RUMOUR - NZ Loan-funded Training to be slashed... [Archive]

empacher48

17th Aug 2010, 21:06

Certainly the problem was when such funding became interest free while still working in NZ. I admit that I used the interest free training to get into the industry - even or though I had the money. It just made economic sense to put $50,000 into an investment account for five years earning 6%, borrow the $50,000 from the government interest free.

When I left the country I paid the balance of the money owed back and made close to $15,000 on the deal.

I know that I'll be in the minority having worked and saved hard in order to have the funds available for my flying training. But maybe going through your CPL etc will be once again a show one passion for flying, if one has to self fund the opportunity?

LocoDriver

18th Aug 2010, 00:38

There is a Govt policy paper floating around somewhere re this, I cant find my copy, but from memory, it was a capping, then a slight reduction of the number of loans available for this type of industry, but nothing like the number suggested above.

The Govt paper stated that the 'placement' of pilot graduates, was not very high compared to other industries. Funny that.

They were looking to get better 'value for dollars' from student loan funding, in general, and Aviation was one of the more expensive loans..........

Govt policy has reduced funding for night classes at high schools as well, so they are looking hard at expenditure, so they can fund tax cuts.

Anyway, for us aero club types, its business as usual.

Cheers
:ok:

waren9

18th Aug 2010, 03:39

Not a moment too soon.

NZ tax payers paying the interest on the student loans of 100's of poor schmucks who each year get told lies by the sausage factories only to end up paying it all back by flipping burgers, pumping gas or stocking shelves.

Those who really wanna do it find the money somehow. I did and so did plenty of others.

Hard for the sausage factories but it became an artificial industry bubble with so much student money splashing about for jobs that dont exist.

Wait till they bring in the 1500hr rule like the Yanks. That'll be another game changer.

Massey058

18th Aug 2010, 04:46

Perhaps you kiwis will actually have to pay for it like the fellas on the mainland traditionally did. No more kiwis rocking up with a fistful of student loan money to subsidise an entry level GA job? Sounds like a good thing to me!

Gee wish I'd been able to get a fistful of Student Loan money, wouldn't be taking it to Australia though that's for sure. Also there are plenty of Aussie's taking advantage of the NZ Student Loan scheme.

The Green Goblin

18th Aug 2010, 06:30

Quote:
Perhaps you kiwis will actually have to pay for it like the fellas on the mainland traditionally did. No more kiwis rocking up with a fistful of student loan money to subsidise an entry level GA job? Sounds like a good thing to me!
Gee wish I'd been able to get a fistful of Student Loan money, wouldn't be taking it to Australia though that's for sure. Also there are plenty of Aussie's taking advantage of the NZ Student Loan scheme.

Thats because you'll have your hand out for some centrelink money while kicking back on the gold coast in yer budgie smugglers n jandels whining how you can't get a job after sending every operator your resume via email :D

Only so long you can luv out of yer chili bun drunking ViBi eh bro?

lilflyboy262

18th Aug 2010, 07:12

Perhaps it should have been The Green Eyed Goblin?
You can't tell me you wouldn't have done it if you didn't have the opportunity. You would have been stupid not to have done so.
Get over yourself. You keep harping on about it all the time.
As said multiple times, there are tons of Aussies on our side of the ditch that are taking advantage of it too.
All rocking up with their "thongs" and "seex packs of XXXX"

Back on topic. They have been saying that the student loan thing was going to stop for a long time, even the ex government was saying the same thing.
Hence why I ended up leaving school a year early to do it. Stupid in retrospect but haven't had any issues with it so far!
Who knows? Maybe they may end up adjusting the funding, but slashing it to what was said will meet a hell of a lot of opposition the length of the country, not just from the students, but also from the organisations the length of the country.

Remember that GA is very limited in NZ with job outside of instructing quite scarce. Cut the funds, you cut the number of students, which in turn will cut the number of instructor jobs in NZ.
You'll end up with MORE kiwis going to Australia to look for work.

