Becoming a Airline Pilot

[Nooby]

I am about to start year 12 and I am deciding on a career pathway. I am looking at the possibility of learning to become a airline pilot, a job that has always interested me. The University of South Australia offers a bachelor of applied science in aviation, is this a good way of doing it? Would this be attractive to major airlines like Virgin, and Qantas?

Any replies are greatly appreciated :)

[Mr.Buzzy]

Get yourself A instructa!

Bbbbbbbbbzzzzzzzzbbbbbbbbb

[Cessna 180]

One would have thought that by the beginning of year 12 you may have learnt the correct use of grammar.

You may find that usefull when applying for any job.

[HomeJames]

C180

Google (http://www.google.com.au/#hl=en&biw=1259&bih=524&q=usefull&aq=f&aqi=g-s5g1g-s4&aql=&oq=&fp=1&cad=b)

I find it a jolly good idea to ensure one's house is in proper order before casting aspersions on others.

Nooby, I do believe that this subject has many previous threads. I highly recommend using the search function to find aforementioned.

Straight Home and Don't Spare the Horses

[tmpffisch]

You may find that usefull when applying for any job.

....but spelling isn't? :ok:

Best to go visiting flying schools and uni open days. All you'll get into here is a debate about whether it's better for an airline gig to have been to uni or not, and whether a pilot job is a profession versus a trade (debates which has been argued here many times).

(This also isn't really the correct forum for your question. "Which Flying School?" threads don't last long.)

[Skystar320]

usefull
FAIL!

Report Card: D-

Though, we are only human! And I also suck at engrish

[Nooby]

Thank you for the advice, I will look into that :)

Oh, and by the way, "You may find that usefull when applying for any job." - Sucked in ******

[KRUSTY 34]

Gidday Nooby:

Forget degree's, forget "planning" the most logical path, UNLESS, you truely want to get your arse into an aeroplane, any aeroplane more than anything else in the world. If that's not the case, you may find the outcome in this brave new world of ours something less than what you might expect.

Not being negative, but I am flying more and more with people that have skipped points A,B,....gone straight to F, and are now asking, "...so, is this all there is?"

[40Deg STH]

Krusty, very well said, I can't agree more. I was already gliding by 15 and hanging around airports every chance I could get. I still love the smell of Jet fuel fumes in the morning!!!!:ok:

[Wally Mk2]

I always keep an eye out for these types of threads for amusement purposes not for the answers that pertain to the original question. The barrage of spelling police that must scan these threads day & night proof reading is amazing!!..............sad, real sad!:sad:
Spelling & grammar are overrated but seeing as flying skills are almost taking a back seat to what's needed to control a plane these days then I guess one must be correct right down to the dots & I's :-(

I'm surprised that some people don't use spell check here just to avoid this very situation.

'K34' you said it all:)

".............flying used to be fun Lou, it really was. You know pilots used to take real pride in just 'getting' there............." (or words to that effect) And the name of the movie those words came from was???................this ought to be good:ok: My all time fav movie:-)


Wmk2

[Critical Reynolds No]

Using 'Google' - Flight of the Phoenix.

[HulaBula]

Nooby, if yours is a genuine enquiry, welcome. I remember trying to get useful info about an aviation career when I started out.

I'll keep it brief.

1. Take and Pass English and "Real" Maths in Year 12 this year.

If you pass Year 12 English and "real" Mathematics this year, you will meet and exceed the minimum current education standard for all Australian employers of pilots.

The following Australian companies specify completed Undergraduate degree as an employment requirement:
(none)

The following companies specify minimum Year 12 school requirements:
Defence Forces minimum criteria (http://www.airforce.gov.au/psa/selection_process.aspx)
Qantas Direct Entry Pilot Minimum Criteria (http://careers.qantas.com.au/Careers/Pilots/Direct-Entry/Minimum-Criteria/Minimum-Criteria-for-Direct-Entry-Pilots-Nov-2009.aspx)
Qantas Cadet Entry Minimum Criteria (http://careers.qantas.com.au/Careers/Pilots/Cadet-Program/Minimum-Criteria.aspx)
QantasLink Minimum Criteria (http://careers.qantas.com.au/Careers/Pilots/QantasLink-Direct-Entry/Minimum-Requirements.aspx)


Australian companies that have NO minimum schooling requirement:
Jetstar Minimum Criteria (http://www.bfound.net/detail.aspx?jobId=83519&CoId=27&rq=1)
Virgin Blue Recruitment: Attention (http://www.bfound.net/detail.aspx?jobId=78873&CoId=43&rq=4)
Cobham Airline Services (http://www.bfound.net/det-entry.aspx?jobid=85355&CoId=267&rq=6)
Skywest minimum criteria (http://www.skywest.com/careers/pilot/pilot-flight-jobs.php)

Get the picture?

