New JSP 752 Rates!?

[Grimweasel]

New rates come into force this month for HDT travel that equate to roughly a 25% reduction; this will affect many! Check the JSP 752.

(Previous post deleted for 'service' reasons - oops!)

[R SCANDAL]

Grimweasel,
Me too. I spoke with A1 at Air and they forwarded the signal which "justifies" the reduction in HDT. The new rate has been set to the same as that which is used by civilians. Not that they have to upsticks and move every three years. It goes on to say that the MOD are likely to place a high priority on support to home ownership. Easy answer - rather than you busting yourself to provide family stability; put the kids in school and claim tens of thousands in boarding school allowance, or move and claim disturbance and live in subsidised quarters, hopefully SSFA.
I know this allowance is generous compared to civvie counterparts but I thought it was supposed to make up for the pain of being posted every couple of years. And yes I believe boarding school allowance will be discontinued for new service joiners eventually.

[CRM Monkey]

I don't think civvies normally get "Home to Duty". The Tax Man considers this a benefit in kind and would tax it anyway so it seems strage to compare it to civvy rates. That said, civvies don't tend to get posted so can choose where they work and live.

[Finger Poking]

Can anyone post the previous and the new rate tables ?

With 46 Miles eachway, I presume I'm about to lose lose.

[peppermint_jam]

31.2 pence per mile reduced to 25 pence per mile.

[Finger Poking]

I thought the current rate was .37p a Mile?

How can these delinquents do this? So for the majority of the RAF who get HTD, the last Pay Rise has just been cancelled out.

I'm glad to be going soon, leadership (Sorry), supposed leadership or the distinct lack of is really becoming boring.

[spekesoftly]

I thought the current rate was .37p a Mile?


Now that is one helluva reduction! ;)

[Grimweasel]

The rate changes as you go down the table - it depends on how far your daily commute is. Before anyone drops themselves in it, remember the election Purdah rules as given on the MoD website - best to save any rants until after May 6! I'm sitting here going red with vexation too!! :)

[Finger Poking]

Before anyone drops themselves in it, remember the election Purdah rules as given on the MoD website - best to save any rants until after May 6! I'm sitting here going red with vexation too!!

TOSH !!

I'll tell you now, I won't be voting for that Sweaty Sock, Cycloptic Unelected Fat TW*T !!

Tory is the ONLY hope the Armed Forces of this country have.

[cazatou]

Off topic I know BUT - what would another 5 years of GB as Prime Minister do for retention?

Last man leaving and light switches spring to mind.

[MATELO]

I'll tell you now, I won't be voting for that Sweaty Sock, Cycloptic Unelected Fat TW*T !!


Not quite sure who you mean chap.:D :D

[Grimweasel]

The last time I checked, PPRUNE was not a MoD run website, or do you really think purdah is intended to prevent individuals discussing changes to rates because it might affect the outcome of the election ?

BGG - Understood; what I was referring to was my earlier post that I edited. I may not have just stuck to the rates discussion and went 'off piste' before a friend reminded me of said purdah. Deleted any political reference.

[Melchett01]

Before anyone drops themselves in it, remember the election Purdah rules as given on the MoD website - best to save any rants until after May 6! I'm sitting here going red with vexation too!!

This has got nothing to do with politics and everything to do with those spineless bean counters masquerading as our 'leaders' that are slowly destroying everything good about the RAF.

Combined with the pay cut I took when I came out to the sand pit, this really is just another demostration of how much they really value people.

Has anyone else noted how the much vaunted Investors in People status many RAF stations were so proud to boast of holding has disappeared in recent years. Continuing to push that one would even be too much for this shower.

[Robby NL]

We have had much debate on this very subject in the office, as the great Abbeywood move starts for ESAir. One area for discontent is that if the rates have been adjusted in line with the 'civvy world' how is it that the Civil Service Rates have gone up?

Furthermore with more and more of the Married Accompanied Servicemen, going to Abbeywood, being cast further and further away from Bristol how long before they have to start laying on buses from Colerne, Hullavington etc etc? :ugh:

[VinRouge]

Cananyone confirm if this applies to HTD Public as well as private?