Then they will be crying that they can't get any work either now that there are even more bad bad kiwis with their government paid CPLs taking their jobs that they worked so hard to pay for.

The Green Goblin

18th Aug 2010, 08:20

Who knows? Maybe they may end up adjusting the funding, but slashing it to what was said will meet a hell of a lot of opposition the length of the country, not just from the students, but also from the organisations the length of the country.

Or maybe 'cause they're rolling all over each other to git into that jitstar caditship the student loan funding has become obsolete eh bro. :}

norwester33

18th Aug 2010, 08:48

I think slashing the funding is a great idea, no more lazy bludgers just signing up.
As said before aswell the less passionate ones will fade away.
More jobs available as a less saturated market too.
As too the Ozzie/Kiwi debate Mr Gobbler I think that the amount of posts you have done says alot about your opinion of yourself, when getting that mirror out of your pocket watch you dont cut yourself BRO........:ok:

The Green Goblin

18th Aug 2010, 09:35

As too the Ozzie/Kiwi debate Mr Gobbler I think that the amount of posts you have done says alot about your opinion of yourself, when getting that mirror out of your pocket watch you dont cut yourself BRO........

Nah bro, the mirror in my pocket is to place beside a Kiwi pie hole to look 'em in the eye when I speak to 'em :cool:

Tis all fun and games :E

Massey058

18th Aug 2010, 10:46

Only so long you can luv out of yer chili bun drunking ViBi eh bro?

Maybe for some but like the US I have very little desire to even visit Australia let alone live in the place.

j3pipercub

19th Aug 2010, 00:16

As someone said to me on this forum last year.

GG WELL DONE
Hook, Line, Sinker, The Bait Box and half the Jetty as Well!!!!!!!!

j3

ZK-NSN

19th Aug 2010, 02:16

Like J3 ha pointed out, dont let Greenie wind you up. He's just trying to fill in his time after some Veitnamese bloke took his job at jetstar.:}

The Green Goblin

19th Aug 2010, 02:53

As someone said to me on this forum last year.

GG WELL DONE
Hook, Line, Sinker, The Bait Box and half the Jetty as Well!!!!!!!!

j3

It's a bit of a turkey shoot sometimes with these fellas, far to easy to wind 'em up without a bit of rapid fire back.

Such a pity.....

HercFeend

19th Aug 2010, 03:46

@ Massey: How remarkably open minded of you.....! Good job you're not considering a career in a 'travel' orientated industry :confused:

Massey058

19th Aug 2010, 04:11

@ Massey: How remarkably open minded of you.....! Good job you're not considering a career in a 'travel' orientated industry

Sorry was going down GG's route of ridiculous statements. If a decent job comes up I'm quite willing to go anywhere. Hence at this stage I live in the jungle. Some truth in not wanting to go near the US though :).

bogdantheturnipboy

19th Aug 2010, 09:45

Green Goblin, Kiwis can't vote and they can't get centrelink money unless they become Australian citizens.

Whereas Australians can move to NZ, live there for 6 months, become permanent residents - vote and qualify for dole money and go to uni all funded by the govt ( well a loan which they are supposed to pay back).

j3pipercub

19th Aug 2010, 09:57

Whereas Australians can move to NZ, live there for 6 months, become permanent residents

Aussie's got that right when Helen Clark gave up their combat jet fleet... :}

Cos remember, any aggressor will more than likely attack Australia too!

j3

yes, I jest

M14_P

19th Aug 2010, 10:28

Goblin, I wasn't smart, I paid for the whole lot myself, ah well. Debt free, cept for that ruddy mortgage. bugger!
Now don't be taking the disappointment of another bledisloe cup loss out on us new zeaaalanders, it's not your fault that your kiwi rugby coach has muppets for players. I reckon we should give Southland a go against the Wally-bies next time out, give them a stiff anyway. :} :ok:

glekichi

19th Aug 2010, 12:00

Jokes aside, in both countries you need to have lived there for two years to get benefits, not six months. A student loan, however, is available immediately to Australians, and you can borrow an extra $150 per week (back in 2007 anyway) for living costs. I assume HECS is available immediately to NZers in Australia too.

