The SEED TROPHY

[liedtoagain]

All, I am trying to trace information on/location of the SEED TROPHY. Originally donated by Mr Clifford Seed in 1979 to 11 Gp the trophy was fought for by sqns associated with air to air gunnery. Notable winners such as 43(F), 111 and 5 Sqn. Locations known to have been presented at include Bentley Priory, Conningsby, Leuchars and Binbrook. Last known was a dinner in 1985 when 5 sqn were awarded the trophy.

Did you win the trophy? Do you know where it is? Is it still fought for?

The grandson of Mr Clifford Seed is interested to know the more recent history of the trophy.

All help appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[BlackadderIA]

Any idea of what it looks like?
I'll have a poke around the cabinets at 5 Squadron on Monday for you, but if it's something very distinctive I may be able to tell you now.

If you hang on until the end of Herrick you'll probably be able to pick it up on ebay along with 5 second-hand biz jets ;)

[FInotQFI]

Liedtoagain

If you have any more details, let us know. Photograph most useful; will then get RAF Heritage onto it on monday.:ok:

[The B Word]

IIRC the Seed Trophy was given to the best Squadron in 11Gp for Air to Air Gunnery.

I seem to remember it being presented followed by a big p!ss up in the Mess.:ok:

[grobbling about]

I was JEngO on 43(F) Sqn when it was awarded the trophy in 1985. Mr Seed presided over a parade in our hangar at Leuchars but the trophy was not present. He wore a dark (maybe black) suit and a bowler hat and reminded me of Mr Grace from 'Are You being Served'. Follwing a short congratulatory statement along the lines "You've all done very very well", his driver opened the boot of his Rolls Royce to reveal the world's supply of pork pies.

The officers retired to the Officers Mess for lunch to find the trophey assembled on the top table. I have told this story a number of times and have been looking for a photo of the trophey as it is an immense monstrosity! Well things were bigger in those days, take waggon wheels for instance!! Rumour had it that as Amy Johnson flew from the UK to Australia, she bought silver pieces from wherever she stopped. These were later assembled to make a trophey which centered on, if I recall correctly, a silver bowel which formed the base of a tower surrounded by sphinxes and other silver items. From the tower silver biplanes were suspended. Rumour also had it that Mr Seed bought it believing it to be the Schneider Trophey and when he opened the box there was an "OMG how do I get rid of this?" moment.

[Wholigan]

Posted on behalf of liedtoagain

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/Wholigan/SeedTrophy.jpg?t=1290258479

Mr Clifford Seed - original donator - with trophy.

[Pontius Navigator]

a trophey which centered on, if I recall correctly, a silver bowel which formed the base of a tower surrounded by sphinxes and other silver items. From the tower silver biplanes were suspended.

Indeed such a trophy would be an immense monstrosity if its base was a bowel.

[Lima Juliet]

I remember winning the Seed Trophy on V Sqn in the late 90s (97? 98?)

Memory is a bit of a blur due to the vast amount of alcohol consumed afterwards.

I'm guessing it went out of favour when 11/18Gp folded into 1Gp?

LJ

[Ali Qadoo]

Grobbling, you're right about the thing being a monstrosity. I was on 43 when we won it earlier (1983-ish IIRC) and heard the same story re Mr Seed believing he'd bought the Schneider Trophy - it looked more like a model fairground ride with all the silver biplanes hanging on chains from the central bowl (bowel does seem more apposite, I agree). The pies were nice though...

Still, it was a good excuse for a PU and proved beyond any doubt that if the Warsaw Pact's finest had turned up in UK airspace and flown round in 30-degree-banked circles at 180 kts, we'd have gunned their brains out (provided they turned left of course).

[grobbling about]

Spelling never was my strong point, that's why I became an inginier. Monsterous bowels aside, this did bring back some great memories of tatty ton, paint tins and chricket stumps and CL's (I think) impossible score

[Chris Kebab]

It's a truely remarkable looking thing; rather sad news if it's gone astray, bit harsh to call it a monstrosity though, must have taken a real effort to produce. I can't belive it's lost you most certainly wouldn't just walk past it without giving it a second take and a WTF is that! Not too surprised the Seed family are interested in what happened to it, you would hope it would be in safe RAF hands somewhere although I think it did suffer some battle damage in a couple of the post presentation celebrations:ok:

[BlackadderIA]

Good Lord! Subtle.
I can confirm that the Seed Trophy is certainly not on 5 Squadron - we have a few unusual artefacts lying around but nothing like that.

