Aircraft ground Signals Startuo & taxi Out

[nomorecatering]

The Military seems to have a very elaborate set of ground signals for engine start and during the start cycle.

Can anyone explain what they actually mean.

YouTube - F/A 18 Super Hornet & two F-18 Hornets leave South Tahoe Airport (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8k0u-TMf_Q)

[david parry]

Complete load of American B******T, for starting Starboard then Port engine , and away chocks ;) FAA do it better YouTube - HMS Eagle - Flight Deck Operations 1- 1966 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOKKah5mTTE)

[sitigeltfel]

Judging by the windsock the F/A-18 started with a fairly brisk tailwind. Are there any limits on that?

[BEagle]

When we operated the F-4, the groundcrew had to give a wide range of signals to show the start door secure, flap, hook, speedbrake, flight control and aileron-rudder interconnect checks were OK. One young black lad at Suffolk's finest fighter base added his own style (and smile) to the checks and used to deliver a very polished and professional service.

But we didn't need those oo-rah salutes or other bull$hit the spams love so much after waving the chocks away.....

[Roadster280]

On the Eagle footage, the wire strop holding the aircraft to the catapult falls away into the drink on launch. Were they disposable, or did they have floats and get recovered? Given the tension they'd be subjected to, they must have been manufactured to a fairly high specification. With an air group of even say 20 aircraft, that must have meant carrying hundreds of these things on every trip, and possibly going back with none. Or possibly manufactured on board?

I can just see it now...

"EAGLE to proceed with all haste to XYZ for possible offensive ops."

"Sorry Sir, we're out of launch strops..."

[coldbuffer]

Not forgetting the Lightning See-off dance preformed at the Thursday night bop in the Naafi at Leuchars :O

[Lukeafb1]

I remember back in the 60s when I was on a Canberra squadron, I developed my own brand of signals to the pilot, loosely based on U.S. Air Force practice, but with a few swirls of my own.

All went well for a while, until a snotty pilot voiced his disapproval. Hats off meeting with the Boss.

Reverted to the instructions in the AP after that. It was never again so much fun!! :=:=

[sitigeltfel]

On the Eagle footage, the wire strop holding the aircraft to the catapult falls away into the drink on launch. Were they disposable,Phantom F4K, Fleet Air Arm. Royal Navy. - Aircraft Carrier > HMS Ark Royal (http://www.phantomf4k.org/index.cfm?fa=contentGeneric.zqbszvocckjmvqfs)

[Ali Qadoo]

It's when you start up and the lineys all run away from the aircraft that you need to start worrying...

[Saintsman]

Of course you need big hands to do this...

http://www.langleyflyingschool.com/Images/Flight%20Operations/Marshalling%20Signals,%20Langley%20Flying%20School.gif

[bingofuel]

On the Eagle footage, the wire strop holding the aircraft to the catapult falls away into the drink on launch.

It certainly made a splash in that video, maybe a following 'fishing trawler' picks it up.

[david parry]

They are indeed Bridle Catchers and the Ark had two fitted, one to the bow catapault and one to the portside catapault. They were fitted during the 1967-1970 refit. The reason being the cost of the bridles lost over the side during launch of aircraft prior to the bridle catchers being fitted. After being fitted the bridles could be used again. After launch the steam catapault was pulled back to the loading point and it would bring the bridle back with it. The stop catcher was, done away with after the 72 Commission on the ARK having not being successful !! iirc, and no other carriers had them, fitted after that, i know of. However Victorious had one fitted to the port Cat for the 60/61 commission, after that it was discarded on her . The hangar, and other stowages, were always full of strops. Never ran out of them, on a 12 month Far East commission, on any carrier.

[BOAC]

There is a vid somewhere of an 'exotic' dance by USAF groundcrew - Herc or C-17?.

Roadster - when they run of strops out they use Wren's elasticated undergarments. I believe it is '6 weeks at sea' or similar:)

Y'all better be braced for a start-up sequence for the Thunderbirds - :yuk:

[NutLoose]

But we didn't need those oo-rah salutes

Oh you used to get them, you just didn't see them :E:p

[BeefyBoy]

16 Sqn Bucc's at Laarbruch start up and see off consisted of 2 circular movements of the index fingers, moving your thumb up and down, waving your arms around at the right time and lots of telepathy! :ok:

[PAPI-74]

I hope the baby in the first vid had a nice pair of peltor ear defenders - I doubt it.
Great parenting lads!!!:ugh:

[ZH875]

16 Sqn Bucc's at Laarbruch start up and see off consisted of 2 circular movements of the index fingers, moving your thumb up and down, waving your arms around at the right time and lots of telepathy! :ok:


And the gentle use of a broom handle inserted in the engine bay.:ok:

[BeefyBoy]

Broom handle = stuck anti icing valve, if in doubt give it a clout! :E

Such memories!