The great majority of Australian pilots DO NOT have university qualifications. They are not needed for flying aeroplanes. Flying is a practical task. Commercial Pilot License and Air Transport Pilot License are awarded after gaining practical experience, in addition to passing some [u]government]/b] exams.

University qualifications are useful. Just ask the Universities ;) But not required. Larger flying organisations depend on people in support roles that have experience plus Uni quals. You can get them later if you are interested in management, planning, safety, etc.

2. Go see a doctor.

Click on this list of CASA approved doctors (http://www.casa.gov.au/scripts/nc.dll?WCMS:STANDARD::pc=PC_91522) find a doctor near you, and take a medical exam for a CASA Class 1 Medical Certificate. It will cost a few $$. Get used to it!

Tell the doctor you are considering a career as a Pilot. You would like to know if there are any foreseeable physical obstacles that would kill your ambition to work as a pilot.

Once you find that hearing deficiency, that eyesight problem, don't be immediately discouraged. Many pilots have minor physical problems that are manageable.

3. Clean up your act.

I've had a few friends that have been embarrassed when indiscretions committed when they were young and stupid, came back to haunt them.

Drink driving, speeding cars, petty theft, recreational drug use, pub fights, etc, don't look good at interview. Pretty soon we may be adding dumb and offensive Facebook and Twitter posts!

4. Get you @rse in or near anything that flies.

This is a 'doing' business. Get yourself on, near, or in an aeroplane in any capacity. And be 'doing' aviation on your way to being a pilot.

Hangar rat. Refueller. Air Training Corps. Volunteer at an aero museum. Flight Attendant. Etc.


Good luck!

[CFPlnr]

[QUOTE]I am looking at the possibility of learning to become a airline pilot/QUOTE]

I dunno, kids of today !!!

Don't aim to low there nooby.........:sad:

[Wally Mk2]

'CRN' that's cheating but yr 50% correct but what version of the movie (as in there was a re-make a few years ago) & whom was the actor that said that quote & to whom was he saying it to? There now go Google 'till ya hearts content:-)


'Nooby' if yr keen then just go for it. Nobody can answer yr Q's exactly. Life always throws curve balls at you anyway so you never know where one thing can lead you too.
Flying is what you make of it. Some make it a science others just go to work get the task done then go home & think nothing of it.:) Flying an airliner isn't rocket science so if you get to the pointy end then you must be reasonably okay at this flying game or the mired of 'net's along the way would have pulled you up long before the cockpit door slams shut:ok:
Some of the most respected & highly experienced pilots lay on the side of some hill out there so it's not all about the manipulative skills of today's modern Airliner:-)


Wmk2

[Kelly Slater]

There is an option to edit both posts and topics so the opportunity exists for people to correct their mistakes. Nooby, if you edit your topic to "Becoming an Airline Pilot", then the critics will have to remove their posts as they will no longer make any sense.

[Nooby]

Thank you again everyone for your insightful and much appreciated input!

I thought a degree may be an advantage when applying for promotions, eg. Command, alongside appropriate flight hours and licensing?

To be honest I am tossing up between medicine and aviation. I get a thrill out of flying, but also out of working with people. My concern is, do pilots really get to communicate with passengers?

I know I must sound naive, but haven't we all at one stage or another? I just think it is best I sound naive now and find out what I need to know, then not ask and finding out being a professional pilot is not for me.

[The Bunglerat]

Spelling & grammar are overrated

No, they are not. The ability to spell and to structure a sentence correctly is a clear indicator of a person's intelligence and standard of education, both of which I consider to be important prerequisites for anyone considering a career in aviation. Granted, I don't plan on writing a literary masterpiece any time soon, but I still consider it important to be able to distinguish between "to," "two" and "too." Unfortunately there are many on these forums who do not, or worse, can't even tell the difference.

Language and the ability to effectively communicate ideas in verbal and written form, along with the capacity for imagination, are all that set us apart from the rest of the animal kingdom.

Rant over (and apologies for perpetuating thread drift).

