strangely familiar new chinese helicopter

[widgeon]

China's first domestic-made light civilian helicopter makes debut (http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/china/2010-11/08/c_13596485.htm)

Hm looks kinda like another helicopter , wish I could remember the name

[heli1]

ECAS 470....dummy!!

[eivissa]

Looks like what comes out when those two make love:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/98/Colibri_coruscans_2.jpg/300px-Colibri_coruscans_2.jpg
http://24.media.tumblr.com/FF57X0L1ko2v509wRHhRaNUYo1_400.jpg

[mfriskel]

Not surprising since the first attempt a few years ago was identical to an AS-350. Wasn't Eurocopter livid with that "1st civil helicopter designed and built in China" back then?

[alouette]

How could you imply that EADS had anything to do with this?:E All lies. This is a genuine design which leaves no questions unanswered. The chopper is a 灰鼠 or simply a "song shu":}

[ShyTorque]

It's nothing like a Eurocopter.

It's a Eulocropter.

[krypton_john]

I wonder about pricing and internationally acceptable certification?

[edit]
Oh, I see elsewhere it is priced '10-15% cheaper'.

Doesn't sound like much of a discount. I think they'd need some other compelling reasons to make a sale against EC.

Still, anything new is a bonus.

[helispeediii]

hope the welding is better than my chinese monkey bike who eng/trans are they using anyone know helispeed iii

[Non-PC Plod]

Eivissa- Would that be an outstanding load of brightly-coloured Bo***cks?

:ok:

[topendtorque]

but wait - there's more


The aircraft was equipped with a fuel-efficient engine,


I laugh

[Agaricus bisporus]

Well, don't stop there. It has "highly integrated avionics" too.
Does that mean the radios are actually fitted into the panel, not wired up and just left lying on the floor like in every other helicopter?

Or perhaps they mean that the avionics are integtated amongst themselves, so all the pax can hear eachother on the intercom, and maybe navaid idents can even be switched in too! Maybe that's it!

Gosh!

[krypton_john]

It could mean that you can set the radio frequencies from the database on the EFIS etc.

[heliduck]

I wonder if it comes standard with external handholds for the people riding on the outside when all the seats are full?!?!

[grumpytroll]

Okay, lets all try to draw a helicopter that doesn't look like any other helicopter in any way. Oh, it actually has to look like something that passes W and B muster and is functional. You know, the main rotor can't be mounted on the tail and the tail rotor in the middle somewhere. Engine...? Enhaust...? Cockpit behind the passenger seats? My point is its a pretty basic and strict design. Theres not a great amount of leeway when designing a helo for any given weight category. I don't have the extraordinary skill to design a completely new looking helicopter that doesn't look like any other but am looking forward to all the new ideas.;) Cheers

[skadi]

AVIC produces the airframes of the EC175, so they work together with Eurocopter. So no surprise, that this machine looks like a member of the EC family?

skadi

[Hell Man]

Credit where its due!

I struggle to think of a single country which has an emerging or even developed helicopter manufacturing industry and who are not working with Eurocopter!

As much as I would love to have seen one or more of our home grown companies take this initiative - they never did and I believe it is to our loss.

Eurocopters penetration of the global market over the past 20 years is by any measure - impressive.

This latest project, like so many others, bears all the EC hallmarks and which is hardly surprising but ... keep up the humor, its fun to read! :ok:

HM

[widgeon]

Shape is one thing ( It is hard to tell at BMW from a Ford now ) , the Starflex rotor head is certainly something that they would not have produced without a lot of tech info from EC. Remember AW owe their starts to US manufacturers and they are now showing their parents a thing or two. I have seen the standard of some chinese aircraft parts and early examples were dire but they learn fast and are prepared to use all resources to achieve success.

[RotaryWingB2]

Is the power train local or imported?

Engine? P&W or Turbomeca? Or a 'copy'.

[Gemini Twin]

Engine - Honeywell LTS101-700D-2. Drive train including MR and TR - all AS350B2.

[Svenestron]

widgeon said:
Remember AW owe their starts to US manufacturers and they are now showing their parents a thing or two.Hold on.. both Augusta AND Westland were started with the help of US manufacturers..?
I seriously need help with history, because I did not know that..

(this is a serious post..)

