EK A330 Pilots

[KAC104]

Hi Guys,
Sometime last year the 2 pilots flying the KWI-DXB leg (can't remember the date) took a pic in the flight deck with a teddy bear for charity.

I bought the picture at the event (yes the proceeds all go to charity for the pictures taken on this project) if you guys want it or a copy of it. PM me pls.

Thanks

[Mr Good Cat]

NB: Please don't put names on here if you can help it, just in case it gets the guys in trouble (however unlikely).

Maybe the photo was taken in flight and may be used as evidence of negligence of duty etc.

Just in case :ok:

[harry the cod]

O for Christ sake man, stop being so bloody paraniod :ugh:

For all the Companies faults, they really have got better things to do than chase after crap like that! If they ever did, it really would mean the end of the tenuous trust that is slowly being built up again after the Manchester debacle.

Harry

[sheikmyarse]

Fired on the spot!!

[M-rat]

Since a camera would most certainly be classified as Personal Electronic Device, (PED), and use of said item on the flight deck is prohibited... I wouldn't touch this with Harry's 10 foot pole.

And nothing has changed regarding trust in this company...

[harry the cod]

What do you mean 'you've heard nothing'? What do you think the Company should do? Post a letter on the portal to say that we can trust them again?

Sure it's going to take time to build up any trust again but when professional grown men start worrying over having a camera on the flight deck......... get a life.

I've never known such a bunch of pussies. If you really are all that scared, perhaps you shouldn't be doing the job. The same mindset that continues on to LOS without radar, the same idiots who departed with only two HYD systems, the same amateurs that spent 3 minutes discussing a HYD leak with MCC instead of actioning a checklist..................for f**ks sake, grow some balls and use them.

God forbid I end up as a pax on one of your flights and you have to make a decision for which there isn't a checklist.

Harry

[EK_Bus Driver]

Buy that man a pint, in fact make it SEVERAL!

[White Knight]

Well said Harry:ok::ok::ok: I agree - it's time for some to grow a set of whatsits...

And departing with just 2 hydraulic systems? When was that?:eek:

[KAC104]

Didn't expect that much to happen in light of this.

For those intrested the pic was taken on the ground, at the gate to be precise. Oh and engines were off:rolleyes:

[harry the cod]

Oakape

I'm certainly not going to get into a slanging match with you but I need to respond to your accusation of being childish.

Whilst I admit to emotion in my statement, my answer to your question was 'tongue in cheek'. It was meant to convey the absurdity of your original comment. That's why I used the comment about trust taking time.

You only have to look at the growing number of 'gear/flap warnings' or 'gear steering' ASR's that we are exposed to to realise that guys are clueless. Not only are these reports actually ACR's ( Arse Covering Reports), they also offer no safety value whatsoever. Now, if they told us why they got these warnings, ie what sequence of events occured before the event to cause the warning, such as fatigue, distraction, workload etc, then we might actually learn something!

This, to be honest, is less about trust with the Company and more to do with the complete lack of confidence many of our colleagues have in their own ability. It also demonstrates an inability to apply common sense to OMA guidelines. That's what worries me.

Harry

Apologies to the original poster for thread creep, but it wasn't me who started it. ( Now that's being childish!) ;)

[White Knight]

For those intrested the pic was taken on the ground, at the gate to be precise. Oh and engines were off

And........... As HArry says; some serious arse covering going on for no reason! I take plenty in flight, engines on and post them on the 'net... And???

[KAC104]

Ofcourse there will be serious "arse covering" as you say. Those not confident with their position are too afraid to even sneeze in the wrong direction fearing to be fired. This conclusion is derived from all the posts I've read around here in the past about EK management treatment.

Oh, and my comment about the parked plane/engine off etc etc was a sarcastic remark. Hence the new sentence/line and "sarcastic rolling eyes" at the end.

----Edited some vocabulary errors

[M-rat]

harry: I've never known such a bunch of pussies.