[Wally Mk2]

............gee 'bunglerat' keep ya shirt on there!:E

You sound like my old Engrish teacher back in the bad 'ole days where we used to get 6 of the best just for talking in class:-) I was one of the dumbest kids at school, true story. Failed near every Engrish & arithmetic test there was but I still got to fly a plane & i write for a Mag so again Spelling & Grammar are over rated just depends on whom is reading yr CV I guess someone just as dumb or someone with a dictionary up his ass:E


Wmk2

[Jack Ranga]

Add to to, too and two

there, their and they're.

The problem I've got with it is the idiot teachers that are either teaching them this or letting the poor dears think that it's ok to communicate in this fashion?

Bet there is a bit of proof reading going on with your articles there Wal? :E:E

[Jack Ranga]

Nooby, if you have the choice between medicine and aviation for chist sake take medicine. You will own your own plane after about 10 years.

Your income is protected as a medico, as a pilot you will be copping it up the jaxxy for the rest of your life :ok:

[tmpffisch]

I agree, if those are the choices.......choose medicine. In essence, EVERY pilot should agree.

[psycho joe]

Should also add LOOSE and LOSE. :ugh:

Eg. If your marbles become loose, then you may lose them.

[Wally Mk2]

'JR' proof reading & spell check are a writers safeguard to literary hell!

Yr also probably correct re the Medico choice but there's still something about piloting a plane & surviving the experience:-) People fear going to the Dr's they would also if they knew my background :E Trouble is to be a quack you kind of need to know what yr doing but any fool can fly a plane:)


...........I wonder whether that wether will survive the weather..............

Wmk2

[Jack Ranga]

Wal, as I say mate, he could own his own plane after about 10 years. He could even invest in a Kingair for him and his mates for all the country clinics.

Ah, aviation on my terms :D love it! :ok:

Yep, any dumbass can fly a plane, piloting it is a bit different ;)

[Virtually There]

Last I checked, if you wanted to get into medicine then you did need a firm grasp of English spelling and grammar - because you need to be near the top of your year to qualify for a Bachelor of Medicine & Surgery degree. The minimum ATAR for the above course at the University of WA last year was 96.0.

Perhaps the military might be a better option . . . :E

[Pontius]

It never ceases to amaze me how many pilots would be doctors and vice versa. Two of my AMEs had been professional pilots, I've flown with many pilots who were doctors and then changed careers to plough the ether and I know two who were young and keen enough to go the other way, i.e. leave the skies for a medical ward.

My take on things: if you get a good enough TER/TEA (whatever they're calling them this year) then go for the medicine.....I wish I had. Yes, a junior doctor is going to learn the skills of a zombie and be able to prescribe stuff while in a comatose state and it's going to take a considerable amount of time before the big $$$s kick in BUT compare and contrast that with guys looking to get into the airline game now and it's no different. I'd much rather be chasing (female) nurses around the ward, even though I'd be half asleep, than having to serve up burgers and fries while I wait to see if I can get another hour in a clapped out 152.

I consider myself very fortunate because the stars were aligned and I managed to jump from school to military flying to airline flying and have been very lucky in being in the right place at the right time. HOWEVER, if I'd chosen the other path I always considered (as Nooby is), by now I should have risen to the heady ranks of consultant surgeon, be able to afford a much bigger boat and be in my bed most nights, instead of stabbing myself with a pen to stay awake over some ocean or vast land.

I've got no choice now as I'm too old to convert (and couldn't afford the pay cut) but if I had my time again..........

[Virtually There]

Never too late, mate. Friend of mine started studying for medicine at the age of 35. She already had two degrees, so fast-tracked her undergrad studies, and finished her internship seven years later. She did the hard yards studying and working at the same time, but she proved to herself - and everyone else - that it was certainly possible.

[HulaBula]

I thought a degree may be an advantage when applying for promotions, eg. Command, alongside appropriate flight hours and licensing?
No. It is not a consideration for Command.

Getting a shot at Command is still seniority based in most airline companies. That is, having several years of unblemished (some may say unremarkable) employment history. Follow company rules, don't be creative, pass all your checks, and you will get the opportunity to qualify. Note I said opportunity to qualify, you would still have to pass the tests

A fellow with 1000hr on type and 2 years in company and a PhD will always run second in opportunity to qualify, to a guy that has a Year 12 education, an ATPL, company minimums and 5 years in company with nil significant events on his/her employment or training files. Always.