[Sloppy Link]

The rate is the same for private/public, difference is the "contribution" the inividual has to pay (9 miles v 3 miles?)

[lonsdale2]

It's not just HTD where the rates have been slashed.
It also applies to MMA - the old 31.2 pence per mile has now also been reduced to 25 pence per mile.
When the taxman openly agrees that it costs in the order of 44p per mile to run a car, how can the military rate be reduced to 25 pence?
Does this mean that everyone now has to submit a claim form for the difference? How is this saving money? I guess they are just relying on folk not bothering to claim their rightful amount.

[Jumping_Jack]

....added to the reduction in subsistence allowance.....

[Greenielynxpilot]

This is yet another cost-cutting exercise by a bankrupt government department that simply cannot afford to pay its people what it once promised them (no different to BA and its cabin crew).

The MOD is hoping that most people will be either a) too dumb, or b) too lazy to work out what this means for them. I have calculated that my disposal income will be reduced by just under £1000 per year as a result of this rate change ... but then I commute just over 50 miles each way. Most people will lose less than this, and most of them won't notice or care enough to make a fuss.

It is extremely sad that an organisation that once prided itself on looking after its people now unashamedly resorts to cheating some of those people as a means to save money. I know the MOD is broke, and that body armour for the troops on the front line has to be paid for somehow, but it is still a depressing example of flawed reasoning and moral weakness by our leaders that an utterly arbitrary metric - in this case the distance between a serviceperson's family home-base and their (current) place of work - has become a means to discriminate between the rewards package offered to some over that offered to others.

Another nail in the coffin ....

[VinRouge]

They have a major problem on their hands .

We have already had the private sector recession, the public sector troubles are still to come, and I think they know it. Some will have the attitude to "mind your arse doesnt get cought with the door slamming on the way out" but if we see 2, potentially 3 years of public sector pay freezes combined with high inflation and cut work expenses, we are going to see a pretty mammoth head for the exits. I dont think 50K post tax will keep them in either, as after the pay freeze, will it be worth sticking round for with an expanding private sector?

We all know what is happening with the airlines. Many of the boomer generation, senior airline pilots are set to retire over the next 5 years, whilst the mob will be looking to cut back. If I were a betting man, I forsee us bleeding too many people to the private sector over the next 3 years and being back in the situation we found ourselves in during 2004-05.

The scale of the deficit is horrendous. We are going to have to take some pain, of that I have no doubt. But by cutting expenses such as Home to duty will do liitle else than push people out faster than they already are planning to go. Fine at the mo with people planning to stay, but command should know, loyalty is a 2 way street, and after 9 years in, I am starting to see there is a wider world than getting dick danced around by poor conditions and relatively poor pay compared to the private sector.

[FJ2ME]

:mad::mad::mad::mad:

Are these robbing b@$tards for real?! The price of fuel has never been so high, and they dock me 23%?!! I could punch someone. If you're based away from your permanent home, its a disgrace the calcs only expect you to go home twice a month, but now the rates don't even cover the fuel costs alone!! If i was a civvy, they would have given me a company car, or a company car allowance, or paid me some proper relocation. This is an absolute disgrace.

Taking money off us is no way to save money because the government has f**ked the budgets. All the HTD and GYH allowance in the system isn't even going to cover the money wasted on one single ballsed up procurement project. My advice, take it out of the pensions of the people who left us with such successes as JPA, and BOCS or who committed us to eye-watering PFI deals favouring companies that they magically become directors of shortly after retirement.

This stinks and its time for a strike I say.Maybe someone could trump up some ficticious ash cloud so we could all down tools... ;)

[Grimweasel]

Yep, I'm down £100 per month too - cheers. Nice to know that we are being shafted so that Fred Tw@t features from RBS can retire on his multi-million pound pension at the expense of the tax payer and honest military types alike. This stinks like a post curry and beer night bender fart in a lift. Kents, the lot of em!