Well, you are what you eat! :p

[White Knight]

Sorry KAC - missed the roll-eyes:ok:

[sheikmyarse]

This thread is a typical example of the paranoid environment that is EK.
Spying, reporting and a general distrust are the ingredients of the toxic mist you have to breath while working here. It may well poison you, your family and your entire life.

[harry the cod]

I was going to let this go but a bottle of vino says otherwise. (well, it is the weekend!) Look, let me make this simple for you.

1) You DID ask a question.
2) You THEN followed it up with a statement. So, please don't try to pull the wool over my eyes. Please allow me to make a few observations.

Firstly, if there havn't been any incidents to report, does this mean then that we've all been good boys and girls or, does it mean that despite a few recent 'events', the Company has decided to take a more measured response for once. Knowing what a disaster Manchester was, it realises that despite your final comment, to attract the calibre of people required to fulfil it's expansion plans, it really does need to start making an effort. Anyway, I guess good news will never travel as fast as bad, eh?

Secondly, please answer my original question that was posed to you. How should the Company 'tell' its pilots that they are not going to continue with punitive action and that trust is something they realise is lacking. My question still stands and you havn't answered it yet.

Finally, I have to disagree with most of your post anyway. I stand by what I said in my earlier post. I guess the positive responses indicate i'm not alone in my view. If people insist on filing these pointless ASR's to cover their arses, they really should be asking themselves whether this is the job for them, let alone the Company!

Harry

[BYMONEK]

Oakope

Whilst I agree that the Company needs to step up to the plate when it comes to demostrating trust, the only way we'll ever know they are capable is when the proverbial hits the fan. I also agree with you that it will take years to build up the trust factor. But, isn't that what Harry's already said?

You accuse Harry of being somewhat emotional but, in reality, your post is exactly that. Whilst your loyalty is admirable, in my view, I think it is somewhat misplaced. The pilots you defend actually frustrate the hell out of me too and it tires me having to read their rubbish ever week in between the useful ASR's. Whilst I can certainly understand people using a more cautious approach for certain things here, the same things we wouldn't have thought twice about back home, defending them for inane ASR's shows a naive loyalty in my view. You say it's because they're scared for their jobs. Really?!! Filing an ASR because 'they almost had a bird strike' or 'they were almost unstable' or 'they were 253kts passing 4900 in the descent'. That's not being **** scared, that's being **** underconfident and, dear I say it, rather unprofessional. Behaviour breeds behaviour and that's what worries me!

Furthermore, this is the ME. Their way or the highway and no union to help. But we knew that before we joined, right! If someone screws up and Uncle Timmy wants them fired, then Uncle Timmy will get his way. We will never change that ethos so not let's kid ourselves otherwise. So, why not go to work, wear the hat, enjoy the flight, have a laugh and be as professional as can be. Make decisions based around the OMA in conjunction with common sense and experience. Use VPNC but don't follow blindly. You have the final say because ultimately, it's you who has the responsibility. Isn't that what most of us did before we had our brains removed on joining anyway? If they want to fire you, you ain't going to be able to stop it but at least you'll have a valid argument to defend yourself. At least you'll be around to discuss it in court rather than, in those final seconds, regretted not having taken Harry's advise and grown some balls. What is that they're teaching on this years CRM....... resilience..... the guys you defend are obviously not familiar with the word.

I'm with Harry on this. My female cat has more balls than some of these clowns...............and she's a real pussy! :E

[Mr.Bloggs]

What took place at MAN?

The general tone of comments seems to indicate a culture of fear of management, rather than a healthy fear of screwing-up. The former breeds an unsafe culture, the latter a safer and more professional culture.

Knowing the environment in the UAE/ME arena, I believe the safety culture will deteriorate further as the locals are intent on not losing face and making money, neither of which are inherent in an airline safety culture.

I feel sorry for you folks at EK, EY, QR, SV and others.