RA-Aus Instructor Rating

[DarkSarcasm503]

Hi All

I'm currently toying with the idea of doing an RA-Aus Instructor Rating. I figure it must improve my flying somewhat and have a vague hope of using it to earn a little extra dosh to fund this addiction of mine.

I have a few questions though:
- What does the rating involve?
- Is the course something you can do 1-2 days per week over a long period or does it need to be done in an intensive block?
- What are the prospects are of being employed as an instructor if you can only work 1-1.5 days per week?
- How much does it cost to do the course?
- How do you assess if you'd be suited to instructing?

Does anyone know of airfields around Melbourne (preferably eastern suburbs or north/south eastern) that offer the rating?

Any help/advice is appreciated.

Cheers!

[DarkSarcasm503]

Thanks for your reply.

Nah I haven't fallen out with the other forum, but figured I may as well use all the resources at my disposal.

The reason I asked about part time is because I would only be available on weekends (I have a full time day job) so wasn't sure if employers would be uninterested in hiring a weekend person or not. I don't particularly want to spend the money on the rating only to find that no employers are remotely interested in employing someone part-time.

I haven't taken many pax up yet (most of my friends are too poor and/or find the idea terrifying) but those I have taken up said I explained things well and they felt very safe with me etc, so I suppose that's a step in the right direction. I just feel that there's probably a gap between 'explaining things well' in that situation and actually teaching somebody. I really don't want to be 'that' instructor, who is a crap teacher so really shouldn't be instructing...

[VH-XXX]

As long as you don't end up like the instructor I know who's students were not wanting to fly with him after 3pm which is when he started to get the shakes through a lack of VB. He is still floating around in yoru area by the way.

[Centaurus]

Add to that the 30? hour PMI course on how to instruct

What a rip-off. Is there an internet course available? Surely all you need is a two days at the most to learn the basics.

[717tech]

DarkSarcasm. As said you need 20 hours of dual instruction and from memory 30 hours of briefings as well as the PMI course. I would suggest trying to get enough time off to complete it in one go rather than a bit here and there.... its not as simple as just flying a plane anymore, you will sleep well each night :)

I personally instructed part time for a while as I also had a full time job. As stated generally the full timers fly during the week.

If your prepared to go interstate, Adelaide Biplanes at Aldinga can run the course, but its "on demand".

[DarkSarcasm503]

Hi 717. Unfortunately there's no way I can get the time off, at least not for at least a year, so part-time is my only option. If I could though, I'd definitely consider Aldinga, I've flown out of there once before, they're a good setup and the Sportys are nice aircraft

[Ultralights]

go for it Darky, i did mine about 4 yrs ago now, but full time over 7 days, totalled about 25 hrs all up, plus a 2 day PMI course at temora. total cost was about 5K including accommodation and food at the aero club.
I only fly on weekends, as i work full time suffering through being a contractor to the NAVY at present.
as for work, there is plenty in NSW, we are constantly after new instructors out of Bankstown, but need a minimum of PPL as well for Class D.
I have been flying out of Bankstown now every weekend since the closure of Hoxton Park, not so much no i have bought my own aircraft, now i spend most weekends flying all over the country side for some corporate types.

the big question, how do you think you will be suited to Instructing?
well, thats a tough one, firstly is the right attitude, if your doing it for your own satisfaction in teaching and learning, then your half way there to being a good instructor. if you like helping others, and have patience in explaining stuff, you will be a good instructor, having a cool head is a good attribute,as some students will try to kill you, not intentionally of course, but keep cool, and be confident, it helps students relax. and most importantly, Make it fun!!

a lot also depends on your teaching methods, i like to get my students to think of solutions on their own,and encourage my students to do homework, to save on briefing time,( i hate giving briefs)
an example of my methods are with stalls, in briefing, explain the recovery, reduce angle of attack, increase power smoothly, and note the stick "stall"position, once in the air, demonstrate a stall then get the student to explain what they think is happening while they do it.. ask the students what they should do, let them make mistakes, but be ready to help and take over quickly when needed.
Dont just parrot stuff, and get them to parrot the same in the air. get them to think about whats going on and they will learn much faster...