In Australia it pissed me off that all the uni students were complaining and even protesting about their HECS contribution percentage (what is it these days, about 1/5th of whatever you cost the gov't?), yet pilots were unable to get gov't funding at all for their training.

I could have worked full time and flown an hour a week for four years (didn't have the luxury of living with the olds) just to get a CPL, then another year or two for the multi instrument and instructor ratings. Probably would still be training! Instead, I went to NZ, got the loan, had it ALL done within 12 months and now I have four years industry experience on top of that. I'm pretty sure I made the right choice, and I can tell you I had/have just as much motivation and passion as anyone who paid for it as they went!!

Limit the places and find the right people, sure, but I don't think cutting the places to nearly zero is really a help to the industry.

lilflyboy262

20th Aug 2010, 15:43

Its ok, the Aussie's can pride themselves on winding us up easily, but hey, as has been said before "YOU still have to wake each morning, look in the mirror and realise that you were severely beaten by the ugly stick as a child and THEN painted with freckles and given RED hair... cruel cruel world."

Stereotypes suck huh?

Back on topic! The main source of jobs for low houred guys in NZ is instructing. Why would you want to cut the number of people to instruct?
Fancy another 2 years of instructor wages until you get enough hours for Eagle/Mt Cook/Air Nelson?

Sqwark2000

21st Aug 2010, 04:18

Unfortunately I'm not partial to the idea of having my tax dollars pay for student loans to keep recent grads in work instructing new students.

As much as I want to see the aviation industry prosper, I also don't want it to drown with over supply of pilots, which in turn leads to degradation of terms & conditions, which will make the industry an undesirable career path.

It's part of the industry to go through the peaks and troughs of employment cycles. At the moment there is little demand for pilots yet hundreds are still under training to get a job that another couple of hundred are waiting for since they finished their training.

I support a a variable cap on student loan funded flight training in sync with industry demand.

Currently there are hundreds in training for an industry that has had fewer than 50 movements a year for the past couple of years. That's including the pseudo hiring increase due self funded career enhancements.

Maybe a hold on loans for a year or two will allow those already trained to be soaked into the system.

Of course those that are determined will and can fund their own way through, like we had to do in the old days.....

S2K

DeltaT

21st Aug 2010, 14:34

Look, Air NZ doesn't need anymore jet pilots until 2016 they say, so hence the flow and movement within NZ will continue to have close to no movement.
What is the point in training then unless you intend to go overseas.
-And I mean further afield than Australia which is transfixed on hiring rich cadets at the moment.
Capping the loans is not preventing you from getting a job, there are next to none anyway!

flyinkiwi

22nd Aug 2010, 22:20

lilflyboy262 is correct, cutting the govt funding has some rather dire implications for us private fliers as well as the career pilots. A lot of the small clubs who provide flight training rely on the revenue from Part 141 operations and a sudden reduction in funding means a rather bleak looking balance sheet. The resulting loss of students means less instructors, increased hire rates, and potentially, closure of some schools and clubs.

HercFeend

23rd Aug 2010, 03:33

D-J

23rd Aug 2010, 05:57

Just as a note re Aussies getting Student Loans in NZ. There's talk, if hasn't happened already of a two year stand down period being implemented for Australians coming here to study before being eligible for Student Loans.......

I say good. I know it doesn't apply to all but some folk come here, get a loan, study, and leave - never to repay the loan and leave the burden on the NZ tax payer......... This needed to be addressed!

a 2 minute look on the studylink website will confirm as of 01/01/2011 a 2 year stand down will come into effect for australian citizens wishing to access nz student loan funding.

hence I got in early :} :p

nzheliwhore

23rd Aug 2010, 10:05

I think the student loan thing needs to stop now in NZ. I was recently there and was very shocked at how slow the industry is in NZ, yet the flying schools are churning them out really quickly. Some of the guys are absolute muppets and would never have got into the industry if it were not for the loan scheme. The company I fly for will not hire a student loan pilot. If they will not invest their own money in there career then why should we?. There are plenty of other pilots out there who have made sacraficies. Also there has been a number of pilots who have got employment and have let their emp[loyer down after he has spent huge money on them for training.
A new trick we do now, is find a prospective employees facebook page. I have seen some facebook pages that show heavy drinking parties and even car crashes. Sorry no expensive toys for pilots with that type of life.

