Merged: Scoop On YPKA - 'AFIZ' to Reopen!!

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Talk about 'The Wheel' going 'Full Circle.....BAH HUMBUG!!!! :ugh::ugh:

Well. if I hadn't actually seen it, I NEVA would have believed it.....:}:}


http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/publications/current/sup/s10-h42.pdf


Karratha to have an 'AFIZ' - AGAIN!!!! After some - wot is it - 11 or 12 years or so ??:sad::sad:

Well, for a while anyhow.......Then its gunna be a Control Zone...:}

AFIS vs AFIZ... Wot's the diff??:rolleyes::rolleyes:

30nm and A100!!!! Wunnerful!!!

And to think that 'they' sold all of the houses, after they redundo'd us out of there. Now, its going to cost a FORTUNE to get the real estate to get back in - AGAIN!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

And....guess who's gunna pay for it..??

C H E E E R R S S S S :}:}

There ya go Bloggsy, FULL COVERAGE now..... Maybe.....:ok:

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO U, HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO U, HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO ALL OF YOUSE, ...................And 'SAFE FLYING' TO ALL.......

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Would yas believe it if I mentioned that YPKA is about to have ....

AFIZ / AFIS???

30nm and up to A100!! WOW!! Almost just like it 'USED TO BE'......

Here is the goss.....

http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/publications/current/sup/s10-h42.pdf

See also 'Reporting Point' site......

Happy Birthday to ALL........:ok::ok::ok:

[Exit Strategy]

Given the issues of aircraft in close proximity to each other being on different frequencies (CTAF and area) would it not be a good idea to divide up all the class G airspace into manageable areas and give each one a dedicated frequency that all aircraft in the area are on. This frequency could be monitored by ATC to accept IFR position reports and give traffic information.

To save $$$ instead of using expensive ATC staff, a lower paid and slightly less trained FIS operator could be used. They could be called Flight Service or something similar. Because they would be cheaper we could have more of them. This would allow an increase in the level of service available to aircraft, perhaps even allowing full flight following for VFR aircraft.

ICAO are considering reducing the current 7 (A-G) airspace classifications to just 3 equating roughly to C, E and G. If E was dropped we could have 2 kinds of airspace, controlled and uncontrolled thus significantly simplifying airspace management.

[The Voice]

Griff ya old bugger .. keeping well I trust?

wow - really? What's brought this on? Next you'll be telling us they want us all back!

[CaptainMidnight]

The story I heard was that for this interim period ASA wanted to put in a CAGRS like BRM, but CASA wouldn't approve it. Something about CAGRS is either put in voluntarily by an airport owner, or by CASA directing an airport owner to put one in.

In the absence of either, the only thing left that CASA would approve was an AFIS.

[OZBUSDRIVER]

One thing for sure, Griffo...we know this WILL work.:ok:

[MrApproach]

<To save $$$ instead of using expensive ATC staff, a lower paid and slightly less trained FIS operator>

What makes you think a "slightly less trained" employee will accept much less money than an "expensive" ATC?

I think if you go back to the early '90s when FS was doing what is suggested the service was costing about $80 million per year and apart from the odd RPT operating OCTA (as G was then called) nobody wanted to pay for it.

For Griffo it was great service and is classified as "F" in the airspace table. Anyone know what it is to be called at Karratha? (Given that our D is not D and our E is not E)

[Joker 10]

It is called "W" for whoops Airspace, no maybe I didn't get that right = Whoops

[ferris]

the service was costing about $80 million per year and apart from the odd RPT operating OCTA (as G was then called) nobody wanted to pay for it. So they removed the service from aviation, and the $80 mil went back into aviation, right? So aviation wasn't the loser, right? Right? Pigs arse.

Often mentioned here is that aviation is an essential service (to the people who really needed the FS). Perhaps if it's funding was treated that way, the wheel wouldn't need re-inventing. Let's not even mention FS being part of the "US System"!

[Capn Bloggs]

Why not just call it a CAGRS. And "Karratha Radio" as opposed to "Karratha". I'm looking forward to being talked-to/at by an airport.

Is the Broome CAGRS going to be changed to an AFIS to keep everything standard and simple during the transition?

Griffo, OAR must be running around in circles; they really really want to call it an AFIZ/MBZ but Dick won't let them. :} "All traffic in the Karratha Airspace Volume, including you, Karratha (meaning Karratha Radio, not the airport), this is Bloggs 101, 30 miles South, inbound". Maybe we could abbreviate it to KAV. Oops, rhymes with KEV.

To assist with the transition of pilots and air traffic controllers
from Class G/CTAF to Class D/E airspace procedures, an Aerodrome
Flight Information Service (AFIS) will be established at Karratha.
More like scare the sh1t out of the Dawg when he realises what goes on there now! :}

Exit Strategy,
You are an unabashed stirrer! :ok:

Joker 10,
It is called "W" for whoops Airspace, no maybe I didn't get that right = Whoops
A bit cheeky, given that the turmoil of Australian airspace over the last twenty years has been caused by the various regulators/pollies trying to placate you and your "Free in GE" mates.

[Jabawocky]

Is the Broome CAGRS going to be changed to an AFIS to keep everything standard and simple during the transition?