Dont get impatient with students, they all learn at different paces, and some you will have personality clashes with, and some you just cannot teach, i have had some students that needed to be bordering on verbally abused before they learned anything, drill sergeant style, others will soak it up like a sponge and fly like a natural.

most important, Have Fun!

[Cessna152Pilot]

I think RVAC at Coldstream do it?
Im sure i read it.

Could give them a ring??

[rgmgbg01]

20 hours flying is a very limited amount of time do get a proper foundation.
30 hours on theory is even worse.

Do your self a favour - spend the extra $$ on decent training (even a "quicky" instructor rating should be 30 hours flying and 6 weeks theory - more would be better). You will only realise that it is money well spent when you finish.

[VH-XXX]

She IS talking RAA after all... Its not rocket science.

If you can start a 2-stroke you are half way there.

[maverick22]

more work in GA than RAA will ever be

I find that hard to believe. There are RAAus schools popping up everywhere, and the GA schools seem to be going the other way.

And what exactly is your husband building hours up for, if he was going down the RAAus instructing route anyway?

The original poster sounds as if they just want to do it for fun, to keep their hand in so to speak.

I instructed RAAus and GA for a few years, and I clocked up a lot of hours very quickly. The bulk of it was ultralight though. I'd say the mix was about 70% ultralight instruction, compared to 30% GA instruction. It was a means to an end though, as my ultralight instructor rating got me my first GA instructing job.

[DarkSarcasm503]

Anyone know how to make pproon actually tell you when people post? *sigh*

I'm not planning on an aviation career. I've just started my first job in a law firm and I'm just thinking that instructing part time on weekends could be a fun way to earn a bit extra money. So I'm not doing it for hour building or anything.

I have nearly completed my PPL, so I do have GA experience, but don't have the money, time or (currently) inclination to do a CPL just to do a GA FI rating. The CPL is a long way down the track after I do fun stuff like tailwheel ;)

[Allan L]

User CP (Control Panel) -> Settings and Options -> Edit Options -> Messaging and Notification -> Default Thread Subscription Mode.

[DarkSarcasm503]

Cheers. I have it set there to alert me and it usually does then sometimes I come back and there's 10 new posts and it hasn't bothered to tell me. It's rather indescisive really...

[maverick22]

I did most of my instructing in Melbourne. There is Tooradin, Lilydale, Coldstream, Tyabb etc. just to name a few. More airfields and flying schools than you can poke a stick at down in Victoria! I worked at a couple of these places and we couldn't get enough RAA instructors.

[DarkSarcasm503]

Thanks Maverick :)

I currently fly out of Lilydale but they don't offer the rating. I'm emailing Coldstream at the moment about possibly doing the rating with them, so have to see how that goes. I'd prefer to say on the eastern side since it's closer to home and I'd prefer not to travel too far for it, so Coldstream would be a pretty ideal option since Lilydale aren't offering it.

[maverick22]

Yes sorry, I don't think any of those places would offer instructor training itself, I was just saying that they all operate busy RAAus schools. I'm sure once qualified though you would pick up a weekend instructing gig easily enough. Not sure who's doing instructor ratings these days though, best off going with VH-XXX's suggestions, or better still ring up RAAus and ask, I'm sure they'll point you in the right direction:ok:.

[Homesick-Angel]

I did an RA IR a while ago and found it a great learning experience..

If you are happy to work part time on your weekends, then it will be pretty good for that too.

The school I did it with teaches GA and RA, and they made me do the GA briefs

Choose a school that has good standards in both prac and theory otherwise you may be teaching some poor sod a thousand different ways to die..

Knowing something and then knowing it to teach are two very different things, and it really plugged some of the holes in my knowledge particularly around aerodynamics...

Id say if you want to bring your knowledge along, and understand the principles behind what youve already learnt, then an IR is a good way to go.
It is also a good way to get into the air on someone else's coin, but it is a responsibility.

Down the track if you decide to do a GA I rating it lops 10 hours of the course(from memory), but thats about it..Also no matter what anyone sais here, if you have a certain amount of hours instructing RA, then you will be attractive to a GA school once you have passed your GA rating

Good luck

[VH-XXX]

Matt75 (or your better half), your experiences have been "tainted" around RAA. At Tyabb RAA training was a very low priority. They felt that GA was the way to go and they priced their RAA aircraft at almost the same figures (if not more) than the lower GA aircraft that they had. Aside from a "few" students, it never really took off there, so to speak. You'll never attract new students with that pricing structure. Tooradin on the other hand, only 10 miles from there, don't even do GA and they probably fly way more hours, with cheaper prices and less politics.