If they put there own money into it, them they have a personal heavy investment. There is NO pilot shortage at present. Judgeing by the CV's we get weekly, there are some very good guys out there worldwide. The flying schools in NZ are taking money on false pretenses, it is criminal really. I saying that these young pilotsa have no appreciation of debt, for a 20 year old to be $80 K in debt is criminal.

My wife is in early childhood education. When we lived in NZ it was really hard getting money from the government for young children learning. yet they gave a absolute dick head a Hughes 500 endorsement and the guy is unemployable. Where is the logic. Australians can come in and get a loan then go back to aussie never repay a cent cos the government hasnt the balls to enforse it. Many honest tax payers are obviously not aware of the extent of rip off out there.

Yes I am a kiwi, CPL fixed wing and rotor living and working out of NZ. I am a kiwi and proud of it and would love to go home and fly in my own country. I paid for my training working as a shearer and paua diver in the late 70's early 80's. I recently helped a young low houred guy recently into his first job. he was self funded australian who did the hard yards and deserved a break, I would not extend the same courtesy to a kiwi student loan pilot.

Again stop the loans, NZ needs no more pilots there are plenty there now many will never keep current so will drop off the way side. But there debt will never leave. The industry can start training there own pilots if the need should come and taking there own risks, rather than tax payer money going to guys who will not even pay for the flying to keep themselves current and are unemployable.

Also I have noticed the standard of training going backward real fast. This year pilots trained by last year students, there is no depth to training and no mentors for professionalism. I could go on, but have probably bored you all enough now.

NZH

HercFeend

23rd Aug 2010, 20:18

It's disgraceful to see the way many schools rape the studylink-funding accounts of those individuals whom they have already written off as no-hopers with no possible future in this industry.Totally agree with you there LaunchPad, just the other day I heard an account of a student at one of the larger schools who had failed 40+ exams (obviously an over estimation) who was still under training......... To a degree, and a watered down version might work in civilian school, the military have the right approach - you attain certain milestone within curtain limits or you're gone. The issue being that while on a student loan the student (and unscrupulous school) will just go on and on and on spending money trying to realise the dream when quite frankly flying might not be for them.

Less funding will result in schools be more selective and those who are left to self fund might come to conclusions about their future sooner if things are consistently 'off course' so to speak ......!

flyinkiwi

24th Aug 2010, 00:58

Launchpad, I understand your point, but I shall expand a little on mine. While it might be easier for a smaller establishment to cope with a downturn, the fact is that in the last 5 years the cost of flying has risen by a significant margin (fuel, insurance, Airways and Airport charges, rent etc...), and some clubs may find it difficult to return to the "modus operandi that existed prior to the sausage factory days". Difficult is not impossible, but for some clubs it might as well be.

As for the funding administration point, I couldn't agree more.

glekichi

24th Aug 2010, 01:49

NZHW,

Your company can choose whoever they like, but anyone eligible who has not taken advantage of the student loan is financially incompetent. If you have 80k saved, you would be significantly better off to put that in a high interest account and do the training interest free. To do otherwise is throwing (possibly tens of) thousands of dollars down the drain!!

AFAIK there are compulsory exit points for not achieving certain mile stones as of a few years back. Not going solo by 20hrs and failing exams a certain number of times.

Perhaps when a student does fail in this way the school needs to lose their funding for that place on the course. Once again I've been out of the loop for a few years now but when I was involved I'm sure the school still had access to the remaining portion of the funds (not that particular student's funds, but the equivalent full time student position could be allocated to another student). Changing that ought to make the schools a little more choosy about who they enrol.

