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G-CPTN
10th Jun 2010, 02:23
A 20-year-old Romanian man had a lucky escape after stowing away on a plane flying from Vienna to London.
The man hid himself in the rear wheel compartment of the plane which landed at Heathrow Airport on Sunday. He was taken into police custody in London but later released without charge.
He survived because the plane flew at a low altitude to avoid stormy weather.
He could have been charged or fined or given a fixed penalty, the Metropolitan Police told the BBC. But he was cautioned and freed with no further action being taken, PA news agency reported.
The man could also have been handed to the UK Border Agency.
But it is understood that there is no immigration issue and that the agency will not seek to deport him, according to PA.
As Romania is part of the EU, the man is free to enter the UK.

From (and more at):- BBC News - Frosty welcome for lucky plane stowaway (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/10273995.stm)



aditya104
10th Jun 2010, 02:53
is the luggage compartment unpressurised in most large aircraft?
Carriage of animals, in a container, must not be in the passenger cabin of aircraft(According to rules of most countries). Any information related to this?

SomeGuyOnTheDeck
10th Jun 2010, 03:19
Shows what a pathetic state the UK immigration policies are! FFS, ignorining for a second the fine the airline will no doup cop for bringing him in, and the damage he could have unintentionly caused to the aircraft - the fact is that he was an ILLEGAL immigrant and should be deported back to the departing country immediatly upon release from police custody. No documents = no entry, no excuses - period. Legal immigration I have no problem with.
Fcuking hell, released without charge and the immigration authories are not seeking to deport him - What has the cuntry come too!

He wasn't an illegal immigrant:
As Romania is part of the EU, the man is free to enter the UK
I suggest you (a) learn to read, and (b), learn to spell, SASKATOON9999. you may think you live in a 'cuntry', I've actually lived here long enough (all my life actually, like most of my immediate ancestors), to know that it is a 'country'. Personally, if we were to deport anyone, I'd prefer it was you...

onetrack
10th Jun 2010, 03:24
With that kind of luck, I reckon everyone who dealt with him, would have been trying to rub themselves against him, to get some of his Lotto luck... :rolleyes:

What would your chances be of surving that trip? 1 in 1,000,000?? Let me see... initially escaped being chewed to bits by a tyre spinning at around 150kts as the undercarriage is being retracted... survived without oxygen, usually needed above 20,000 ft... survived -20C temperature at FL20?... and then survived a landing that involves flying chunks of tyre rubber being flung into the wheel well??
One really has to wonder at the desperation... or total stupidity... of these stowaways.

rubik101
10th Jun 2010, 03:39
His passport and identity cards were checked and found to be valid. He's an EU citizen so how can they deport him? I agree with SGOTD, the guy we need to deport is SASKATOON.

Load Toad
10th Jun 2010, 03:42
Immigrassi issues aside - shouldn't he be charged with some sort of security related offense?
Or is it OK now for anyone to get onto / into any part of any 'plane they want to anywhere?

SomeGuyOnTheDeck
10th Jun 2010, 03:53
shouldn't he be charged with some sort of security related offense
I can't see the point, really. If he has the brains to understand he broke the law, he also has the brains to realise how lucky he was. And if he doesn't, punishing him will be no deterrent.

There might be a case against airport security, but how realistic is it to expect every eventuality to be covered? If you really think you can have a fool-proof system, for security or anything else, you obviously haven't encountered enough fools...

Worrals in the wilds
10th Jun 2010, 04:38
Surely there must be a million easier (and safer) ways to get out of Vienna. I could understand taking the chance if trying to escape somewhere like North Korea, but Vienna? Couldn't you just hitch hike or catch a bus? :confused:

Has there been any talk about his mental state?

SomeGuyOnTheDeck
10th Jun 2010, 05:05
'Cuntry is a play on the word Country'. Really? How?

The stowaway appears not to have had any idea of where he was trying to get to, so what his 'legitimate purpose' was, beyond not remaining where he started from, I haven't a clue.

He didn't 'enter the country illegally' - as an EU citizen he has a legal right to enter. He may have defrauded the airline, but that is a civil matter. As for 'security implications', I've little to fear from idiots like him, and much more to fear from knee-jerk 'oh-my-god-he's-a foreigner-perhaps-he's-a-terrorist' idiots like you.

Desert Dawg
10th Jun 2010, 05:27
From the local press in Dubai this morning, it seems the flight was not a commercial flight, but a private aircraft which was positioning to London.

etrang
10th Jun 2010, 05:56
much more to fear from knee-jerk 'oh-my-god-he's-a foreigner-perhaps-he's-a-terrorist' idiots like you.

What exactly do you have to fear from SASKATOON or people like him?

