external checklist interrupted....!

[cjm_2010]

I was carrying out external checks on the humble flight school PA38 this afternoon (1600 hrs) on the apron at swansea when a couple of grey speks caught my eye.

I figured out what was going on and had less than a second to get my fingers in my ears - the grey speks quickly turned into two tornadoes (sp?) in formation, wing swept, buzzing the airport at about 200 ft above the ground. amazing :D

it got me thinking though - what are the rules regarding military aircraft overflying a non-military airfield? and at that speed - subsonic but pretty damn quick - how could the pilots be sure that they wouldn't collect some poor sod in a tomohawk?

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

They wouldn't be overhead without clearance from ATC, who presumably wouldn't agree to the flypast if there was any traffic at the airport.

[SirToppamHat]

Subject to the appropriate clearance from ATC, all aircraft (civil and military) are allowed to fly as low as they like over all airfields (civil and military) - otherwise it's difficult to land.

Normal overland supersonic rules apply.

Except when they don't.

I'll get me coat.

STH

[vecvechookattack]

The ATC at Swansea are always obliging and very grateful for the odd flypast.

[cjm_2010]

I was grateful too - I've never seen a tornado up close, let alone in flight. set my lesson off nicely and It's something to tell the boys about in work tomorrow :)

[Easy Street]

That's a negative Ghostrider, the pattern is full.

Goddamn son of a bitch! I want some butts!

[The Nr Fairy]

I think you've just given yourself away as a Naval aviator :)

[Old-Duffer]

......... the most important thing is what did you do and what is your normal SOP if your checklist is interupted?

There have been many prangs/close calls 'cause somebody was distracted and an item in the checklist was missed.

O-D

[Dancing Bear]

If these were the same Tornado's that went overhead Padstow, Cornwall at appx 500' at some lick at around 1500 ish, then a huge Thank You fella's, you absolutely made my Brother-in-Laws 60th Birthday Party!! Everyone was admiring the view over the Camel estuary and making pleasant comments about how it looked so perfect and could not be more pretty when wham, through the overhead came 3 x Tornado's, wings swept, and I begged to differ that the view had indeed just been improved!

Fly Safe.
:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[cjm_2010]

........ the most important thing is what did you do and what is your normal SOP if your checklist is interupted?

There have been many prangs/close calls 'cause somebody was distracted and an item in the checklist was missed.

O-D

I was still on the port external page at the time (the second page IIRC) - I just went back to the beginning and started over. no need to rush :)

[whowhenwhy]

Well done CJM2010 :D The amount of people that would try and remember where they were :ugh:

In all my time, I've never refused a fly-through, low break etc etc. Any chance of doing one at Medmenham? Oh well, you can;t blame a chap for trying...:E

[Al R]

The ATC at Swansea are always obliging and very grateful for the odd flypast.

Sure.. you hear about problems with age catching up and serviceability, but is seeing a brace of Tornados really that odd these days?

[It's Not Working]

Al

Seeing a brace of anything, or even a singleton, is unusual these days. I must move back to Bomber County.

[Cameronian]

TorqueOfTheDevil, I was the hindmost of four aircraft on the downwind leg of a very crowded circuit at Scone in the summer of 1972 when two Phantoms went straight across the 150 in front of mine at precisely the circuit height of 1000'. Air Traffic had no warning of it whatsoever - I asked them upon landing. I can still see a freeze-frame image of it as I sit here almost forty years later. A schoolfriend of mine was a Phantom backseater at Leuchars at the time; his comment was that they shouldn't have been there but that they probably didn't even notice.

[Old-Duffer]

.............. in '73, the stash at Coningsby hit a crop sprayer and Aug '91 OC 41 & OC Ops at Colt clobbered a guy taking photos in mid Wales and then there was a repeat in '99 - only this time it was a Tornado and a photo taker.

That there sky is plenty crowded

[green granite]

RAE Bedford, BOAC 707 on an ILS on a dark night,
ATC "unknown traffic right to left, should pass about a mile in front of you"
707 "roger looking........ah yes, landing lights going on .....now...they're a pair of Phantoms"

[clareprop]

I do recall an incident in the late '80's at Sibson airfield where one of the regular jumpers at the parachute centre happened also to be a Tornado pilot. One quiet Wednesday afternoon, said Flt Lt (G**** M********) did an unannounced (to us) v fast, low pass over the clubhouse. Whilst frozen into a considerable state of shock myself, I observed the drop zone dog, an indifferent three-legged animal called Friday, evacuate his bowel's onto the foot of his owner.

Halcyon days....

[bobward]

Re the incidents mentioned by Old Duffer. If I recall the Jaguar incident correctly, wasn't the Cessna flying low level, taking pictures when the Jaguar ran down a low level route, with tragic results?

What made it all the more poignant was that one of the Jaguar crew had recently had a heart (?) transplant, and was just getting back up to full flying status again.
Can't comment on the others I'm afaid.

Any one else out there have more to add, or is my memory fading again?

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Cameronian,

I'm not surprised you can still remember it clearly! One hopes that your incident is the exception which proves the rule, and that the Phantom crews were made aware of their c*ck-up...

Old Duffer,

While your last point is well made, did any of the examples you provide happen right over an airfield? I don't know about the Coningsby staish event (would be interested to head details) but I'm fairly sure the other two were not over or near airfields.

[DC10RealMan]

In the 1980s there was a pilot of a light aeroplane killed at Norwich Airport when a pair of USAF A10s went through the circuit without permission and collided with him.

[Wander00]

I seem to remember that in the Wales case the Cessna was where he should not have been at a height he should not have been at

[Old-Duffer]

None of the incidents in my previous post took place over active airfields and I posted them as an illustration of the dangers involved in low level ops around the UK.

If one goes back a bit there are plenty of examples over airfields; two Hornets over Butterworth in '53, a pair of Wellingtons at Topcliffe in '47, and more recently - Red Arrows at Kemble in '71 (4 fatals) and two Wessex at Odiham in '70 (five fatals) and recently as 2007 there were a pair of Squirrels at Ternhill. There are plenty more on record.

O-D

[teeteringhead]

What made it all the more poignant was that one of the Jaguar crew had recently had a heart (?) transplant, ... heart and lung transplant in fact.

Even stranger, it was the lungs that were the problem, but you had to transplant both. Net result, one serviceable heart returned to stores .....

...... which was then transplanted into another patient (a London cabbie IIRC), who was at the funeral, having got to know JM and done some fundraising for the hospital with him.............

[MATELO]

FAO: Bob Ward

I believe it was John Mardon killed in the Jag accident in Wales. Yes, he had just received a heart and lung transplant and if I recall rightly it was his last flight, not his first. (I stand to be corrected)

A light aircraft with a bloke hanging out of the window taking photos of houses, was where he shouldn't have been and they collided just to the west of Carno.

Of course, John being John, knew everybody, and it seemed everybody in the RAF tried to contact him that day trying to find out about the poor "chap" who had perished.

One of the worst days in my 22 year career.