And last but certainly not least, I absolutely agree with those saying the nationwide places need to reflect the number of pilots needed in the industry. This needs to be audited and adjusted every year by someone without a conflict of interest.

BurntheBlue

24th Aug 2010, 05:22

NZHW

rather than tax payer money going to guys who will not even pay for the flying to keep themselves current and are unemployable.
Well thats fair enough but there are those of us who have used the student loan scheme (unashamedly, i'm one of them) and still mean business.

I have to agree with glekichi on this one. From the individuals perspective you'd be silly not to take advantage and don't have a go at those of us that did just because that luxury wasn't available when you were a youngling.

By the same token, yes, funding numbers need to be limited in such times as these.

norwester33

24th Aug 2010, 08:09

Heliwhore 100% behind you, NZ is backwards with its Loan funding scheme.
I work worldwide and everytime I come home to our great wee country it annoys you too see it being used and abused.
The cadetships approaching now are just an extension of the loan setup.
Geez Im getting grumpy in my ripening years.
Still I would take self funded over breastfeed pilots anyday.
Look foward to the attack..............:oh::oh:

GoDirect

24th Aug 2010, 08:37

It is indeed a sad state that the training/loan situation has developed into in NZ. As someone who like many others self funded their way through all the training (a fair while ago now) - we didn't have the luxury of being able to have a student loan to do the training with at the time. However, as glekichi says in the post above, given the opportunity most of us would have taken it on a simple mathematical basis, in that firstly it would have lessened the cost of the training, and secondly enabled us to complete the training quicker and thereby be ready to apply for any suitable jobs sooner. The current problems that this has created though of over supply and in some cases sub-standard training and graduates is very much a huge disadvantage of the system. Obviously if it is still to be made available for genuine students, perhaps some more checks and balances are going to have to be put into place in order to improve the quality of the graduates and perhaps to an extent also address the oversupply issues.

nzheliwhore

24th Aug 2010, 09:22

Well I was expecting an attack on here which never really happened. I have heard thru sorces that for every dollar the NZ government has put into aviation student loans they are currently getting a projected 17 cents back.
That is very poor business and you can only expect it to stop with a statistic anything like that.
I saw in a article from the NMIT that a 50 year old guy got fully trained on the student loan scheeme. If he has 80K of debt and we get another 12 years befor he fails a medical. He would have to pay $128 per week without a inflation calculation and CPI. If the IRD do the normal calculations he will never pay it back complettely. The system is flawed in the respect that many will never pay it all back. At least the Key government are prepared to look at repayments and recovery.

All those guys who have debt ( I know one guy did 220 hrs on rotor and does not have a licence ) real smart move, working in a bakery paying that off. It will get to be a real drag after 5 years.

Some guys who have licences medical are no longer valid and they cannot afford to get current to do a BFR. ( real clever and undedicated )
Piont taken, there are those out there who are serious and do pay for currency on a weekly or fortnightly thing once acheived a licence. And yes some do pay for it all themselves, good on you. However we must realise that those out there who are doing the employing are self funded oldies. So some of the posts on this site will reflect that.

Aeroclubs will not suffer any more than they are now and actually there are very few clubs in NZ who rely on the student loan system, if anything it will enhance the clubs and make them more active. Yes there will be a lot of instructors floating around unemployed, but do the sums. It is cheaper to give them the dole than have them flying burning more government money. yes they may leave the country ,,, but their debt just gets bigger, so stay in NZ where there are no jobs and drift out of the industry. best thing that could happen as they will get a job outside the industry and pay back there debt.
There was always enough pilots prior to the student loan thing, the industry was not suffering, wages were good...
NZ is a great weee country, not a place for hand outs becos it IS a loan. The government will come looking one day for the money.

NZH

Ipecac

24th Aug 2010, 09:29

I don't believe govt funded loans are the issue. I scrimped and saved for 6 years working full time and studying and flying when ever I could through an aeroclub to get my PPL. My goal was always to go professional and thanks to the loan scheme I was able to quit my job and study fulltime. The benefits of being able to study fulltime should be obvious.

