SAR in a blue suit

[Hedgeporker]

Hello all,

I've joined the Royal Navy Reserve while I go back to college (and pay attention this time!) to get my UCAS points for officer entry. I must admit I'm rather torn between the idea of FJ and Rotary with an eye on doing SAR/Ambulance driving in the afterlife.

I know, I know, I'll have to let the aptitude test decide and I may get chopped after that, and I haven't even passed out of BRNC yet, I know . .

. . . but I'd just like to hear about SAR from those of you who have done it, what the squadrons are like, what the local areas are like, hopefully some good dits and all that sort of thing.

Also, any news from those in the know? I remember reading somewhere about the privatisation of SAR being binned because of SDSR. Are the Sea Kings going to be replaced any time soon?

Any input from the wider SAR community is also most welcome.

Thanks in advance.

[Epiphany]

You'd get more response if you posted this on the 'Military Aircrew' forum.

[Mike Rosewhich]

By the time you pop out of the training system, under current plans, I would suggest your chances of flying SAR are practically zero.

[Thomas coupling]

Hedgeporker.

A lot of 'asks':eek:

Some 'pointers' to wend you on your way, if I may:

Advice can be sought on pprune from the forementioned military threads, or the SAR-H thread here on rotorheads. Someone will PM you probably and give you the latest lowdown on RN SAR, however.

Firstly, this is the sort of choice you'll be getting after 20th October, on the future of aviation in the mil, when the SDSR starts rolling out:
RN: Harrier / typhoon / JSF???(F18??) / merlin / lynx (SAR being a secondary duty for both of these). SeaKing (771sqdn will be phased out by 2016).
RAF: Typhoon / JSF (F18) / chinook / puma.
Army: Apache / Lynx (Wildcat)

Your decision to go either FW or rotary SAR is both ends of the spectrum and suggests you're not sure what you want yet? The jobs are chalk and cheese.

Finally, the job itself (rotary SAR) is 80% boredom and 20% sheer pandemonium! By the time you come on line it will be unlikely that you will be able to filter into the SAR-H programme as it is only starting with 22 crews from the RN. You'll probably be drafted to Merlin where SAR is a secondary role.
The RAF prefer to treat it as a primary role currently. After SAR-H it will involve a major reduction in crew numbers rotating through civvy controlled SAR (on the S92). It is suggested that over a relatively short period, this total (RN and RAF) number will die out leaving the whole of UK SAR a civvy responsibility. I hasten to add - this is a point of conjecture :uhoh::uhoh:

Mil SAR is both professional and very rewarding - the UK probably have it sewn up w.r.t. their operational committment to the task.
However (and I add the following qualifier): IN MY OPINION: SAR isn't a military role - there is no enemy, there are no changes of theatre, secondments abroad, etc etc. It is an air ambulance in uniform :eek:
It is a role that logically belongs to a civilian organisation especially now that 97% of its demands are civilian driven.

IF you want to fly SAR/HEMS after your mil tour is over, contemplate a route towards SAR-H as early as possible, you won't go far wrong.

[Hedgeporker]

Duly reposted in the Military Aircrew section.

Thanks ever so for your informative reply Thomas. :ok:

It's not so much that I don't know what to do, it's just that I want to do both! To be perfectly honest I would rather not have to blow anyone up but I accept it as part of the quid pro quo if I sign up for warry-but-balls-out-fun platform. The attraction of SAR for me is that it appears to have the scramble factor without making widows. It may seem odd to some that someone who is joining the military has this kind of attitude but hey-ho, I don't think people can be viewed in primary colours.

I've heard of Rotary pilots being restreamed into FJ but not vice versa. Putting aside the extra years and career continuity issues, I'm kind of hedging my bets by aiming first for Rotary.

I can of course only conjecture as to what path my prospective flying career might take (if it does take off), what with way leading on to way and plans rarely surviving contact with reality etc.


Edit : I've always perceived SAR to be live training for CSAR.

[pasptoo]

Totally different dude. Not even close.

I would rather not have to blow anyone up but I accept it as part of the quid pro quo

I don't think ANYONE sees this as a joyous task, however it is kind of part of being in the military, you might have to go to war, you might have to go kill someone! Get used to the idea.

It is not a flying / gentleman's club where you'll get "free" training.
Sounds like you could be in the wrong place!

I'm rather torn between the idea of FJ and Rotary

Don't worry about this, your chance of success is about 1:6 or less at your stage, and then you'll be TOLD where you are going - if you make the grade!

Enjoy Uni and Goodluck

[Hedgeporker]

Thanks pasptoo.

I'm pretty sure I'm walking the right path, just thinking aloud that's all. I know it's not 'free', hence the quid pro quo. :ok:

Forgive me if this is a bone question but apart from the fact that no one is shooting at you, why is SAR so unlike CSAR?

[Non-PC Plod]

I'm not an expert, but when we played at this in the military, the following became apparent: CSAR is normally behind enemy lines (hence the "C" bit". Therefore, its normally unwise to enter into it unless you have the resources to pull it off in the enemy's back yard.
Therefore, you are most likely talking about a fairly massive combined operation, involving everything from satellites/drones, radar surveillance aircraft, fast jets, attack helicopters, artillery, down to the actual pick-up helicopter and his escort/backup.
Lots of planning, coordination ( inter-service, inter-arm and inter-national), SOPs, practice and training required.
Completely different kettle of fish from single-aircraft hops to operate in a benign (from the bullets point of view) environment of civilian SAR.
Thats why the UK military doesnt have a real unilateral CSAR capability. You need something like a US marines MEU brigade to have any chance of pulling it off.

[Thomas coupling]

Hedge: Wrong way round. Exceptionally rare if not impossible to go from qualified rotary pilot to FW. On the odd occasion you might bump into a FW jock who can't cope and crosses over to rotary!

I suspect you are a bit gung ho about all this. Look at it as a very professional, often exciting flying activity - the bullets/CSAR/blood and guts/medals is mainly reserved for the Army:eek::suspect:

Finally as pasptoo said: the odds of you getting in are against you. They will decide NOT you:ooh:

[Hedgeporker]

Hedge: Wrong way round. Exceptionally rare if not impossible to go from qualified rotary pilot to FW. On the odd occasion you might bump into a FW jock who can't cope and crosses over to rotary!
:eek: . . . Come what may, I suppose. :)

I suspect you are a bit gung ho about all this. Look at it as a very professional, often exciting flying activity - the bullets/CSAR/blood and guts/medals is mainly reserved for the Army

I would be quite happy to never be shot at or see or open gut in my life . . . just needed to get that silly (academical) question out of the way. :8

Finally as pasptoo said: the odds of you getting in are against you. They will decide NOT you

Acknowledged. I just find it a useful motivator to set myself a beacon to work towards. I can't help myself. :}


Thanks gents.

[Epiphany]

HP,

Before you get any where near a helicopter - or whatever you want to fly - you will have to convince many people that you have what it takes to do the job. That means a clear sense or purpose, an understanding of what to expect from military life and maturity beyond your years.

I have no idea of your age but you need to do a lot of work on all three before you could convince me.