[Ian Corrigible]

Looks like what comes out when those two make love
It's pretty impressive that, while Sikorsky is only toying with a battery powered S-300 and Eurocopter/EADS are only in the design stage of their diesel-electric concept, China now has a genuine hybrid helicopter! :E

Not surprising since the first attempt a few years ago was identical to an AS-350. Wasn't Eurocopter livid with that "1st civil helicopter designed and built in China" back then?
The AVIC (Changhe) Z-11 (http://www.changhe.com/english/ecpxx/ecpxx02.htm) which, unlike the Z-8 (SA321) and Z-9 (AS365), was not an official license production deal. Folklore has it that, shortly before the Z-11 appeared in the early 1990s, an AS350 'disappeared' in China, only to reappear several months later with obvious signs of having been dismantled and reassembled...

I have seen the standard of some chinese aircraft parts and early examples were dire but they learn fast and are prepared to use all resources to achieve success.
Given China's experience with reverse engineering, I'm surprised that we haven't already seen a locally built 430 appear yet. China's JV relationships have involved the AW109, Bell 430, S-76, MD500, S-300/333, EN480 and FH1100, so it wouldn't be a surprise to see 'inspiration' drawn from any of these models appear on future AVIC rotorcraft.

AVIC produces the airframes of the EC175, so they work together with Eurocopter. So no surprise, that this machine looks like a member of the EC family?
AVIC (CATIC/Harbin) is also a 24% partner in the EC120 (produced locally as the HC120), which explains where the AC311's facelift came from.

Is the power train local or imported?
Additional background to Gemini Twin's info: Honeywell LTS101 selected to power Changhe Z-11 (http://www51.honeywell.com/honeywell/news-events/press-releases-details/02.22.09ChangheZ-11.html). Given that the Z-11 is, allegedly. somewhat heavier than the AS350, it'll be interesting to see whether the HTS900 eventually makes its way onto the AC311.

Hold on.. both Augusta AND Westland were started with the help of US manufacturers..? I seriously need help with history, because I did not know that..

Giovanni's first successful project was license production of the Bell 47, and Agusta's subsequent production of the AB206 heavily influenced the A109's cabin design.

I/C

[widgeon]

Svensestron , Westland had a long history in fixed wing but a large part of their early history in rotary wing was licence build of Sikorsky products
from Wikipedia "Post-war the company decided to get out of fixed-wing aircraft and concentrate solely on helicopters under a licensing agreement with Sikorsky. This upset W.E.W. Petter, the chief designer, who left to form a new aircraft division at English Electric that would go on to be very successful.[1]

Production started with the Sikorsky S-51, which became the Dragonfly, flying for the first time in 1948, and entering service with the Royal Navy and RAF in 1953. Westland developed an improved version the Widgeon which was not a great success. Success with the Dragonfly was repeated with the Sikorsky S-55 which became the Whirlwind, and a re-engined Sikorsky S-58 in both turboshaft and turbine engine powered designs as the Wessex."

In fact it was not until the WG13 Lynx that westland had an original design , The scout/wasp was a Saunders Roe design and others originated in Fairey and Bristol.

[Gemini Twin]

Since Bell stopped the 417 and ARH programs, Honeywell is desparate to find an OEM for the HTS900 but I hope not desparate enough to sell it to China, at least not until someone puts it in the AS350B3!

[widgeon]

I thought that a Canadian company was certifying a retrofit kit for the 407.

Honeywell Announces HTS900 Engine Upgrade For Bell 407 Operators (http://www51.honeywell.com/honeywell/news-events/press-releases-details/02.21.10HTS900UpgradeforB407.html)

Sorry for the drift.

[Ian Corrigible]

Aviation Week (http://zinio.com/reader.jsp?issue=416145735&o=ext) now reporting that Honeywell is offering the HTS900 for the H425 (http://www.google.com/url?q=http://www.chinahelicopter.com.cn/indexPortal/home/index.do%3Fcmd%3DgoToChannel%26cid%3D1189%26language%3DUS&sa=U&ei=g2DlTP-2DMi8nAfa1NDfDQ&ved=0CAcQFjAA&usg=AFQjCNG5yJfJnWkWZGf8ly5vBI0Em0rTLw), the latest version of the Z-9 (AS365).

"We're in active dialog on that," Honeywell Asia-Pacific president Mark Howes told Show News.

I/C

[ReverseFlight]

The AC311 is currently exhibited at the Zhuhai Air Show in China if anyone would like to see it for real.