[Cessna152Pilot]

She IS talking RAA after all... Its not rocket science.

If you can start a 2-stroke you are half way thereYour are a spastic...

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

I have nearly completed my PPL

Great experience for an RAA instructor - go for it! :E

Dr :8

[VH-XXX]

Dr. you are a funny fellow. One could take that the wrong way... Unless that was what you intended :-)

Cessna152pilot says: Your are a spastic...

Well based on your language skills I'm left wondering if you are even qualified to suggest that. I guess after having recently completing your GFPT you already know more than everyone else here then?




Sure, 500+ members that don't get along! You can't count beer drinkers and those that fly once a year as flying members. Come to think of it, Tooradin doesn't even have a club so not much of a comparison there. They are probably better off as there are zero politics that way. I don't have enough fingers to count the number of clubs that have political issues. If it's not avgas theft it's missing beer from the bar, it never ends.

How many RAA aircraft does Tyabb have online? Is it one 1994 Gazelle or a fleet of two?

[DarkSarcasm503]

Great experience for an RAA instructor - go for it! http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

If you were aiming for sarcasm, then yes, you're right, I don't have hundreds of hours like a GA CPL. For what it's worth, I do have over 100 and by the time I've finished the rating, if I choose to do it, I'll have a couple more. One thing is for certain though - I won't be considering instructing anyone unless and until the school I train with says that I am capable to do so.

[motzartmerv]

LoL, never ceases to amaze me, the arrogance of some pilots. Hey guys, I have some news for you all. There are now more RAA schools in australia than GA. Get off the sinking ship lads while you still can.

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

For what it's worth, I do have over 100 and by the time I've finished the rating, if I choose to do it, I'll have a couple more.

A wealth of experience to pass on to your students!

Dr :8

[motzartmerv]

Lol, as apposed to the massive 150 hours that a GA grade 3 would have.
In Tin cans that my nanna could fly too no less.:ok:

[motzartmerv]

well actually. The RAA Pilot needs 75 hours command hours. Plus the 30 or 40 to get the licence, which is around 110, then the 20 hours of instructor training. So not vastly different at all. The Instructor rating is the same apart from the 30 hours mutual time. The only thing thats not on the syllabus is BIF.
Don't let the facts get in the way of a good bash hey??
What exactly is a "private RAA".. Im an RAA CFI and am unfamiliar with this term.Please educate me.

[VH-XXX]

The word Private was in quotes " " to emphasise the comparison to GA.

eg. Private RAA hours = similar to Private GA / PPL hours and ultimately CPL hours.

Was to highlight the fact that in RAA you have 100 hours "Private flying" ie, command hours flying around in circles (which may include obtaining your cert) versus a CPL which as you know is quite obviously different and is a lot more dual than in RAA and with the IR on top of that.

[Homesick-Angel]

Oh Boy..

here we go again..

:ugh:

[OZBUSDRIVER]

How much pay does an RAA instructor make in a week?

[djpil]

The Instructor rating is the same apart from the 30 hours mutual time.That doesn't seem like the same to me. Perhaps I'm a slow learner or else I had some good fellow students but I learnt a whole lot with my mutual flying.

One significant difference is that the CASA FIR includes spinning but I'm sure that darksarcasm will do that regardless.

GA instructors straight from a CPL get good at it after a few years so I'm sure that the RAA situation is the same.

[BloggsJnr]

DarkSarcasm,

Is the course something you can do 1-2 days per week over a long period or does it need to be done in an intensive block?

I would say yes, and no: the theory/classroom sections can be done over a period of time, as they require that you learn the theory thoroughly, develop and then deliver the classroom briefings. The practical side should be done in as short a time as possible, you will develop more quickly through intensive flying sequences than if you do one or two flights per weekend.

What are the prospects are of being employed as an instructor if you can only work 1-1.5 days per week?

I would say relatively high: training facilities tend to be busier at weekends, so that's where there's more demand for instructors.

How much does it cost to do the course?

Somewhere around $5-6,000.