Money is a barrier, but only to the poor. There are plenty of muppets with CPLs who happen to have rich parents who paid for their training. So the argument about self funding producing better pilots doesn't necesarily hold true.

However I wholeheartedly agree that there needs to be more control over the number of student loans being issued. Or at the very least there needs to be some sort of aptitude testing to determine a students suitability for training. Ironically this is where the cadetship schemes are (I think) superior to the NMIT courses. Yes I know cadetships are the work of the devil :rolleyes: but having worked as an instructor for a school that trains cadets I can say that they (the students) were the best I've ever had the pleasure of teaching (and I've worked for several flight schools). Getting into a cadetship is a lot harder than many people (including about 80% of people on this site it would seem :hmm:) realise. The students have to pass aptitude tests similar to those conducted by the air force, and if you don't make the grade or you fall behind in training then you're out.

Beside, $80k is a hell of a lot of money to save and it would take most people a long time to do that. I say better to train now while you're still young enough to enjoy it and pay later when you're old enough to afford it :ok:

flyinkiwi

24th Aug 2010, 20:58

I saw in a article from the NMIT that a 50 year old guy got fully trained on the student loan scheeme. If he has 80K of debt and we get another 12 years befor he fails a medical. He would have to pay $128 per week without a inflation calculation and CPI. If the IRD do the normal calculations he will never pay it back complettely. The system is flawed in the respect that many will never pay it all back. At least the Key government are prepared to look at repayments and recovery.

I used to work in a Student Loans office at a University 12 years ago prior to WINZ taking over the operation, and there were plenty of people in their senior years, and in one case, someone who was terminally ill taking out reasonably large student loans for study who probably will never pay them back. This 50 year old guy you mention is definitely not an isolated case. This loophole would be particularly difficult to close without overt discrimination that would almost certainly be challenged by lobby groups.

BurntheBlue

25th Aug 2010, 05:28

sub-standard training

I don't think training standards have changed much, methods have though, I would say for the better.

What you're trying to say there is that, with the advent of student loan funding, the average standard of student has fallen.

nzheliwhore

26th Aug 2010, 05:39

I feel the standard of training in NZ has fallen, however this cannot be totally blamed on the student loan system. Yes it allows a 19 year old to instruct up to CPL level, However , What depth of experience does the instructor have?. I know of B cat instructors who are 21 years old. They teach a sillybis and that is it.. The CAA needs to address this. I have been shockd at the level of knowledge of some guys I have flown with. I own a cessna in NZ and finding some one desent to look after it while I am away is very hard. i only get home a couple of times a year and thats when I use it.. The skill and knowledge level is not there, AND it is not the students fault entirely. I know one instructor who spent years on the dole drink whiskey, now he is an instructor and mentor for a professional pilot?. I think that is a bit of a joke actually and his students reflect this. Back in the old days, you were judge alot on whose instructor name you had in your log book, becos many of the pilots out there were working professionals, not just instructors. They imparted extra knowledge to there students over and beyond the syllibis. This has all gone now and It is partly guys like myself whom are partly to blame for not getting instructor ratings and passing on to the industry. At the end of the day most are too busy trying to earn a living as a pilot and prepare for retirement.

The up side for the CAA when they cut student loans, is that if 80% of training crashes were from student loan providers, it could effectively cut the accident rate in the area by 80%, And they would look like they are doing there job.

There is also the arguement that prior to student loans flying was cheaper. I aggree becos these schools can charge wot they like and they know they are going to get it. If you look at the non funded clubs, flying is still the same proportionally. When I took my first flying lesson, it was in a cessna 150 ZK CSG 12 dec 1978 and it was $26 per hour, When I went solo on my 16th birthday in C 150 CXI it was $27 per hour. I bought a really good pair of boots just after going solo. Top quality great brand $26 they cost. When recently in NZ, I bought a great pair of working boots, great brand top quality. $235, How much is a cessna 150 these days?. To get a cpl self funded at 21 is not out of the question. If you want something badly enough you will get it.
To have saved the funds and then invested to make it grow and get a student loan... well I suppose it is using the system if you have the money. To leave NZ with student debt and no job is financial irresponsibilty.