Now as to who would make the better Captain, well..... :E

My concern is, do pilots really get to communicate with passengers?
Yes. Over the PA, speaking from a script found in the company Operations Manual. You are warned not to make jokes, as they may be mis interpreted. It is also better to not make your PA while the movie is running. The PA will interrupt the morning news and the movie and irritate the pax.

Direct contact with passengers has been all but eliminated. In fact, it is actively discouraged. See Air Transport Security Regulations 2005 (http://www.comlaw.gov.au/Details/F2010C00817) at paragraph 2.39 (c)

I get a thrill out of flying, but also out of working with people.
You might want to refine that a little more. Embalmers (http://listverse.com/2007/11/08/the-5-stages-of-embalming/) enjoy working with people, too.

Doctors also work with people. A&E specialists see healthy people permanently smashed up and disabled by stupid events like car accidents and domestic disputes. Oncologists often watch nice people slowly die. GP's often have to write medical certificates for time wasters, and be careful not to be hoodwinked into prescribing narcotics and analgesia to well spoken and nicely dressed drug addicts.

Medico friends of mine complain about inequities in workload and remuneration. Just like Pilots! Surgeons and anaesthetists in public hospitals often earn less than physiotherapists employed by professional sporting clubs. However it is also possible for a medico to earn ridiculous amounts of money, the penalty however is that they are usually very, very busy people. One friend wore the title Mister, way above a mere Doctor. However to earn his $400k salary would involve starting work at 6am, knock off at 6pm to have dinner with his family, then back to the office from 8pm to midnight to do his paperwork etc. Six days a week. Not my cup of tea!

So it aint all bread and circuses there, either.

The great advantage that a qualified doctor has, is that he or she can work for themselves, for the government, as a locum, or form a business or partnership.

An airline pilot has to work for an airline. And there's only a handful of those.

:ugh:

There is really only one thing that you ought consider before dedicating all your spare income until you are 25, and your entire working life to aviation -

Would any other occupation be second best, for you?

I've had to share flight decks with w@nkers, report to managers that were buffoons, fly aeroplanes maintained by gorrillas. Etc. Met a few nice people along the way too.

The one thing that keeps me in my seat is the view I reckon I'll have tomorrow morning at about 7am, of all the cars bumper to bumper on the freeway heading to work. To spend all their working day in little boxes with maybe no windows.

I'll clean up my ship, accelerate to 250KIAS and grin at them as my magic carpet climbs me to 33,000 feet. :cool:

You have to want this job. You won't survive all the sh!t that comes with it if that basic desire to fly is not driving you.

Good luck with your decision.

[adsyj]

HulaBula

Outstanding post.:ok:

[Jack Ranga]

I'll bet anybody here (not hear) that at least 95% of medical practitioners (even the gen y'ers) would know the difference between:

here : hear

weather : whether

lose : loose

to : too : two

there : their : they're

Which (not witch) would indicate some level of learning ability.

(and I bet hulabula drove to work amongst those same doods he saw when he took off)

[Jabiman]

(and I bet hulabula drove to work amongst those same doods he saw when he took off)
No he didn't because he had to go in to work at 0400!

[Jack Ranga]

He mustn't take the ring road!

[boltz]

Don't forget to consider the lifestyle that comes with the job.

[Jack Ranga]

boltz,

Neither of the lifestyles being discussed appeal.

But if you are going to live either of the lifestyles you may as well be respected, compensated etc

[Wally Mk2]

...........'JR' those pesky posters on other threads been teasing you with poor spelling & grammar hey?:)

One thing that a Dr doesn't have to do before he/she heads in to the 'office' for the day is get subjected to a security search & have to go thru numerous checks etc just so he/she can pilot a plane with an axe already in the cockpit just waiting for him/her!:ugh: Never could figure that one out:ugh:
I could never have been a Dr as I wasn't clever enough at school but got to be a 'pirot' & I still ain't clever!:E Still I love flying, I wonder how many Dr's love being a Dr?

Anyway all that blood & guts being a Dr, yuk ya can have that on ya own !:E


Wmk2

[KRUSTY 34]

Gidday Wal'.

I'll take a punt, no google. Jimmy Stewart to Richard (now Sir Richard) Attenborough.

Appologies for T.D. :E

[patienceboy]

Unless you are accepted into a cadetship you cannot become an Airline Pilot just by completing a degree program. Once you have your commercial license you must build experience and gradually work your way towards an airline job. This could take ten years or more and a degree will not fast track the process. Many people never make it.