How do you assess if you'd be suited to instructing?


You want to learn more and enjoy sharing your knowledge with others.
Someone at your flight facility has suggested you might be a good instructor
You have your license and are left thinking: I like this flying stuff, but I need a reason to get out to the airfield each weekend
You can converse with people of all ages and backgrounds, especially about aviation


I obtained an RAAus instructor rating with relatively low flying experience, and have learnt so much from the experience. There's no substitute for "recency" in aviation, and you'll get the by the bundle! But most importantly, you need to have a great mentor in your CFI, because the rating is only the beginning, there's so much to still learn and you'll need that mentor to help you through.

All the best!

[maverick22]

Oh dear, look what has happened now!

I'm no RAAus basher, as that is where I started, but there is a major difference between the standards of these 2 forms of flying.

For those of you who are under the belief that an RAAus instructor rating is similar in content and training to the GA instructor rating, you are sorely misguided. Yes, I agree under the direction of a good CFI you can be taught to be a decent RAAus instructor, but from my experience in the industry there are some dodgy RAA CFI's out there.

To qualify for the RAAus rating, you merely need a pilot certificate (20hrs), X country endo (not sure what that is now, but it was 5hrs when I was in the game:ugh:), a passenger carrying endo (10 hrs command and checked by the CFI), and 75 hrs command (flying circuits and buzzing around the training area).
Then 20 hrs dual for the rating and 30 hrs in the classroom. Hey presto, you are then qualified to teach someone to fly. Now wait for the best part... after 50 hrs of instructional experience, these highly skilled individuals have the power to send someone solo.:eek:

This compared to a CPL, who must first of all complete at least the 150hr course. As a minimum you need a night VFR rating (which should be included in the CPL) or an instrument rating. You then do the instructor rating. Its 50 hrs flying. That is 20 hrs dual plus 30 hrs mutual (with another candidate practising). Or it could just be 50 hours dual (which I did because I was the only one on the course). The classroom stuff I think was around 120 hours and included briefing anything from effects of controls through to the finer points of how a constant speed propellor works. Now that's up around the 200+hour mark, and the person has been trained to a commercial standard and examined by a delegate of CASA. That gets you a basic grade 3 instructor rating where you must be supervised for the first 100 hours, and indirectly supervised for the next 150 hrs after which you do a flight test and upgrade to a grade 2 instructor rating. Then you can send your student on their first solo.

Now that aside, like others have said if you have some experience, have a passion for imparting knowledge and receive the right training an RAAus instructor rating is a great way to keep your hand in and have some fun on the weekends

[OZiPilot]

Would the pay grades differ at all? Between GA and RA or depends on school?

[VH-XXX]

Would the pay grades differ at all? Between GA and RA or depends on school?


That is a very interesting question for which there is no exact answer.

Very hard to compare, you might be comparing a GA sausage factory operation with very specific pay grades and a large staff to a small country operation with 2 instructors but with high pay. It all depends.

Either way you can never get paid enough to have your students try and kill you in every lesson :E

[cficare]

Darky...don't be put off by the RAA bashers.

Instructing is a great thing to do (for some) provided you have a passion for it. GA (for instance) is riddled with CPL's with IR's ....only trying to build hours and then move on. They really dont care about the student or their progress.

Once you have your rating you will be closely monitored by a CFI to ensure that you are maintaining a good standard and developing your personal instructional skills.

Weekend instructing is fun. It is a break away from the Monday-to-Fridayitis and keeps your flying and people skills well honed. (you may even be able to pay for the fuel you use to drive to the airfield!!)

The majority of RAA students are doing 'it' because they have always wanted to but found GA (costs and regulation) was too hard.

Learning to become an Instructor will teach you a lot about yourself....take the challenge.

[OZiPilot]

I agree with Cficare in that some instructors are there purely for hours and the students are just numbers with bank cards, i know some like this (why i moved schools). (as have friends)

Know I'm at school and my own instructor will always go the extra yards for me :ok:

[cficare]

Sorry to get u offside Matt1....i've only got 5000hrs GA instructor time...and am totally enjoying the RAA instructing...

Students need to be more positive/pro-active about the instruction/instructors they use.

I had one in my distant past that after one lesson, I told the CFI.."I won't fly eith xxxxx ever again"!!

