Air Arabia FLR Vote

[Big Footer]

What do you think about the FLR ( fixed line roster ) ?

[gipsy moth]

Great!! It would be closer to having a life!! I hope nothing dodgy happens and gets implemented... With such a roster I'd stop my get the hell out of here plan ! (Well... for a while.. )

Vote yes NOW! Don't take for granted that it will happen!!! Many guys having their tailored roster are against it and they are doing their campaign as well..

[Tucidides]

People against the FLR???
This roster is GREAT and the guys in the commitee did a fabulous job!
My vote is YES and I don't understand how can be anyone voting no...

[gipsy moth]

I'm very happy as well! I congratulated the guys with my mail vote , they did an excellent job taking a big chunk of they time off!!

Guess who is against it.... The ones who tailor they roster, the ones that manipulate to get the best flights, the privileged ones that don't fly in week ends, the ones that only do long flights, the ones that do not fly at night, the ones that already have 5 off in a row.... Unfortunately there are maaaaany of those, and those of course they will vote no.
That's why we need all votes, even if you are leaving or about to leave!

What I found outrageous is we have to vote to get an even, fair roster, it should just be implemented, any way.... Sometimes I forget where we work and live....

PLEASE, VOTE YES, AND THANK THE GUYS NOW!!!!!!

[spanishfly69]

Can you fellows explain how is that going to work? How many days on and how many days off?
Thank you

[gipsy moth]

Check the pp presentation FLR in Smartfile, is very well done.

[spanishfly69]

Hi Gipsy,

I do not work for Air Arabia. Therefore, I cannot check the PP presentation. But I am very interested in seeing what AA is offering the pilot group. I just want to know the pattern of days on and days off..

Cheers!!!

[gipsy moth]

Sorry mate, I thought you were one of the guys who don't bother to get in Smartfile!

If the roster is approved it will be 5 in 2 off, 5 in 2 off, 5 in 6 off and so on. The 45 annual leave days would be in 7 days blocks so they can be placed in any of the 5 in slots. That means that we could get 13 days in a row 6 times a year, many other combinations would be possible. Best of all equity would be finally in order, or at least closer to it.... Seems to good to be true!

[capt-Purple]

That proposal is nonsense, what is wrong with the current roster anyway? and 13 days vacation block? are you kidding me?:\ seems like only people complaining about the current roster are those who do not like working.

[gipsy moth]

Nonsense for you capt purple and for many others, because you must have you own tailored roster and having a life. You must be living in your bubble if you don't realize how fed up most of the people are.
There is no 13 days block vacation, taking 7 days from your leave and actually sacrificing two of them you may get 13 days in a row. Why you don't bother to see the presentation?
We like to work but with equity and being able to plan our life. Most of us don't have your privileges.

Happy flights

[capt-Purple]

I have no special roster as you are suggesting, since I've been here at AA the roster has gotten much better, however I am all for the roster being sorted out where it suites the flight crew member, the real problem with the roster is the guys who want to only fly when they want to, not work during weekends, or fly in bad weather, I agree that there is a real need for more days off between works days etc.
At present I estimate that we work approx 200 days a year, with the new proposal, we'll be working approx 240 days a year, with less vacation time, less money due to less flying, and for those crew-members who have to travel to the other side of the globe to get home, won't be able to do so in 6 days or even 13 days, so other then the 6 days off block, there are no other benefits to the 5/2-5/2-5/6 roster, furthermore no one seems to be accounting for the 6-8 days training events, which will most likely be schedule during your 6 days off, so although the concept seems good, it's nonsense, do yourself a favor and vote no, because it can be much better then they are proposing. If the company is actually entertaining this idea, then we all know it's because they will be the ones benefitting from it not us.:ugh:

[gipsy moth]

Well sounds different than "what is wrong with the current roster anyway?" Maybe you don't want a call it special roster, but I'm quite sure that roster have very clear instructions to not make you flight in weekends, or at nights, or to the east on the monsoon... Maybe not to DAC, or short sectors like MCT, BAH or DOH, you may be even one of the guys that have all these PRIVILEGES, otherwise I just don't believe that your are happy with the current roster.
Many of us didn't have a weekend in months, we fly the short sectors, the DAC, fly all the time to India on the Monsoon and we have this really disturbing erratic pattern... Early morning, deep night, early morning that is so good for the body.