To research your options, search for “cadetship”, “first job” and “going north” type threads. Also check out the Rex, Jetstar and Cathay Pacific websites for info on their cadetships. Talk to as many people as you can, but remember that some people will give you biased advice (both ways).

If I were in your position I would study my absolute hardest to be offered a spot in Medicine. Make it your single goal this year. You can deliberate all you like later on... Aviation will still be here in 12 months.

Good luck!

[Jack Ranga]

Wal, I don't sit and forensically analyse every post :) some just stick out like dogs balls!

I especially like the ones where pilots compare themselves to doctors/lawyers/accountants etc. I've met some pilots that could easily have completed degrees in any of those fields but if you want the money/rewards these guys earn I think you're going to have to present like them. :E

[xxgoldxx]

so I turn up to the airport and collect a flight plan and weather brief prepared by someone else to do a flight I must have been route checked on, with a plan stored in the FMS and a crew member who has done it a thousand times before with a fuel load to company SOP's and the AP ENG from Dep to short final on the FMS flown RNAV/ILS whatever with the auto throttle on the whole way... oh and I get to speak strictly controlled "pilot speak" on the radio (only as "PM" of course..) and occasionally a scripted few words straight from the ops manual to the pax...

so apart from the odd bit of moaning on Prune can anyone PLEASE tell us why the big deal with year 12 english..???

[walesregent]

Pick medicine. It is far easier to learn to fly if you have the sizable resources of a medical consultant, than it is to become a doctor later in life with the shaky pittance you risk making as a pilot. I say that as someone who is qualified in a medical field and who has basic qualifications as a pilot. Don't get me wrong, I love flying, but it is sure nice to be confident of making the next mortgage repayment/paying next year's private school fees, etc, and it is definitely possible to moonlight as a pilot- even flying the big stuff if you work at it hard enough. The best of both worlds, you might say.

[Jack Ranga]

Good advise walesregent :ok: there ya go boys & girls, straight from the horses mouth.

xxgoldxx, I wouldn't worry too much about it mate.

[Exaviator]

During some forty years in aviation of which thirty four were in-command I have flown with ex doctors, dentists, vets, engineers and a scientist all of whom had later trained to become a pilot, and were now completely satisfied with their current choice of employment.

I even watched a doctor on TV recently who wanted to win a Master Chef competition and run his own restaurant.

It is pretty obvious that all of these people had studied other fields of endeavor for all the wrong reasons - either guided by parents, economics or other circumstances, or had become disenchanted and moved on.

If you think a career in aviation is what you really want, then the sooner you get on with it the better.

It is a long road to success in this field, so you need to be self motivated, to have a burning desire to fly, and make the sacrifices to achieve your goal and truly become a professional aviator.

The rewards and sense of achievement are well worth it, or at least I think so.......

[walesregent]

Exaviator, all of the people you mentioned would have been well positioned to finance entry into an aviation career and probably well cushioned from the (let's face it) relatively high risk of failure to otherwise qualify or secure desirable employment. I'm not trying to sound like the guy's dad, but a career in aviation carries with it even more risks than any of the careers you mentioned, not the least of which would be risk of failing a medical, and to boot being unemployable. I would have thought summer holidays during study for another degree would offer more than ample time to get to CPL, at least, and then the opportunity to embark on a flying career with some peace of mind. At the risk of sounding patronising and decidedly un-fun, I wouldn't recommend anyone launch into an aviation career without a contingency plan (or lots and lots of money).

[eocvictim]

Walesregent is 100% correct. That is by far the best option. If you could go either way with what you want to do, study both concurrently.

If at the end of your degree you choose to fly, so be it. At least you have another useful non aviation related qualification that wont be affected by the standard peaks and troughs this fickle industry throws forth. If you choose to follow your formal qualification then aviation will still be waiting and by moonlighting on weekends or holidays you can still keep the hours and contacts rolling in. At least in this option you'll be well poised if, in your later years, you do choose to jump ship into aviation.

I said it in another thread but this is the only path I would ever recommend a student who considering a career in aviation.

[Exaviator]

Gentlemen, I think that you are both missing the point here. If you can identify early in life just what you want to do professionally, the sooner you get on with it the better. Particularly when it comes to an airline career in aviation.

