Options for a "Colour Vision Unsafe" person

[grob103]

I've just been found to be CP4 at Gatwick during my Class 1 exam.

I failed the Ishihara plates, and then ran through the Holmes-Wright at high speed, thinking I had 3 seperate attempts at it. Little did I know that my 3 attempts would be run together! My advice to those who come after me: go slower!

I then managed to get the first set of lights wrong after I'd been sat in the dark for 15 minutes, but of course, 1 wrong is 1 too many.

In addition, I'm told you can't repeat the class 1 if you fail the Holmes-Wright, as you could "learn the sequence of lights".

I'm now trying to find out a way in which I can get a Class 1 valid in the UK, as I don't want to be stuck in a career I've always regarded as a stop-gap for the next 40 years.

I believe I have only one option:

Appeal the CAA's decision. Has anyone managed to do this and succeed?

I initially thought I could get my Class 1 from another JAR member state, but the Dutch Aeromedisch Institut pointed me at JAR-FCL 1.065, which is neatly summarised in question 3 of http://www.jaa.nl/faqs/jaafaqs.html#Licen

I also suspect that if I get, for example, an FAA license, I will have to undergo the JAA medical when I try to convert it to a JAA license.

Many thanks for any help offered,

grob103
Deskbound and gutted

[FatFlyer]

Sorry to hear that you are yet another victim of the silly colour resrictions. The JAA will not accept an FAA medical. The Australians and Americans have more tests which you can do. The SODA waiver allows you to get an ATPL. You are shown lights from a control tower and have to identify them correctly which is a fairer way of testing. The JAA will not accept any of these tests, it needs someone to challenge this in the European court to get it changed(as they did In Australia)
There is a suggestion that the Dutch carry out the Holmes-Wright test closer to you than the UK CAA. If you could get a Dutch medical, you could get a Dutch licence and fly on this.
Otherwise, you are restricted to instructing, or get an FAA licence and work in a country which accepts this.
I know of a couple of people who have retaken the HOlmes-Wright test and passed it.
It may be possible to cheat on the Ishihara test by learning the numbers but I don't see how you could cheat a lantern test as they can change the order of colours, and you don't have one at home to practice with.
You need a good reason before they will let you retake the test, such as a letter from the RAF medical people saying that they have tested you colour vision and found it to be normal. The CAA maintain that colour vision is genetic and therefore if you fail it once, there is no posibility of it changing.
This may be true, but colour perception does seem to vary in some people, if you read papers about it, is is clear that it is not fully understood.The ishihara test is supposed to be done in daylight, which does not happen at the CAA, which might lead to a marginal case failing, the lantern test appears far harder than the Ishihara test with the lights being very faint. after they have run through it 3 or 4 times, your eyes will be squinting, you would be stressed and find it very difficult to pass. This seems to have very little to do with correctly identifying nav lights on an aircraft.
It also seems that under JAA you are now restricted to VFR flight only which was not on the old CAA certificates. Does this mean CVD pilots with IMC or Instrument ratings can no longer use them?
Good luck

[Localiser]

Grob 103

I feel sorry for you mate. About 5 years ago I failed my Class One for the same reason and also spent 15 minutes in a dark room to fail the Holmes-Wright test again. Consequently I know exactly how you feel. I felt as if my world had fell apart - I mean, it is all I wanted to do since being a small boy.

The thing is though, I had passed the RAF tests twice (Flying Scholarship and Pilot Entry) and had no colour difficulties. Ok, I had failed the Ishihara but managed to pass the H-W. I used this to base on argument on CAA allowing me to re-test. Normally, if you fail it you aren't allowed a re-test. The reason for this is that "your colour perception will never change...".

I obtained a JAA Class One after passing the H-W test at Gatwick earlier this year. It took a great deal of letter writing, phonecalls and visits to get them to agree to a re-test. Luckily for me, the RAF got involved and wrote to the CAA on my behalf with my H-W results from Cranwell.

Incidentally, as you know, after the first 2 attempts at a set on the HW test, the optometrist sits you in the darkened room for 20 minutes to allow your cones to open up (?). This is the final attempt you are allowed. I passed at this. Close shave!

I wish the CAA/JAA would make their minds up! They are potentially ruining peoples careers and shattering peoples dreams. It seems so antiquated.... A vocational test would surely be better. As in sit you on a flight deck (sim) and get you to identify alarms, looking out at PAPI lights etc. etc. Another thing that is bad re: JAA is this; under CAA if colour deficient you could hold a restricted class 2 medical. This allowed you to hold a BCPL and do aerial work such as photographing, parachuting and more important - Instructing! Under JAA? I don't think so. If you are colour deficient that's it. Other than holding a PPL you can't do much more. At the very worst then you could get a PPL (if you haven't already) and fly as a hobby.

Good luck, I really do know how you feel. The bad news is though, they were not prepared to give me a retest at all until I got the RAF involved so if you haven't got anything like that to back your arguement you could well be fighting a losing battle. However, looking on the sunny side, my back-up plan was to go to Oz/USA and get a Class 1 and National ATPL for that country. There are ways around of getting a Visa to be able to work in that country. Even if it means marrying someone! If you are determined enough you will find a way.

Good luck and chin up ;)

Grob 103? Do you fly the Viking then?

Mail me if you want any further info. - address in profile.

LOC :)

[grob103]

FatFlyer: I've been in touch with the Dutch, and the Holmes-Wright is done at quite some distance there, too. I've also had this confirmed by someone who recently took (and failed) the Holmes-Wright there. I had originally thought you could get a Dutch medical, and then train in the UK (surely all JAA medicals are the same :) ), but that's not the case.

Localiser: I think I could pass the H-W given another chance. In the meantime, I've taken a Farnsworth-Munsell 100 Hue test (order 100 different coloured "bottle tops"), and came out colour normal. It tests something different, but the indications are that I have only a marginal defect. Interestingly, I was able to do the first half of the Ishihara in real daylight, as opposed to about 4 plates at Gatwick. Stress undoubtedly plays a big factor.

I got the following email from the very helpful lady in charge of the medical department at the Aeromedisch Institut


If you read the JAR.FCL regulations (Manual, ophtalmology chapter) you
will see that only the
following test are acceptable by the JAA as "golden standard":
- Nagel anomaloscope
- Heidelberg anomaloscope from Oculus
- Holmes-Wright Lanterntest
- Beyne Lanterntest

all other colour-vision-test are NOT acceptable by the JAA.


I'm hoping to find somewhere that can give me another shot at the Holmes-Wright, or one of the other acceptable tests.

Does anyone know if, in the event I can't pass the H-W, but can pass one of the others, whether the CAA would accept that? I've spent "some time" on hold at FCL without getting through to anyone yet.

My backup plan is remarkably similar to Localiser's: Go to Canada/USA/S.Africa for an ATPL. :)

Localiser: Indeed, it's the first aircraft I went solo in, and still my favourite. A little pondorous compared to the single-seaters, but very comfy, with lots of room for lunch in the back!

Cheers,

grob103

[Yosser]

grob103,

There was a previous thread on this subject, that made me rush to Holland.

The Holmes-Wright is at the same distance as Gatwick, and it is NOT a JAA medical.

They also inform the CAA that you have failed, so be honest on the application form if you go.

Good luck, been there, know how it feels.

[actionman]

Yosser,

Hope you're well.

Where did you get your FAA Class one done in the UK?

Can you let me know by email ? Same address as before.

Cheers