I don't know how you worked out this numbers but if you count about 10 days off per month plus 45 days leave you work 200 days a year not 240 as you wrote, that means we would work about the same days as now.

Training wouldn't affect much, as you said 6-8 days per year, that could affect only 2 of the 12 six days off block.

The idea didn't come from the company, I insist, I have the feeling that you don't realize how fed up people is with the current roster, maybe people don't discuss it with you because they know that you don't live with the problem.
And yes, as you said the FLR is good for the company but is also good for us, sometimes is possible.
Whatever we do, we will fly the 900 hours a year. With just a bit of common sense, anybody can see that is much healthier and safer flying averaging 75 hours a month with all these days off and leave distributed properly than flying up to 110 hours per month in a this chaotic manner. More over we will be able to plan our life months ahead, maybe you can already do that.

And as you said, certainly, depending of where your home is, you cannot go home for 6 days, or even in 13 days if it is in the other side of the Atlantic, but.... What about getting 2 of the 7 off days block of your leave (7 total) and place them on two of the 5 days on blocks? Then you would get 27 consecutive days and you could do that 3-4 times in a year, not bad at all. Where else you could do that? By the way, did you watch the presentation?

That's how it will go; Privileged ones will vote no, the ones who are not that lucky we will vote yes. If the privileged are majority we will continue with this extremely unfair roster, I hope that this is not the case. As I said before, for me is just amazing that we have to vote to get a roster with EQUITY AND TRANSPARENCY

[capt-Purple]

I am convinced and I am voting yes!

[Big Footer]

Hey fellows,
Just wondered if I was alone with my worries
1 ) FLR is based on the fact of 1 rule "you are on your own" :ugh:.
2 ) no flexibility,it's hard to swap a flight how about a hole patternhttp://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/shiner.gif .
3 ) Max .consecutive in row is done oftenly but in FLR it'll be usually(too hard).
4 ) nothing wrong in the current system only never ending shortage is major deficiency.
5 ) when it comes to training days i'd never give up a legal right never.
6 ) Financial worries .

etc ,

-It's basiclly a give & take system where they'll take more than they'll give .
-By now i've learned specially these days to protect every
single privilege that i have ( remember education fees http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/boohoo.gif) .

[gipsy moth]

1. On our own?? Why?? Now the ones who are not enjoying the PRIVILEGES are on our own!

2. Flexibility, Yes, less flexibility, at least initially, but you won't need it as much as now, because you will be able to plan your life months ahead. Is easier and fairer to plan a life around a fixed roster, than try to make changes in the present roster adapting it to your life affecting so many people and lives,

3. Max consecutive days in a row is done often???? Not for me man and not for many others!! As I said the PRIVILEGED are not interested, and looks that you are a PRIVILEGED

4. Nothing wrong about the system???? Man, just talk and listen to people!! Roster is the biggest complain in AA staff! Please, respect to the ones that are not enjoying the PRIVILEGES and for the ones that did this great work on their time off!!
Nothing wrong about the system because it works for YOU, and worst of all is that you should be aware that every time you use your PRIVILEGES, you are affecting someone else's RIGHTS.

5. Training would affect, a maximum of 11 days off that are increased with the system now 8-9 to 8-14 days per month. Please bother to attend the presentation.

6. Financial worries?? You will be making practically the same money, you should bear in mind that when you are limited you are in basic salary. Even if it would be lower it wouldn't be so significant to consider it as " financial worries"

Etc... Etc what??