From student pilot to an airline command takes a lot longer than becoming an M.D. Assuming that you were able to obtain a cadet program with Qantas or other major airline you would be looking at a minimum of 12-15 years to command. To achieve the same by the G.A. route would take even longer.

As I mentioned in my last post it is a long road to success in this field, so you need to be self motivated, to have a burning desire to fly, and make the sacrifices to achieve your goal and truly become a professional aviator.

What is missing in both of your posts is passion and motivation, you are looking at it only from a security point of view. Do you wear both belt and braces to keep your pants up - psychologically I think so.

I would agree with you if ones interest in flying is purely recreational, or even flogging around the circuit as a part time instructor, by all means chose another endeavor in life. BUT, if your dream as a young man is to fly around the world, in command of a heavy jet aircraft, then the sooner you make that choice and obtain those skills and qualifications the better.

We don't carry parachutes on modern jets and you shouldn't approach life carrying one either. :ok:

[eocvictim]

And just how much did you lose in the GFC? With that mentality I'm assuming you had all your eggs in one basket there too?

Anyone who approaches life without some backup is crazy. If you went to uni and did your CPL you would still have a jet command within 15 years. There are plenty of guys out there who've done it.

The youngest CPL out there can't be any younger than 18. Realistically most CPL's wont be qualified until they're almost 20. If you finish your uni course and a CPL you will be 21/22. Since when is 2 years a long time when you walk away with 2 qualifications?!

As you can see unless you're lucky enough to start before you're 18 you're certainly not disadvantaging yourself by doing a degree concurrently.

[Jack Ranga]

It's a different world out there now exaviator. I'll bet there wasn't a lot of queue jumping in your day? Any ICUS schemes? Did a cadetship cost you around $180,000:00 in todays money back then?

Aviation was highly regulated, fare prices were protected guaranteeing a certain cash flow to the airline. For all their faults gen y don't get jobs for life these days, they are told at school to expect 3 to 4 career changes (not job changes, actual career changes) in their life.

A pilots licence doesn't qualify you for much other than flying a plane. An accountancy degree will get you a job across a range of industries. Being single minded about your aviation career wont necessarily get you an airline gig after 15 years hard slog when you are competing against a 22 year old forking out 180 g for a cadetship.

[Capt Fathom]

WTF!

The kid was asking about a career in aviation!

Where does medicine and accounting come fit into it?

[eocvictim]

He mentions it as an alternative on the first page.

[Jack Ranga]

FATHOM..........RTFQ :ugh:

[Exaviator]

So let me get this right, you train to be a doctor just in case your real ambition in life to become an airline pilot is not achieved!

O.K. So let’s look at a hypothetical young man and his path to becoming a doctor first:

At 18 you graduate from high school then commence 2 years of pre-med during which time you study and pass:

2 year of freshman chemistry with laboratory courses.
1 year of organic chemistry with laboratory courses.
1 year of biology with laboratory courses.
1 year of physics with laboratory courses.
]
1 year of English.
1 year of calculus

Then you take the Medical School Admissions Test (MCAT) AND Biomedical Admissions Test(BMAT) Which involves testing in Verbal Reasoning, Physical Sciences, Biological Sciences and Writing Skills?

Assuming that you pass all of the above and are accepted, you commence medical school. Four Years of study and hard work later – no time for flying on the weekends or summer break because (A) You are busy studying medicine and (B) You can’t afford it, as you are already in debt for your medical school fees etc - you graduate with a degree in medicine.

BUT, just like a Commercial Pilots Licence is just the beginning to becoming an airline pilot, a degree in medicine is the same to becoming a qualified doctor. Now comes two – three years of hospital internship before being allowed to practice. However you do receive a salary during your internship, about $45,000 per year, about the same as a newly minted commercial pilot flying light aircraft.

Our young man is now around 27 years of age in a profession that he really doesn’t want to be. He probably has a massive student loan to pay off and as yet he hasn’t even commenced his pilot training and probably doesn’t have the funds to do so. In addition he has put all that time and effort into something he really didn’t want to do because if he did, he would stay a doctor, which would be the best decision and satisfy his urge to fly at a later date and at a recreational level.

Assuming a change of career at this point, and a generous parent or benefactor it would take at least 3 - 4 years to achieve a Commercial Pilots Licence with Multi Engine and I/R, and enough hours to attract interest from an airline, and to achieve a command, another 12 – 15 years as a co-pilot.