NZH

BurntheBlue

26th Aug 2010, 08:28

I have perfectly reasonable answers for every one you gripes mr NZHW, but I wont bother.

You, Sir, suffer from 'Back in MY Day' syndrome (*Purses Lips, Peers inquisitively over monocle*) :=

Welcome... to the 21st century. :}

GoDirect

26th Aug 2010, 09:01

Burn the Blue - With respect to my earlier comment re sub-standard training, I do accept your comment above that there has been in some cases a reduction in the standards of some of the students. But where I would also stand by my comment on the training, is that in some of the "sausage factories" there has definitely been an upsurge in the most recent graduates training the new students. Yes, the industry has always had newer and lesser experienced instructors training students, but it seems to have proliferated like never before with the large numbers of people going through training. Whilst I hesitate to use your expression "back in my day" the simple facts of the matter were that most of us were doing our CPL's IR's etc with extremely experienced long term instructors - and the extra knowledge that they were able to pass on was of great benefit. Everybody has to start somewhere, but I think it's fair to say that in some quarters there has been a diluting of instructional experience.

Ipecac

27th Aug 2010, 03:22

"The up side for the CAA when they cut student loans, is that if 80% of training crashes were from student loan providers, it could effectively cut the accident rate in the area by 80%, And they would look like they are doing there job."

First of all the CAA has nothing to do with the student loan scheme.

Secondly, to suggest that accidents might go down by 80% by cutting student loans is simply ridiculous. The only way that is reducing the accident rate is by reducing the number of students in the sky and doesn't address the causes of accidents which is far more complicated then just who is and isn't flying on a student loan.

Oh, and by the way, it's spelt SYLLABUS.

Sqwark2000

27th Aug 2010, 04:07

First of all the CAA has nothing to do with the student loan scheme.

Not directly, correct. But when the number of applications for flight crew documents plummet, so will their revenue stream. Same for ASL. Imagine how much a CBT exam will cost when there's a) less people sitting exams and b) actually smarter people sitting and passing first time, rather than multi-sit dreamers.... :hmm:

There will be flow on effects for sure, including initial resistance from providers who have printed money from the current scheme and wouldn't want to see their bottomline's suffer.

S2K

prospector

27th Aug 2010, 05:33

"I aggree becos these schools can charge wot they like"

70% in spelling enough for a pass????

brad_nz90

28th Aug 2010, 02:08

I believe cutting funding is a good Idea it will eliminate people who just sign up for some thing to do when they finish school and also mean there are less people going for the jobs. But in saying that I would not of became a pilot with out the funding so rather than cutting it, They could make an entry requirement of having a private pilots license, and maybe even completed some CPL subjects. Then when they see you are dedicated then they give you the loan for CPL hour building, flying and Multi engine instrument rating

nzheliwhore

28th Aug 2010, 05:42

Attention Jimmyconway
You describe my gramma and spelling as brutal ... Gess wot I aggree and no gramma and spelling were not a part of this job... ( just as well )
When I got this position 2 years ago they were more interested in weather I knew wot "Walker Circulation "was, and weather I could explain "Wing Walkdown" in one sentence. Wot my SP,O2 stats were and weather I new how to quickly and accurately do DA calculations. Once that was done they quickly wanted to know how well I flew.
Also you get judged so harshly on EI, Something every employer/ CP I have had, is watching. Companies are starting to inpliment a KPI system mainly initiated by there clients who really enjoy auditing there aviation suppliers. I currently fly turbines ( both F/W and Rotor ) in the highlands of PNG and occassionally accross into indonesia.

Piont taken and so true..... Yes it is not really how you funded your training it is who and how well you were trained. The student loan thingy has allowed inexperienced instructor in.

Introduce spell check to pprune

Professionally Unprofessional
NZH