Edited to add: We certainly have something to fear from idiots like the stowaway, if only because he might have fallen out and hit some innocent person on the ground.

rottenray
10th Jun 2010, 05:57
There are most likely numerous possible charges relating to trespassing, interfering with the operation of a public carrier, et cetera.

I'll guess that neither the aircraft operator nor the airport wants to press charges for fear that this moron will in turn sue for personal injury citing negligence on someone else's part.

"My {whatever} is now {condition} and it's all because they allowed me to stow away."

Shame about the weather that day...



There might be a case against airport security, but how realistic is it to expect every eventuality to be covered?Some Guy - for as damn inconvenient as security has become, they should be all over this like white on rice.

As a paying pax / enthusiast, I am no longer allowed to accompany a pilot on a walkaround, and would be tackled should I stick my little toe out on the ramp.

What gives a stowaway more privilege?

edited: ranting @<hidden> some guy

fc101
10th Jun 2010, 06:43
Immigrassi issues aside - shouldn't he be charged with some sort of security related offense?
Or is it OK now for anyone to get onto / into any part of any 'plane they want to anywhere?

As long as he wasn't carrying more than 500ml of liquids in 100ml separate bottles he's probably fine. Did he take is belt and shoes off though....?

fc101
E145 driver and somewhat cynical about "security"

driftdown
10th Jun 2010, 06:46
I am with Saskatoon and Etrang on this.

Apart from dropping and injuring an innocent person(s) or damaging property the next time somebody attempts this they may harbour ill-intent and in the event they were able to evade the authorities then who knows what might happen.

EU citizen and the right to enter the UK sure, return him to his country of origin or residence pointing out that if he wants to enter the UK, there are appropriate and legal methods to do so.

Pretty simple I would have thought!

remoak
10th Jun 2010, 07:01
I suggest you (a) learn to read, and (b), learn to spell, SASKATOON9999

Lol yeah absolutely...

"ignorining"...
"doup"...
"unintentionly"...
"immediatly"...
"authories"...
"cuntry"...

Hard to take anybody seriously when they are basically illiterate... :rolleyes:

barry lloyd
10th Jun 2010, 07:55
AFAIK Romanians are allowed to enter the UK for holidays without any restrictions. If they want work, the situation is more complicated. Yes, Romania is in the EU, but there are quotas on entry to the UK from Romania which were introduced after the Polish debacle. Given that situation, he has entered illegally and as others have said, should have been returned to his country of origin.
The business about paying the carrier, mentioned in previous posts, is misunderstood. The aircraft belongs to the Dubai royal family and was on a positioning flight VIE-LHR.
What does concern me is that this young man was interviewed found to be of previous good character (my italics) and released. I don't think I'd want to rely on any criminal records the Romanian authorities might hold as evidence of good character or otherwise. He is now free and presumably living at our expense, or perhaps catching our much-revered swans for food, as many of his countrymen have been doing recently.
One further point. Did this young man have some idea of where this aircraft was going when he stowed away? If it had been going back to Dubai and supposing for a nanosecond that he had survived the flight, he would have had a very different reception and he must have been aware of that.

green granite
10th Jun 2010, 07:55
Why is it when some people disagree with a persons post, they start shouting about his spelling? It would be much more to the point if they demolished his posting with reasoned argument, but I do realise that does take a degree of intelligence. :rolleyes:

sea oxen
10th Jun 2010, 07:58
In two minds about this:
Irrespective of his passport details - He attempted to enter the UK illegally. I.e., he attempted to enter the UK outside of the normal channels of walking past an immigration officer and presenting said passport at the counter.

Perfectly reasonable and well worth the risk.

On the other hand, he left Vienna for London. He is clearly a psychopath suffering from delusions.

SO
green granite
Rule 1 is to attack the speeling. Rule 2 is to attack the posters apostrophe awareness. Rule 3, when the other rule's dont work, is too try a bit harder. Rule 4: Your a facist/rascist! Rule 5: Invoke Godwin. :)

Lon More
10th Jun 2010, 08:12
aditya104 the hold is normally pressurised but not heated. When animals are carried the heating can be switched on; AKA the dead dog switch

Billy Connolly's story about the stowaway falling into Edinburgh Zoo is bought to mind.

The guy is a stowaway and should have been treated as stowaways were on ships in the past, Roll out the plank:}

green granite
10th Jun 2010, 08:23
green granite
Rule 1 is to attack the speeling. Rule 2 is to attack the posters apostrophe awareness. Rule 3, when the other rule's dont work, is too try a bit harder. Rule 4: Your a facist/rascist! Rule 5: Invoke Godwin.


Agreed, but it still shows an inferior mind though. :E:E:E

Basil
10th Jun 2010, 09:18
If as reported, the guy should be charged with criminal offenses and/or deported.
Allegedly:
Entered the country illegally.
Endangered an aircraft.

