Britain & France to share aircraft carriers

[green granite]

Sorry Claude you can't have it this week we're about to invade the Isle Of Man.

Britain and France are getting ready to unveil plans to share aircraft carriers amid pressure on the British military to cut costs, the Times reported on Tuesday. Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Nicholas Sarkozy were expected to announce the proposal at a November summit, the Times said, quoting an unidentified British naval source for its information.
The newspaper said the proposal would ensure that one of three ships -- one French and two British -- would always patrol the seas.

Full article: Britain, France to share aircraft carriers - paper* - Yahoo! News UK (http://uk.news.yahoo.com/22/20100830/tuk-uk-britain-france-defence-fa6b408.html)

[Ali Barber]

It'll stink of garlic when it's our turn to play with it.

[rogerk]

Am I missing the point here ??
The article says that their aircraft won't fit on our carriers and our aircraft won't fit on theirs !!
Bit of a "nobrainer" to me.
:confused::confused:

[Squirrel 41]

IF TRUE, this suggests that the one being definitely cancelled is the French PA2, and that QE and POW will go ahead as CTOBAR conventional carriers. Does anyone know when CdG is out of comission this decade?

Presumably this IF TRUE this could mean that FN Aeronavle airwing could embark on QE or POW for 18 months pending the procurement of Dave-C, including their E-2Cs.

IF SO then this feels like surprisingly good news.

S41

[LFFC]

Britain and France 'to share naval power' (http://www.politics.co.uk/news/foreign-policy/britain-and-france-to-share-naval-power--$21383360.htm)

Squirrel, I wouldn't get your hopes up!


The plans could result in the building programme for at least one the UK's two new aircraft carriers being scaled back, with serious implications for the shipbuilding industry, as the projects are already underway, costing £5.2 billion.
This scaling back would mean one of the UK carriers operating at a much reduced capacity, effectively as a troop transport or helicopter carrier, rather than the originally envisioned role of a platform for modern jets.

Incompatible?

Don’t blame coalition for UK-France aircraft carrier plan (http://blogs.ft.com/westminster/2010/08/dont-blame-coalition-for-uk-france-aircraft-carrier-plan/)

Others say there are big technical problems involved in such an arrangement, not the least of which is that French aircraft cannot fly on British carriers because their Rafale combat jets use catapults for take-off.

Well there's an easy solution to that isn't there!

[vfr into cloud]

Start of the United States of Europe military force me thinks?:=

We aint got the money or the equipment or the balls to go it alone anymore.

Lets face it guys, we just a bit player in the world these days and our piece of the pie just got alot smaller

where did i put my passport,.....time to leave:D

[BEagle]

Incompatible

HMS Incompatible - perfect name for one of the new carriers?

Isn't one of Incapability Brown's jobs-for-Jocks carriers already designed with conventional aircraft capability in mind?

[Buster Hyman]

And what happens when the French go all Vichy again? :confused:

[The Helpful Stacker]

And what happens when the French go all Vichy again?

Well they'll get sunk by one of the fleets despatched by the mighty Royal Navy, rulers of the waves dontchaknow.

Oh....:uhoh:

[dakkg651]

This could work you know.

Sharing with the frogs will make a change from them taking from us.

History records that the Royal Navy have donated literally tens of thousands of cannonballs and other sundry munitions to the French navy over the years. We have had nothing in return.

[larssnowpharter]

One seems to recall that HMS Victory is still on the rolls but not a NATO asset.

[occhips]

Think how good the wine list would be in the Mess or whatever they call it in the Navy.
:8

[larssnowpharter]

In that case let's share with the Italians or Orstralians. :E

[Trim Stab]

We'll end up with one carrier, an exact sister ship to an identical French carrier, both with Rafales embarked. In return, the FAF will take a few Typhoons. You read it here first and I will remind you when it comes true!

[Caspian237]

According to the article linked by the op,


The carrier sharing proposal would ensure one of three ships -- one French and two British -- would always patrol the seas, The Times said. It would also make it easier for Britain to scrap or downgrade one of the planned carriers


If the proposal is to share a carrier (presumably one of the CVF) then what sense does it make to downgrade one of them? All that would mean is that the French get a fully equipped ship when the Charles De Gaulle is in dock while the Royal Navy are left with an oversized Helicopter Carrier.

That makes no sense at all.

[pasir]

.... Its true then - The bods responsible for the Chinnook
procurement fiasco were not sacked !


...

[Squirrel 41]

TS

We'll end up with one carrier, an exact sister ship to an identical French carrier, both with Rafales embarked. In return, the FAF will take a few Typhoons. You read it here first and I will remind you when it comes true!

IMHO, rubbish.

There is no chance FAF will fly Typhoon; they don't need it and can't afford it - Rafale works perfectly well for them.

If two more carriers are to be built in western Europe, then it will be 2 x CVF; there is no chance that another CdG will be built - the French know how expensive it was, and realise that it is probably too small at 40,000t (ish).

If this proposal is real, it would have to see PoW completed with Cats'n'traps to operate the FN airwing from 2016, as I understood that QE was too advanced to easily switch to CATOBAR configuration. If so, QE could become the most oversized LPH until its first major refit, when it would take CATOBAR configuration and with it, the first Dave-Cs - in about 2019/20.

S41

[ajl146]

Looks like this is not going to happen. Interesting about the possible sharing of the A400M fleet though.

BBC News - Liam Fox rejects sharing aircraft carriers with France (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11176489)

[Thelma Viaduct]

This will be one them genius 'govern'ment ideas that will end up costing the taxpayer more £ in the long run.

A million & 1 ways to piss money up the wall. :ugh::ugh::ugh:

[philrigger]

;)

If this comes about, which I doubt, then what will RN sailors do when its not our turn ?




Philrigger

[Wensleydale]

A L' eau, C'est L' heure.;)

[glad rag]

FAF will take a few Typhoonspurely for evaluation purposes :hmm::hmm::hmm::hmm:

[Squirrel 41]

Despite Fox nixing the idea, it could've worked - under French command HMS X would have presumably had a French Flag Officer and French Flag staff, French Air Wing and RN crew, operating as a French TG. The French taxpayer would have then paid the operating costs and made a contribution to the capital and upkeep costs.

So not a Euroarmy. And not actually all that different to multinational TGs with Flag Staff embarked on other people's ships now.

Pity, a good idea under the circumstances.

S41

[NURSE]

French my well look closley at QE class to assess their suitability to enhance or replace their carrier force.