[daldy]

hi guys,
im only new to this site...as of today, but i have read through these posts, and have a bit to say in reply to some of the things ive read in here.

The one that i want to reply to is maverick22....
Mav...how is GA instructing different to RAA instructing (aside from the BIF)??
The same principals are there in regard to how the aircraft is flown, and the same processes is there if the engine fails....we circuit the same, we fly by the attitude of the aircraft....where is it differing????

Yes, you only need 75 hours in command once you have your license, and the pax endo, and the X country endo, followed by the 30 hours PMI, and 20 hours minimum to do the flight training.
But just remember two things....one is that the 20 hours is MINIMUM, meaning that if it takes more for the candidate to get him/her to the standards of an instructor, then they do more. They will be taught to be an instructor. Their job is to teach a student to fly the aeroplane, in the best and safest manor, breeding them as a good pilot.
The second is that the instructor candidate is then tested by a Pilot Examiner. If they arent capable of training someone to be a pilot, then they wont be given the rating. Its quite simple.
Also, as for sending students solo after 50 hours instructing...again, they cant get the senior rating allowing this to happen until they have a MINIMUM of 50 hours, and have RECOMMENDED students to go solo. Meaning that they have to make an assessment of the student, then recommend them to a senior instructor/CFI before they can go solo. Its not until the competency has been reached that they will be given this privilege.
Darksarcasm was asking for some assistance, to gain some knowledge of what is involved...not a bashing between the two sectors of flying. Which by the sounds of it, is mostly what is in the replies.

[OZiPilot]

Spot on Daldy!

I've also noticed every thread that mentions the word "RAA" instantly becomes "GA v RAA"

Fact is the we are both here (in Australia and share the same sky) and not going anywhere anytime soon! so best we just get use to it!

As Daldy mentioned the OP has asked for some advice \ opinions and it just got hijacked into a p!ssing match!

:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

[VH-XXX]

I'm surprised to see posters comparing RAA instructors to GA instructors in terms of skills and quality when you don't even have to have a PPL to be an RAA instructor. Speaks for itself doesn't it.

[motzartmerv]

No, what speaks for itself is the mass exodus away from GA instructors (generally). You don't need a PPL this is true, but most have one. What also speaks for itself is the hours of conversion training I have to put PPL holders through when converting to jabiru's or the like. Nothing like a slippery RAA acft to humble any GA pilot.:E

[mates rates]

Slightly off arguement here but does anyone know what pay award RAA instructors come under?

[daldy]

matt....
im an raa instructor, with no intention of going ga instructing or cpl.....im happy where i am and plan to continue doing it for as long as i can.
raa instructors are no lower than ga instructors......thered b nothing wrong with 'settling' as an raa instructor....

[motzartmerv]

Matt. I have done refresher training with multi thousand hour CPL holders in RAA aircraft.
Have also converted several heavy jet pilots onto RAA aircraft. Is your hubby flying for the airlines now?..If so, why would he need to get an instructor rating?
Mates rates. I'm not sure what award they fall under. Some schools have instructors still doing it for the love, although this is certainly not the norm any more.
I Pay My senior instructor $25/ flying hour and a $40 retainer if she is at work all day. 2-3 hour (flying) days are pretty standard. Not going to get rich but well worth the drive to the airfield.
Hope this helps.:ok:

[maverick22]

Matt, no you cannot automatically instruct raa with a gr 2. You still need to convert the rating. If your hubby wants the airlines, he needs to get his but into gear and get those atpls.

I'll say it again, i am no raa basher, i'm all for it. I was a former raa cfi myself. I just think the standards set by the raa are not enforced enough. Like I said, I have seen some dodgy raa instructors in my time. I knew a cfi who, with a wink and nudge, used to hand out instructor ratings.

That aside, on the most part there are some excellent raa instructors out there. As for the op, go for it!:ok:

[motzartmerv]

Examiners giving out Level 2 authority's now? Never let the truth get in the way of a good yarn hey. Level 2's are granted by the tech manager of RAA. And last i heard, he doesn't drink beer.
Instructor ratings are an approval granted by the ops manager on a reccomendation from a CFI with instructor training approval, and must be backed up by the relevant paperwork. Cases of beer being sent by fax or email VHXXX.?
Keep it real mate, your accusations are simply laughable and do nothing for your credibility. When you have nothing else, lets just make some stories up hey?:ok: I mean fair crack of the whip, to belittle the RAA instructor to the point of suggesting all he needs to do is purchase a case of beer??. How do you guys come up with this stuff?

