(EK) Welcome news for Airbus fleet

[White Knight]

Good to see a new Manchester service to be operated by 332 from MAy and Cape Town on 345 from 27th March...

Nice change from Tripoli:ok:

[akerosid]

Good news ... just waiting to see the 332 (or anything EK, for that matter!) in Dublin!

Just a question about the 345; the CPT route seems to be about the longest operated by the type and while it's around 10h, it hardly stretches the aircraft. Does EK have any plans to put the 345 back on the routes it was designed for, or is ULR going to be the preserve of the 77L for the foreseeable future?

[Wizofoz]

345 may have been designed for longer routes, but the 777-300ER and (to a lesser extent) 777-200LR just kicks it's ass for commercial viability on those routes.

So, no...

[jackbauer]

Oh dear, another a$$hole who thinks Boeing loves him and talks about airplanes like an overexcited spotter. Boeing rocks, yay!!!

[White Knight]

but the 777-300ER and (to a lesser extent) 777-200LR just kicks it's ass for commercial viability on those routes.



That's not what I'm hearing... Just that the 77L and 77W are TC's babies:{

Commercially; I've yet to see 345 lose payload just to carry the fuel required... And that's 7 years of flying 345!!!! I hear 777 hard pressed to carry just the commercial load out of IAH, LAX, SFO and even JFK:=

345 makes it no sweat:D and it's a pleasure to fly:ok:

[Stratosphere6000]

if u aint flown the boeing then u cant be knowing!!!!:ok:

[fatbus]

ok done both and prefer AB

[pool]

Just take any 3 flights with around 13h and similar ESAD, one 380, one 340-500, one 777W. Then compare them (weight to max adjusted) and determine the kgs of fuel used per kg payload.

The outcome turns around 2.1kgs - 380, 2.3kgs - 340 and 1.8kgs - 77W.

The eternal arguments that you can always go with max load on a 340, even though much lower, or you can carry 200 more souls on a 380 are both valid, but it does not bode away that the busses are less fuel efficient.

So it just comes down to the number of seats you can sell and the aircraft you have in your fleet. This tells you where to fly with what.

The 340s basically makes no sense no longer, but as no one buys them and you need capacity, use them where they lose the least.

The Airbus guys need some better routes and better rosters!

[Dropp the Pilot]

Before this turned into a "mine's more efficient than yours" squabble this post might have been well-used in the "you've been to long in the middle east when" thread.

I think you've been too long in the middle east when you can get excited about the tantalizing possibility of a roster which may include a flight to Manchester in the middle of the night.

[Oblaaspop]

And Dropp hits the nail squarely on the head:ok:

An an Airbus driver I actually found myself getting quite excited about the prospect of being able to go to MAN...... how 'kin sad is that??

Says a lot about what the Airbus guys have had to endure over the last few years!!:yuk:

[CAYNINE]

ab so lootly.... it is sad but I am so happy we are getting a chance to go somewhere other than India and deepest darkest.

:ok:

[Orangewing]

I wouldn't get too excited, methinks both destinations will be cherry picked by the trainers…….:E

[145qrh]

Manchester, think I would rather go to Lagos !!

[Mister Warning]

Trainers don't get to cherry-pick. Fleet and the Training Department negotiate which trips will be for training, and which for the line.
Simple fact that night flights are less conducive for training. Given their departure times, these new flights probably should remain with the line.

[dustyprops]

That is some good news for the Airbus guys. They can keep those departure times though! Enough around that time already on the Boeing.

Latest from the wash'out' Boeing on ULR for forseeable future, due commercial viability. Making lots on the available freight capacity on 3er and 2lr. Also Miami 'not ruled out' on the 777F when the 2 new ones arrive this year.

[goatherd]

The issue of training during night flights or not is just smoke and mirrors. Cape Town is a training flight on the 777, Durban is a training flight on the 330. That excuse only gets used on crappy flights, if it suits them then training is ok on night sectors to good destinations!!
Luckily the 345 Cape Town is an augmented flight, no training then!!!

Off subject, I see that some trainers may have to resign from training if they want to transfer to the 380. All those trainers on the Expression of interest list will get bypassed by junior guys unless they are replaced pretty soon!! Why go into training now only to get stuck on the 330/340 until the fleet gets replaced??

[GoreTex]

The training department steals all the good flights, even its a night flight as long its a nice destination, when I fly with new FO's they have been all over Europe but never to Africa, had a 340 flight to MXP but training took it and gave me the TRI's 340 flight to CMN because he didn't like to go there.
It's BS and its bad for the training what they do, the trainers "Emirates finest" say it openly they want to go into training for the nice flights because they can't stand the crap flights anymore. Well done EK.

[Dirigible]

Fully agree with Goretex re the training flights. Try and bid for a 775 in April, and the list of pre assigned duties shows the vast majority gone to training. (And I thought there was a limit to how many could go training). One could always join training but then, why would one do so when being by-passed for the 380? Between a rock and a hard place. As I read the new FCI, the doors are open for 777 pilots to bid over to the 380. Although it cannot be commercially viable to allow it, it would further delay those waiting for a 380 course. Smallbus fleet really shafted, as ever:ugh:

[Praise Jebus]

When you have a rostered flight, a good one at that and it gets taken away it sucks. Goretex I hear you, but it is not stolen by a Trainer because he "didn't like" his other flight. If it worked like that we would all want to be trainers. At the planning stage the training flights are restricted to no more than 30% of a flight number. So basically for Cape Town there should be a minimum of 20 available each month for Line. (Yes some training can be done on augmented flights). After roster publication changes can be made to recover lost events, this is to meet the needs of the Company, not the Trainer. As for all the European flights, there is a regulatory requirement to train to that Continent, not many AB Euro destinations to choose from is there?

Give some thought to the AB trainer's sad lot, they are stuck on the 330/40 and will be bypassed by all those new young lads to the 380 and in your view this a terrible predicament, even Dirigible doesn't want to be a trainer...

[yardman]

Gents,

Things in the training department aren't necessarily as good as you might think. On the 777 the trainers are hardly getting the opportunity to fly to the US. On the bus they're starting to do night flights to India. The reasons for trying to avoid these have been mentioned before and seem valid to me.

There was a time when training rostering was truly awful and they had difficulty finding people interested in joining the department. It's improved a lot but it's far from perfect. What about those all night sim sessions that they have to do? Cut the guys some slack. And remember, if you can't beat the system, you can always join it:ok:

[GoreTex]

Jeb,
no sympathy for the trainers, I guess they volunteered to become trainers or were they forced now? Many have been in the left hand seat for barley 6 months and beg to become trainers to shaft the senior non training guys and then after having a cosy roster for years cry foul because they get bypassed to the big bird if they dont resign from training, sounds like a bit of hypocrisy to me, I guess you cant have it all.

[Oceanic]

Just looked at the pre-assigned flights for April, specifically Ek775.

On the following days they are assigned to training: 1,2,4,5,6,10,11,12,15,21,22,23,24,25,and 28.

That is 15 days or 50% of the flights pre-assigned. As you probably only get a chance in your top or second top month to bid for them, how on earth can one have a hope in getting there. (I have family there and have managed a single trip in 2 years). Similar trends for various European destinations. Convince me the system is equitable.

[donpizmeov]

You want to know something is equitable? Do you work at EK?

The Don

[fatbus]

Pre assigned does not mean only training. As said before training is allowed 30% that s it , the rest goes to CRS/CRM/CP/ you name it the list is endless of those that can pull flights