Enough to be going on with, methinks.

potkettleblack
10th Jun 2010, 09:31
He broke the law and therefore he should have been removed immediately from the country. Should he try to get in again then the immigration laws should be sufficiently tight so as to preclude him from entering except for exceptional purposes or the serving of say a 10 year automatic ban.

Similarly anyone who enters a country and breaks its laws should be removed as soon as any custodial sentence is completed. It should be a seamless process with the immigration services meeting them at the jail and taking custody of them for transfer to the airport.

ExSp33db1rd
10th Jun 2010, 09:34
SomeGuyOnTheDeck - your attack on SASKATOON is totally unwarranted, he has made perfectly valid points. It's you who obviously live in the Cuntry.


As for 'security implications', I've little to fear from idiots like him, and much more to fear from knee-jerk 'oh-my-god-he's-a foreigner-perhaps-he's-a-terrorist' idiots like you.


That's not the point, maybe the subject isn't a terrorist, but the fact that he got into the aircraft at his point of departure just goes to prove what a total waste of time all this aggressive, pathetic, security is - we've long known that the real bad guys will do just what ever they want, whenever they want to do it - and ....... he MIGHT have been a terrorist, so why didn't they stop him ?

and ref; spelling ..........


Hard to take anybody seriously when they are basically illiterate.


You mean like everybody who uses SMS text on their mobile phone ?

Capetonian
10th Jun 2010, 09:51
Perhaps he thought it would be a bit less frosty in the wheel well than on board a BA flight in economy class!

I think I read yesterday that he had no travel documents on him, that is an offence and whilst he is perfectly entitled as a Romanian citizen to enter the UK through the correct channels, he should be charged with security offences, illegal entry, endangering an aircraft, and trespassing in a secure area.

ExSp33db1rd
10th Jun 2010, 09:56
Why waste time and money on all the above, just send him back - in another wheel well.

trident3A
10th Jun 2010, 10:07
Does anyone know which aircraft it was, the news mentioned a private Jumbo - I'm thinking perhaps a 747SP?

Load Toad
10th Jun 2010, 10:49
but how realistic is it to expect every eventuality to be covered? If you really think you can have a fool-proof system, for security or anything else, you obviously haven't encountered enough fools...

Oh - so if someone breaches security we should just let them off for showing initiative.
What can possibly go wrong <facepalm>?

G-CPTN
10th Jun 2010, 11:20
I think I read yesterday that he had no travel documents on him,How do the authorities know exactly who he is?

remoak
10th Jun 2010, 11:21
SASKATOON9999

Oh, do please grow up. There are no immigration issues. There are no border security issues. There are no other security issues. Why do you think they let him go?

At the most you could take a poke at airport security in Austria, but that's about it.

If you seriously wanted to get into the UK unobserved, you are highly unlikely to succeed doing it this way, assuming you even survived. Most people who try this fall out when the gear is lowered, and hit the ground as frozen blocks of meat.

Guess what - people with sinister intent know this, and choose other methods, of which there are many.

green granite

Why is it when some people disagree with a persons post, they start shouting about his spelling? It would be much more to the point if they demolished his posting with reasoned argument, but I do realise that does take a degree of intelligence. :rolleyes:As there was clearly no intelligence at work, the only thing left to have a go at was the spelling... and there was nothing on TV, so... :} Besides, as the stupidity of the argument was self-evident, it didn't really seem to require a comprehensive rebuttal...

You mean like everybody who uses SMS text on their mobile phone ?

Touche...

DILLIGAFF
10th Jun 2010, 11:55
If as mentioned by Capetonian above he did not have any travel documents, then it is worrying that the authorities just let him go. Does that mean that anyone can turn up from anywhere and say, "I am an EU citizen from any EU country you care to choose but I do not have any passport or documents to prove it" and the immigration bods say OK in you come?

Desert Dawg
10th Jun 2010, 12:03
@<hidden> Trident3A (and all the others who missed the facts - except barry lloyd)

The aircraft in question belongs to the Dubai royal family and was on a positioning flight from VIE to LHR.

For the third time already!!!! Doh...!!!!:ugh:

Ex Cargo Clown
10th Jun 2010, 12:34
I should think that VIE security should be rather concerned that somebody managed to get under a fence and then board an aircraft undetected. Not just any aircraft but one belonging to a royal family :sad:

He appears to be just a random nutcase, but it would be interesting to hear a few things. Firstly just how did he get to Vienna, and secondly, how do the UK Border Agency really know who he is?

A very strange story indeed.

remoak
10th Jun 2010, 12:56
If as mentioned by Capetonian above he did not have any travel documents, then it is worrying that the authorities just let him go

No, it isn't.

The authorities will, by default, lock you up until your identity is established. They were clearly satisfied in this case. Unless, of course, you believe that the police/Immigration folk would wilfully put a suspect individual back out amongst the public, just for fun...