[EdSett100]

Broom handle = stuck anti icing valve, if in doubt give it a clout!

The engine a/ice valves were fitted on the top of the engine, so I doubt that the (straight) broom handle would reach them from the door below the engine.

I seem to remember (from the late 70's on 12 and 216 Sqn ) that we used the broom handle to encourage the CSD (generator drive) cooling air valve to open if we didn't feel the cooling air on our hand when checking for it after engine start.

Ed

[ZH875]

The engine a/ice valves were fitted on the top of the engine, so I doubt that the (straight) broom handle would reach them from the door below the engine.

I seem to remember (from the late 70's on 12 and 216 Sqn ) that we used the broom handle to encourage the CSD (generator drive) cooling air valve to open if we didn't feel the cooling air on our hand when checking for it after engine start.

Ed

Yep, that's the one.

[BeefyBoy]

My error - the shame of it! :ugh: Will have to sit in the loft and read my old Spey 101 course notes.

Ha - only kidding they all got dumped when I left the mob and the mighty banana bomber had gone through the scrap yard. :}

BB

[Ogre]

On Jags we used to have to go through the full gamit of flight control movements, following the pilot as he moved the tail up, tail down, rudder left, etc. Pilots in a hurry used to race the liney, who looked like he was either trying to take off himself or he was having a fit.

8 Sqn Shackletons had a set of massive dayglo orange foam hands which they used once on detachment when one of the pilots complained he couldn't see the marshallers (allegedly).

Once we got one of the hangers-on who wanted to learn to marshall, so we primed the aircrew that he was going to be doing the see-in. The aircraft duly arrived at the end of the pan (a long way away) and the U/T liney started marshalling the pilot towards him. As it was a long distance to travel, his arms started getting tired and his left and right arms were not necessarily raised in sync. The pilot, being an evil sod, started slaloming the aircraft ever so slightly in time with the arm movements until the U/T marshaller was relieved of his duties......

[sitigeltfel]

There is a vid somewhere of an 'exotic' dance by USAF groundcrew - Herc or C-17?.
There are a fair number of videos, this is IMHO the best.....

How To Marshall A Jet - Video (http://www.metacafe.com/watch/1016755/how_to_marshall_a_jet/)

[cornish-stormrider]

Yep - Liney got style and liney got moves.

Ok liney fess up - who are you??

[Wensleydale]

8 Sqn Shackletons had a set of massive dayglo orange foam hands which they used once on detachment when one of the pilots complained he couldn't see the marshallers (allegedly).



This could add even more authenticity to a "Shackleton Start". Haven't seen one in the bar for some time now!

[St Barbaras Son]

This is always an option.

YouTube - How to marshall a Jet full version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leacw8H8Lrk)

[jamier]

It's when you start up and the lineys all run away from the aircraft that you need to start worrying...

Im a liney and once heard the crew say its running away at which point i dumped the headset and started running, quickly followed by the new guy who was watching a seeoff and the line walker!

When the aircrew are in a rush and then try to rush you the best thing to do to get them back into line is go through the range of movements again :ok:

[RetiredSHRigger]

Eons ago, well 1979 ish at the home of the then Jaguar strike wing was employed as a young SAC rigger on station flight looking after visitors, plus "Ample Gain" OTRs on all NATO partner strike a/c, Vividly remember the 9 finger checks on the F104G starfighter including the turning on of the fuel booster pumps after engine start from the panel just in front of the Stbd air intake, the Belgique Mirage Pilots just doing there own thing taxiing whilst still under the a/c checking BLC etc! Also never forgetting Norge F5 crews flying home with Televisions and assorted electrical equipment on there laps! how they would ever eject god only knows?but perhaps that could be another thread.

:ok:

[Q-RTF-X]

with Televisions and assorted electrical equipment on there laps! how they would ever eject god only knows ?

Maybe the "other halves" were such that returning home without the goods would have been a fate worse than death anyhow !!! :E

[AARON O'DICKYDIDO]

;)

It's great to see there is still a sense of humour on the line. How I miss the laughs! - Even after being out for 22 years.