Gyve and take system that they take more than they give?? What are they taking??? We will be having a life, distributing the hours and days off in a logical way that can improve or quality of life being less fatigued and flying safer being able to plan our life. And the most important reason; There will be more TRANSPARENCY AND EQUITY

[gipsy moth]

I'm glad to read that captain Purple!! :)

[Big Footer]

4. Nothing wrong about the system???? Man just talk and listen to people!! Roster is the biggest complain in AA staff! Please, respect to the ones that are not enjoying the PRIVILEGES and for the ones that did this great work on their time off!!
Nothing wrong about the system because it works for YOU, and the worst is that you must be aware that every time you use your PRIVILEGES, you are affecting at someone else's RIGHTS.


"Man" read what you wrote over there & please read my words

The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress.

Positive knowledge and proof is debatable, and with good argument, fact can be seen as fiction but With this number of "YOUs" & all the wild finger pointing and baseless assumptions follow the advice

"Keep an open mind and listen to the reasoning of the other person. Question your own opinions and show respect for the opinions of others"

remember that there’s not always a ‘right’ or a ‘wrong’, and that two points of view can both be valid .

anways the desision is made favouring FLR .
YOU DESERVE IT :ok:

[Hamid_27]

on a side note :hmm:

can anyone PM me HR's number(s)?

[gipsy moth]

What did I said that is not wright? The present roster works for you, and sorry about the size of the "YOU" don't take it personally, as I said if somebody is happy with the current roster is because has privileges, I do every month at list a DAC, some people never goes , I didn't have a weekend in 5 months, some people are getting at list 2 a month, some people don't flight at night.... And so on...
I don't find a word to describe how somebody can say "What is wrong with this roster" With all the continuous complains, is mentioned in ALL pilot meetings, the creation of the CBR, the FLR..
No baseless assumptions if you are happy with the current system is because your are getting something from it and that something always affects some one else.

Positive knowledge is not always debatable some times is crystal clear and just a matter of common sense.

And absolutely is not a matter of victory is discussion and progress, and that's what we are doing, at list somebody got to see missed points and got a clearer picture.

"Keep an open mind and listen to the reasoning of the other person. Question your own opinions and show respect for the opinions of others"

My mind is wide open, and I do listen to others, I just don't see much reasoning in your statements. Sorry if you felt like that, but I don't see any disrespect in my statements, just transmit my feelings and the ones of MOST of the people.

I'm glad to hear that is going to be implemented, I thought the voting was finishing in mid June. It will have its good sides and bad sides, but again, at list there will be more equity and transparency, and that will affect positively to most of us.

Happy flights and happy life

[Big Footer]

You Just Don’t Get It! (http://www.whatithinkabout.com/you-just-dont-get-it/)

it is precisely in this seemingly “crystal clear” state that you have to accept that you are missing part of the picture.

Don't Take Things Personally-- It's easy to assume that when someone rejects your idea or creates a roadblock.

with the "ME"s & "I"s it useless to try point out anything to "YOU" .

in this career i've passed by fellows that i'd say that they are Victims of Brainwashing . don't take it personally ;)

Enjoy Transparency and Equality .

[Big_Brother]

Hi Gentlemen,
I am a new joiner to this site. I read your argument. It poped up some queries:
1-Did you read well all details explaining the FLR?
2-Did you make a comparison between its pros and cons?
3-Are you adventurous to try something new?
4-Do you trust the designer?
5-Did you refer to him to discuss your fears?
6-Do you spread rumers, or you are sure about data and figures you mention?
Have a peaceful day :O

[Wasp7320]

Hi Guy's;

Looking for any recent update about AirArabia Morocco.

Current situation / pilot satisfaction.
DEC Recruitment. (10.000 hrs TT / 6.000 on type).
T&C's / salary package / taxes issue.
Roster. Part-time. (1 week on - 1 week off / 1 month on - 1 month off).

Contact number or @mail adress.
Application on their website for months, but no reply.

In advance Many Thanks.

Safe flights & happy landings.
Le cap & le moral, du rhum & du Havane.