$25/ hour is quite reasonable and is a by product of RAA keeping prices low and affordable by the common man, perhaps another reason why people are fleeing GA in droves.

All this being said, im afraid i must agree with some sentiments. There are some dodgy RAA instructors and CFI's. Just the same as there are dodgy GA instructors.

Matt. As others have said, a GA instructor rating doesn't allow you to instruct in RAA. However if you have 25 hours in any aircraft that is registrable under RAA then the conversion is just a flight check with a CFI (with instructor training approval). Aircraft like Jabiru, sportstar, gazelle all fall into this category.

cheers (gunna go buy some beer and see if i can con a CFI into giving me an A380 endorsement)

[VH-XXX]

PM sent Merv.

Happy to share information that you have requested. This is not the place to do so.

[superdimona]

Gee, it's been at least 3 days since our last useless RAA vs GA debate. And if someone has a heap of time flying say trikes, and wants to train to become an instructor in them, I don't really see how getting a PPL and flying Cessnas and the like is relevant. Should I need to be a truck driver before training to become a motorbike instructor?


as a wife that has seen all the bulls&Ût that comes with achieving a airline dream, i think id kill him if he said he has decided to settle for RAA instructing, not because its RAA but for the fact we'd have alot more money in the bank otherwiseI don't think anyone becomes an RAA instructor to get rich. The whole point of the RAA is inexpensive (in theory) flying for the fun of it, without a lot of the pointless BS that goes with GA.

Personally I'd rather be taught be someone who is in it for the love rather then someone who sees me as another hour for their logbook. My guess is there are a lot more of the latter type in GA.

[Frank Arouet]

Most WW2 German "Aces" by-passed the primary glider and jumped straight into a FW190. Didn't they?:confused:

This thread is all about "aeroplane drivers" ego's rather than aviators.

It highlights "THE" Australian "aviation peculiarity" -somewhat like chooks sorting out a "pecking order", and while all this is going on the fox in Canberra eats them one by one.

Wake up to yourselves.

[manymak]

Mozart, $25p/hr... Jeez your generous. :{

[daldy]

$25 per hour may not seem like a lot to most people, but when u are doing something that u love, purely for the love of it, then u would do it for peanuts!

And spending an entire day at an airfield, even if just working for half of that day....wouldn't worry me at all....i still get the joy of seeing the satisfaction of a student/pilots face when they step out of the aeroplane,after having spent an hour, enjoying their passion!..........Bring it on all day, every day, i say!!!

[Ultralights]

i dont know about doing it for peanuts... i love instructing and flying as much as you, but i would not do it for nothing...unless im just having fun in my own aircraft.

[motzartmerv]

Matt.Why are you yelling?
Whats this crap about vomit on shoulders? Students throwing up is very rare, and even rarer for them to chuck up on the instructor. I have a couple thousand hours instructing and have never had any form of body fluid expelled on me.
If hubby is having issues with this then i sugest a career change, 300 people in a jumbo all chucking up is gunna cost the airline a mint in cleaning.

[daldy]

matt,
the school i train at is very busy, with some students who have mortgages, but also some that have a nice pocket size......though this fact being in the equation, is completely irrelevant to them learning with us......or in fact at all.
as for earning $40 for the day and not flying......well.....there are quite a number of instructors that will go above and beyond for their love of the job......theres always something that can be done to help the students and even the instructors,....us RAA guys dont just leave them at the receipt book......we too, spend time with them for exams, before and after, and we even have a chat to them, as people.

how are you limited with RAA???? i know the difference of the CTA, but as i said in my initial reply.....we all fly the same...we have the same rules/regs as the GA guys...we're also extensively thorough in our teaching also.....

having vomit and the like from a student.....well...ive never experienced it personally, though i definately wouldnt have a problem with it...i know that if it was me...id want compassion from my instructor....i like the...treat people as you would like to be treated scenario....i think it works pretty well in life....

i know you said it as a joke....but i really disagree with putting things up like the beer/jim beam thing....just remember....your hubby was a newbie instructor at one stage too.......we all had to go through the same steps to get a rating.....i know i sure dont appreciate that privilege to be degraded! i take pride in my instructor rating....even if its a lowly RAA one!