Sprogget
10th Jun 2010, 13:11
Actually, Remoak, dig a little deeper & you will find that that has indeed happened in the recent past. Only so many coppers to go around.

Storminnorm
10th Jun 2010, 13:24
I recall that in my many years at LGW we had a couple of
bodies found in U/C bays.
Both eventually found to come from East Africa.
Desperate people to even attempt that sort of thing.

green granite
10th Jun 2010, 13:40
The authorities will, by default, lock you up until your identity is established. They were clearly satisfied in this case. Unless, of course, you believe that the police/Immigration folk would wilfully put a suspect individual back out amongst the public, just for fun...

It happened on the A14 recently, a group of illegal immigrants were found in the back of a lorry which had stopped in a lay-bye. The police removed them from the container and after questioning them told them to make their own way to the immigration reception centre in London..................they didn't arrive and have not been traced since.

Lonewolf_50
10th Jun 2010, 14:01
A couple of quick questions:

1. Do not EU (ICAO even?) rules require that any passenger be on manifest? If so, then who gets the whack-upside-the-head for this unmanifested passenger: the pax, or the carrier? This illegitimate pax was at least an accessory to the rule violation.

2. Security in Austria: wonder how they feel, being made to look such fools?

Sprogget
10th Jun 2010, 14:04
To be on the manifest, you have to be in the aircraft. In the warm, seated part of the aircraft at any rate.

Lonewolf_50
10th Jun 2010, 14:13
True enough, but I don't think that let's him off the hook, since he embarked on the aircraft illegally. At the least, he violated at least one safety regulation, didn't he?

G-CPTN
10th Jun 2010, 15:37
told them to make their own way to the immigration reception centre in London..................they didn't arrive and have not been traced since
If they don't report to Immigrant Reception then they cannot be considered for 'asylum' and will remain as illegal immigrants - and subject to deportation if/when they come to the notice of 'the authorities'.
I don't know whether the Police have any brief to enforce such matters unless directed by the Border Control Agency. Until ID cards become legally required then it appears that isn't a Police matter . . .

. . . unless they become a suspect under counter-terrorism laws . . .

. . . but how would 'we' know if they aren't carrying any papers? . . .

max_cont
10th Jun 2010, 18:59
SASKATOON old fella, dont let the kiwi wind you up. Too much incest and sheep shagging have addled what few brain cells he has left.

Hell only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. ;)

goatface
10th Jun 2010, 19:55
It's been reported this evening (BBC R5) that the chap has mental issues.
If that little escapade didn't cure him, nothing will.

G-CPTN
10th Jun 2010, 20:02
Probably turn out that he didn't come from Vienna and was employed as a loader at LHR but was too embarrassed to admit it . . .

Lon More
10th Jun 2010, 20:05
Flying over the East End of London is depressing enough at the best of times. Imagine how it must look from the security of clinging to a main wheel strut?

I bet it was the smell of adrenalin running down his leg that gave him away :rolleyes:

bnt
10th Jun 2010, 22:15
'Cuntry is a play on the word Country'. Really? How?
It's Shakespeare:
Hamlet: Lady, shall I lie in your lap?
Ophelia: No, my lord.
Hamlet: I mean, my head upon your lap?
Ophelia: Ay, my lord.
Hamlet: Do you think I meant country matters?
--- Hamlet, Act III, Scene IIHe was writing post-Chaucer, after all.
Billy Connolly's story about the stowaway falling into Edinburgh Zoo is bought to mind.
Billy had his own theory about that ... he thinks the Jobby Weecher got a hold of the passenger and Weeched him out in to the sky. :oh:

ExSp33db1rd
11th Jun 2010, 01:57
Sort of off-thread, but ....

Ref: the unnecessary criticism of spelling mistakes ( bet most are keyboard mistakes rather than ignorance, anyway ) this has just been posted on another thread, not new, but relevant.

I cdnuolt blveiee taht I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd waht I was rdanieg. The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoatnt tihng is taht the frsit and lsat ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can still raed it wouthit a porbelm. This is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. Amzanig huh?

corsair
11th Jun 2010, 10:55
Actually my reading of it is that he wasn't actually attempting to fly to Britain. After all how could he know what the destination of the aircraft was going to be? Particularly if it was a private aircraft. If he climbed into a BA aircraft it might be a plausible that he intended to travel to Britain. If it was Ryanair on the other hand he could have ended up anywhere. :hmm:

He obviously took pot luck on his destination. Definitely mental issues. Maybe he was trying to go home. Has anyone considered that?:ok:

Ozzy
11th Jun 2010, 15:40
Here's how to board a Chinook when you are in a hurry.....

Wsq8ol9XJPY

Ozzy