I assume it must be either with the RAF Museum or still with one of the extant Air Defence Squadrons. F3/Typhoon mates, over to you.

[Pontius Navigator]

I would not be surprised if it was at Air Command. Many of the Bomber trophies were in the hallway outside the dining room. One, the Laurence Minot, last won by 44 Sqn 'disappeared' although I had seen it outside the dining room. It had disappeared to the CinCs office.

These things have a habbit of disappearing in to Silver Rooms and seen only by the Silver Officer, usually a JO and wholly unaware of the history. "44? never heard of them," sort of thing :(

[davejb]

Good lord,
if he thoguht THAT was the Schneider trophy his eyesight must have been worse than mine!

[Pontius Navigator]

Good lord,
if he thoguht THAT was the Schneider trophy his eyesight must have been worse than mine!

Depends where he was standing in the auction.

You should see the £15 camphor wood chest I bought in the Forres auction - the smaller tables nest under the main table. I guess we will sell it at some point. I doubt it will make £15 though.

[Impiger]

I last drank champagne from the trophy (it is a punch bowl after all) when it had been presented to 29(F) circa 1996. Cracking lunch; presented by the AOC in the presence of Major Seed who was a member of the family. The lads congratulated the CO for introducing the AOC as guest of honour without actually mentioning his name - which of course just wasn't done in fighter circles at the time.

Gawd knows where it is now but surely 1 Gp should still present it every couple of years or so?

[caped crusader]

I remember an excellent Dining In Night at HQ 11 Gp Bentley Priory back in 1982 when the Guest of Honour was Mr Seed. Great character, the story of the pork pies from JEngo fits in with his speech. His intention was to provide beer & pies for the ground crew.

That evening he explained that the trophy had been owned by a good friend of his. He had always said to his friend that if he ever thought about getting rid of the trophy could he have first option to own it.

When his friend died the family offered it to him. He subsequently approached the RAF about donating a trophy and it was decided to accept it as an air to air gunnery trophy. I think the occassion for the dinner was to make up for the fact that the trophy had not been awarded that year.

[FInotQFI]

The Trophy is in the safe hands of an Officers' Mess. Liedtoagain, see PM.

[Vortex_Generator]

safe hands of an Officers' Mess
Surely an oxymoronic statement given the high jinx that often occurs in such establishments. :)

[Chris Kebab]

"......an Officers' Mess"

What is it a secret:confused::confused:

[liedtoagain]

All, we may have found the trophies location however please dig deep and keep the stories coming. I will be passing all on to the relatives.
Many thanks in advance. :D

[GBJOE]

I knew Uncle Clifford all of my life, indeed he gave me an eight man dinghy from a Lancaster during the war when I was a small child [no inflator]! He showed me the trophy at `The White House` Driglington before its presentation to the service and I spoke to him about it subsequently. First service suggestion was that it be awarded as an inter UAS trophy but when senior staff saw it they felt something more important should be its fate. Much of what has been written in correspondence is misleading. Clifford had first seen the trophy in the `30s. in Sheffield. I have not seen the trophy since before presentation at Scampton but a senior officer told me about ten years ago that it was insured for £28,000. Clifford was an incredibly shrewd businessman and many regretted trying to take advantage of his apparent naivity. He became almost a mythical figure in the West Riding and stories about him were legion. The biggest mystery is why he gave the trophy away. He certainly was not an aviation enthusiast. I have my theory -----------.

[Jackonicko]

With no air-to-air gunnery going on any more, perhaps it should become an inter-UAS trophy.

[ACW599]

>With no air-to-air gunnery going on any more, perhaps it should become an inter-UAS trophy.<

So that'll be an award to UWAS in perpetuity then :D

[BEagle]

>With no air-to-air gunnery going on any more, perhaps it should become an inter-UAS trophy.<

With no real UAS flying going on any more, perhaps it should become an inter-squadron Air Cadet trophy.

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