[VH-XXX]

How does Matt from Tyabb feel about you writing his life story and your aspirations for him in this thread for so many to view?

[DarkSarcasm503]

Matt1/Matt1975 - perhaps you should choose one account and stick with it

[VH-XXX]

we all fly the same...we have the same rules/regs as the GA guys...

Really? Not limited?

What about the 5,000 ft limit, CTA, NVFR, Aerobatics and IFR?

[daldy]

vh-xxx....thats right...not limited. my interpretation of the 'limit' of an RAA instructor, by the sounds of the post, as being, as to where they can go with their instructing or even their flying. yea they may not be endorsed to teach these things, but it doesnt mean that if they are an RAA instructor, then they can do nothing further!!!! the sky is the limit for all pilots. there is absolutely nothing stopping a dude becoming a captain for qantas...even if he started out as an RAA instructor.

[djpil]

A little way down the track I wonder if we will be discussing the situation where the RAA training regime seems to be working and perhaps GA instructors teaching up to PPL don't need to hold a CPL.
I recall a draft CASA reg some years ago along those lines.

Of course, the required standards for an instructor Gr 3 will still apply and I know that a little while ago CASA initiated action with the aim of significantly improving new Gr 3s. Seems to be a fairly high failure rate at the first test these days.

RAA instructors seem to be paid a little higher down around Melbourne, DarkSarcasm503, so a day's wages should easily cover the travel costs in your flash car.

[matt1975]

woohoo
hubby got a job.. funny thing is after everything id been saying in this thread, looks like he'll be instructing raa as well. mixture of everything

[motzartmerv]

Great stuff matt..Good to hear...:ok:

[SW3]

For the life of me, why did this thread end up being yet another RAA/GA bash??
DarkSarcasm, good on you for wanting to do your instructor rating! :ok: You will get much enjoyment out of it and learn a hell of a lot about flying and meet all sorts of people from all walks of life.
Don't let the negative sorts get you down. In reality obtaining an RAA Instructor rating isn't a simple walk in the park as some people here have suggested. It is a lot of work and must be done properly and you will have a lot of supervision as it is an important rating. There are definitely no hand outs or winks and nods. Nonetheless it is well worth it and is a massive accomplishment.
The more hours you can get the better and your flying will be well and truly honed by the end of it. Remember there are brand new low hour CPL Instructor Rating holders out there teaching prospective airline pilots. It's the importance of wanting to be a good and professional instructor that matters. A fully commited instructor can pass on more than an airline wish to be who is only there to build hours and doesn't care about his students.
As for the GA/RAA argument, don't listen. If RAA is all that you wish to do, thats great! Later down the track if you wish to follow the CPL path you have a fantastic grounding for it. After all, ab-initio 3 axis instructing is the same in a Jabiru or even a Thruster as it is in a Cessna.

[flyinkiwi]

Reading through the threads, the one thing both sides agree upon is the most pertinent imo. A lot depends on the culture of the organization as set down by the CFI. If you have a CFI who is passionate about what they do and how they do it then that will filter down through the whole organization.

[Wallsofchina]

Darky you little devil, you've set them up again!
I'm sure you're writing a behavioural psychology thesis!

[DarkSarcasm503]

Darky you little devil, you've set them up again!

....again?

[metalman2]

I'm surprised to see posters comparing RAA instructors to GA instructors in terms of skills and quality when you don't even have to have a PPL to be an RAA instructor. Speaks for itself doesn't it.

VH-XXX,,,,,you recently put your hand up to be on the board for RAAus ,you seem to have a bug up your ar5e about RAA, just wondering about your motivation there?,you don't appear to be very keen on seeing RAA grow?

[VH-XXX]

Thanks for dragging up a 9 month old thread, bored are we?

[metalman2]

just catching up on the rest of the story and got wondering about what your about,,,,after reading your posts and hearing of you in the RAA board elections , I reckon it's a valid question!

[VH-XXX]

If that is the case then, fair enough and I'm more than happy to answer your queries via PM.

[Wallsofchina]

You're the PM King VH, but you can tell us