Come on Bloggs...up your game lad! We all know three standards are better than one! :rolleyes:

[Dog One]

And to make a final improvement, to make it easier and safer for all users, OAR have decided to implement a similar MBZ at YPPD. It will be the same dimensions as Broome and Karratha, and will share a common frequency so all traffic operating in the MBZ's will be aware of each other. THis airspace will be E (self seperating with DTI to holders of Gold Mastercard only) (Essgmo).

AIC's covering operations in Essgmo will be available on the web, once you have entered your Mastercard details. The vicious rumour that cardholders had to be able to sing "America" is wrong. You only have to be able to hum it!

[Ted D Bear]

Where's Dick?


PS I'm OK with the "Karratha" call-sign, because it makes me remember the good 'ol days (30 years ago) when I started flying and we used to talk to (and get some great service from!) "Weipa", "Cooma", "Mildura", "Coffs", "Dubbo", "Perth", "Adelaide", "Darwin", "Sydney", "Brisbane" and many others ... :ok:

[peuce]

Well, that woke me up Griffo ...

However, maybe I'm a bit thick ... but what Service are they actually providing?

Pilots are required to BROADCAST (there's that word again ... do the Lawyers have a problem with "Contact"?) to Karattha ... as soon as possible AFTER entering the airspace ...??

"Melbourne Centre will continue to provide IFR aircraft traffic
information and a Flight Information Service in Class G airspace." ... what Class Airspace is the AFIS? Will IFRs get traffic twice?

"All established pilot communications and procedures with
Melbourne Centre will remain unchanged for the duration of Karratha
AFIS ie. IFR taxi, SARWATCH Cancellations."

A lot of double handling ... presumably because of lack of communication links.

Better than nothing I suppose, but a bit of a mish mash ..

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Hi Peuce,

WOT?? You been on leave..??

I hope you have a note.....you're 3 days late......:}:}

OK, you probably have 'regular days orf' where you is....

Yeah, the 'broadcast' bit is still there, (twr manned / unmanned?) and the requirement to notify the KA Twr of callsigns copied as tfc, but only ML can cnl SAR??

No direct co-ord facs I wonder..??
Not really like the 'ole days' then??

Still, its a good start.....:ok::ok:

(CTA / OCTA next...??? :yuk::eek:

[CaptainMidnight]

Given the continued Melbourne Centre responsibilities with respect to airspace, traffic info, SAR and taking taxi calls, I interpret this "AFIS" as being a CAGRS when you don't/can't officially have one ........

It is certainly not like the AFIZ of old.

Why the :mad: does everything have to be so complicated :{

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Manned by REAL LIVE ATCers Cap'n.

'Tis the 'interim' measure until they get the appropriate KA TWR Rating - which is yet to be devised.

Its a 'cushy' gig I reckon - 0730am to 3.30pm WST...then I guess ya get to go fishing in that luvly Dampier archipellago....although by 3.30 in the arvo, the SE 'breeze' is usually a bit strong.....(Been there- done that).:=

Then, around 18 NOV., the magic wand is waved, and hey presto - its a Control zone......
probably D, with wot is that (?) above.......:hmm:

e - e - e -(?) and g - g - g- when said twr is closed....... :rolleyes:

Still, 'tis better than wots there now.......:eek:
Happy Landings:ok:

[MyNameIsIs]

then I guess ya get to go fishing in that luvly Dampier archipellago....although by 3.30 in the arvo, the SE 'breeze' is usually a bit strong.....(Been there- done that).:=


"we're gunna need a bigger boat" - classic line.

[Capn Bloggs]

Its a 'cushy' gig I reckon - 0730am to 3.30pm WST...
1530? The last wave to KTA hasn't even left Perth then. It'll be a ten hour shift, I reckon, with the last 30 minutes the most exciting.

[topend3]

Yep last RPT departs at 1845 so definitely a 10 hour shift...

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Para 1.3 refers gents.........

Ya simply don't exist after 'fishin' time........:}

[peuce]

Griffo is right ...

It just goes to show how our Aviation Administrators continue to do things half-arsed.

Just wondering why the urgency to get a quasi AFIZ in now ... instead of waiting till Controllers are rated, equipment is installed and the "required" Control Service can be commenced.

Are things that dangerous at KTA now?

I also wonder ... if the AFIZ works out fine (at least for the hours that it's operating) would there be a need to upgrade to a Control Service at all?

And a final observation ... obviously the Controller shortage is finished!

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Slight drift....pun intended....:}

G'day 'myname',

I used to drive a 40ft steel hull 'r&r' fishin' / relaxin' boat for an American co. up there for a little over a year, and yep! a bigger boat is often mucho better -especially when the morning easterlies are a blowin', to be followed by the afternoon SE which affects the whole of the west coast and makes comin' home to Dampier very 'bumpy'....and wet.:=
Not to mention the 16-18ft tides......

But the rest of the time...ITS BLOODY GREAT!!:D:D
At low tide in the 'springs'...make sure its not grate....:=

However, with those schedules mentioned, I guess the hours of ops of the TWR will be extended accordingly???;)

Pity 'bout the AFIS times tho.......:}