Having previously been in a flight management position and involved in the hiring of pilots, once the technical skills and experience level are satisfied, it is motivation that has impressed me the most.

And just how much did you lose in the GFC? With that mentality I'm assuming you had all your eggs in one basket there too?
Not that it has bearing on the subject, but no EOCVICTIM you assume wrongly.

[Jack Ranga]

exaviator,

You make good points :ok: Just so long as the fella has both sides of the story he/she then can make an informed decision.

It's the bullsh!t and lies that are told to young blokes that get me aggravated.

[Jose Cuervo]

Australian companies that have NO minimum schooling requirement:
Jetstar Minimum Criteria
Virgin Blue Recruitment: Attention
Cobham Airline Services
Skywest minimum criteria

Actually, Skywest Airlines, based in WA have the highest criteria of all Australian airlines...

Skywest Airlines (http://www.skywest.com.au/home.asp?documentid=239)

Flight Crew Employment Information


There are no current vacancies.

General Pilot Employment

The minimum requirement level for Pilot (Flight Crew) employment is as follows:-
1,500 hours total experience
200 hours multi (command)
ATPL subjects passed
Command Instrument Rating with minimum of two renewals
100 night hours
Year 12 passes in 4 subjects, including Maths, English and Physics
Must be an Australian Citizen or Resident with a three year validity

[Sbaker]

Like most of you, I have not had the silver spoon treatment - my advice:

Why would you go to UNI for 5 years and rack huge debt when... You can get in the mines like me, and in that 5 years you can pay cash for a house.

Just save your money and don't go buying a new HSV every year like the other drongos up there and you'll do fine..

Oh, and you wont care about earning $40k a year in your first flying jobs, because you dont have any other debts, and you will have a house and a flashy (insert dream car here) already.


I know the choice I made..

Good luck.

[TriMedGroup]

Sbaker - spot on except for the starting salary bit.

However you do receive a salary during your internship, about $45,000 per year, about the same as a newly minted commercial pilot flying light aircraft.

and you wont care about earning $40k a year in your first flying jobs,

Try $34,525 for UTBNI 1360Kg or $35,992 for a bigger single - and thats is assuming you are full time and actually get the award.


My CPL / NVFR / MECIR cost me around $58,000 and took 3 years while I worked full time in a ****, un-skilled job in the city. I still had to borrow 20K from the banks to get it finished sometime this century. I wish i had just sucked it up and gone to the mines for a couple of years and come out with a bag of cash ready to get licenced up. A mate that I met during my instrument rating did this, after the mines he went and lived on the goldy and did his flying, got himself a 210 job and 18 months later he has just started on a metro in Darwin (well done John!)

Say you start your first job on a C182, the tax calculator on the ATO website says that the award is $584 a week net. If you want to borrow the $45,000 from the bank over the max 7 years then expect repayments of $220 per week. You then have to go live in a ****hole or expensive tourist town on $360 odd per week. You're still driving around in the '83 corolla that your parents gave you for your 18th too. Still have to come up with $15,000 for the MECIR when the time comes as well.

Not saying that you cant live reasonably well on $360 per week but I know I would rather have the full $584 plus no debts (be it HECS or bank loans), a nice reliable car and no fear of having to move back to mums and work in the supermarket if it all turns to ****.

Go to the mines, save some money and start your career in a good financial state. Why on earth would you try and study for a degree in something that doesn't interest you when you want to fly aeroplanes?? Imagine sitting in a lecture room with 30 geeks listening to an old professor bloke crap on about the periodic table or tax law, and hearing a 172 buzz overhead and thinking that in 6 years time you'll be able to do that. Then finally, when you're out there looking for your first job the person in the 172 back then will be 6 years ahead of you.

If you're thinking that its a slow work day for me, then yes you would be correct!!

[frigatebird]

Exav

We don't carry parachutes on modern jets and you shouldn't approach life carrying one either. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

a favourite of mine is, 'after you have done all you can to prepare for the change, when you step off the cliff - you just have to have faith there will be a soft landing at the bottom'. What would a psychologist make of that..?
I'd rather be flying.

[Jack Ranga]

It may pay to remember that you don't pay fee-help back until you earn $45,000:00. Go off and do your CPL, get your first flying job secure in the knowledge you wont be paying your uni degree back until you've got at least 10 years flying under your belt.

[Anthill]

Do the flying first, then the Degree on line or by distance education. It will give you some thing productive to do on overnights and keep you out of the bars...