude between the FAA and its European counterparts the last A in FAA stands for Administration and the last A in JAA/CAA stands for Authority. It may not seem like much of a difference but in the US the FAA are answerable to a higher authority, The JAA consider themselves the final word on all matters aviation.

In my dealings with the FAA I have formed the following impression.

Helpful, reasonable and professional but still prone to all the bad things that a government agency can be.

In my dealings with the Irish Aviation Authority I formed the following impression.

An amateurish bunch of muppets.

In my dealings with the JAA I formed the following impression

The lunatics have taken over the Asylum.

I haven't dealt with the CAA(UK) yet but I intend to, I hope that they are at least professional.

[B2N2]

I wish I knew,but it smells like politics.. .The only people who benefit from JAR are the big flightschools.I'll never really understand why it takes 20min to convert from JAR>FAA and from FAA>JAR is impossible unless you bring along another 1000 or 1500 hrs.. .I'm gonna go FAA all the way,not even interested in JAR anymore.. .Maybe someday I'll convert...maybe not.

[Grendel]

The JAA vs. FAA regulations may in fact reflect teh bias and overall political beliefs of the host countries.

Regulations in the US are generally stated as the minimum requirement to do something. Start an airline, resturant, get a pilot or engineering rating. This comes from the idea that government doesn't have a responsiblity to tell the priviate sector how to operate a commercial enterprise but only set the minimum safety standards required to operate in the public intrest.

Major US airlines have very high standards in pilot training, hiring and high operations. That is becasue it makes good sense not because it was mandated by government. In the US if you want to start an airline and you meet the requirements the reply is "Sure why not." In Europe I get the feeling it's "What who the hell are you?" "Why should I give you permission to run an airline?" You have to take all these theory courses, submit to endless inspections, not be able to get a straight answer from anyone, and then if you are the right sort of person we might in our great wisdom grant you the right to operate an airline with our blessing. That's is just my uneducated opnion of the situaition on the continent not necessarily UK.

In the US its "Sure why not, provided you meet the minimum requirements" "In Europe, "Let you run an airline, why should we?"

I think this attitude is reflected in the regulations of the host countries.

Just my $.02.

"Why it's so simple a child of five could understand this." "Fetch me a child of five." Grouho Marx

[polzin]

Now Please ,I dont want this to get into a USA/European argument , but. The FAA /USA approach is to make you successful. At least one of the European countries approach is to make you fail. A simplistic statement Ive heard many times but there maybe some truth to it. I remember flying with a European who was studying for his JAA. Good questions about fatigue and related matters but there were also questions about the color of the light in a laser gyro. ? Blue ? Who cares?. .Have you ever met anyone that did not think that JAA exams were not a little ridiculous ? I have not done it myself so I can not talk from personal experience.

[ 05 February 2002: Message edited by: polzin ]

[ 05 February 2002: Message edited by: polzin ]</p>

[motty]

On the topic of JAA/FAA....anybody in the US that has current JAA ATPL notes that would be interested in selling them? Thanks.

[Cathar]

A bit late to butt in but I should point out that the JAA is not an Authority. The final A stands for Authorities. It is a grouping of aviation regulatory authorities who have agreed to harmonise standards. It has no legal standing and it is its individual members that have to implement and enforce the standards that they agree through the JAA.

It is also incorrect to suggest that aviation authorities in europe are not accountable to their national governments.