[Pontius Navigator]

It's not just HTD where the rates have been slashed.
It also applies to MMA - reduced to 25 pence per mile.

taxman openly agrees that it costs in the order of 44p per mile

how can the military rate be reduced to 25 pence?

Does this mean that everyone now has to submit a claim form for the difference? How is this saving money? I guess they are just relying on folk not bothering to claim their rightful amount.

25p/mile is supposed to be the public transport rate. 40p/mile is the treasury capped rate. If you were paid 44p/mile then you would be taxed on the extra 4p.

The 25p rate is what CS got. It is also quite generous compared with some civilian companies.

As you imply, you can claim the difference back in tax. The difference of 15p for a 40% tax payer is 6p giving you a total payment of 31p/mile. As you also correctly state, many people would not bother.

There is another claim many people are unaware of too. If your subsistence costs came to say £35/day and you were reimbursed £25 you can claim tax relief on that £10 too. You already keep the receipts so that should not be too onerous.

[VinRouge]

PN, only on business travel. Cant get any tax breaks for the commute to work I am afraid.

[Could be the last?]

What a bunch of C^%ts........ My commute is 56m each way, which means i'm down a considerable amount.

Gordon Brown and the Labour Party, thank you for your support, expect the same on the 6th of May.

[Pontius Navigator]

PN, only on business travel. Cant get any tax breaks for the commute to work I am afraid.

VR, read my reply to Lonsdale. He said MMR has also been cut to 25p. My reply also refered specifically to the PTR rate and the 40p rate and subsistence. Nowhere did I refer to HTD.

My point stands: for business travel you may claim tax relief for any valid and receipted expenditure over the MOD capped rates. Clearly for your additional hotel rates you cannot claim the Jackie Smith extras :}

[BEagle]

Whatever happened to the golden rule of looking after your subordinates meals, mail and money?

The treasury figure of 40p per mile has been fixed for years, despite spiralling fuel costs, vehicle excise duty, servicing costs.....

However, considering fuel costs alone, I get about 27 mpg because I don't drive some diesel grotbox. That works out at 5.94 miles per litre, or 0.17 litres per mile. Even with fuel at £1.30 per litre (thanks to the thievery of nuLabor), that works out at 22p per mile.

Of course there are other mileage-related costs to consider, such as tyre wear, servicing and perhaps insurance. So your new rate will barely cover fuel costs if you drive anything half-decent, particularly if your commute includes a substantial element of urban driving.

[On_Loan]

However, you can claim relief on a commute to a temporary place of work:

"It can include travel to a temporary work place but it doesn't include:

normal travel between home (or anywhere that is not a workplace) and your permanent workplace
private travel " temp defined as less than 2 years, so if you have a short tour.....

[peppermint_jam]

OK, so the rate has been cut to 25 pence p/m to fall in line with the rate that the CS get. But I have a question, do they pay back the first 9 miles or so like we do?

[3 bladed beast]

I plan to go into work at least 4 days less a month to make up the difference!!

Just another blow, combined with the morning of work I just did on JPA, trying to justify that I actually can spend 30 pounds a day on food and drink whilst away.

Love the I.E 50% reduction for being abroad too.

It's ok though, OJAR time, when no doubt i'm going to be told that I have to take on MORE secondary duties and give MORE to the armed forces.

Right, off to read AP1....RISE!!! Love it. :ugh:

[Pontius Navigator]

I plan to go into work at least 4 days less a month to make up the difference!!

What are you going to do come February then? :}

[Pontius Navigator]

So your new rate will barely cover fuel costs if you drive anything half-decent, particularly if your commute includes a substantial element of urban driving.

BEages, you may not remember but before the brun one clunked his iron fist the higher rate, for tax purposes, had 2 rates - 40p/mile for mere mortals and 63p/mile for plutocrats. Also, at that time, Servicemen could not claim tax relief on the difference.

By a flook, I cashed in my Barclaycard £1000 cash back and splashed on on a Modeo Ghia X with a 2.5l engine. This coincided with a change of tax rules so I could claim tax relief on about 38p/mile. This also coincided with about 1,500 miles of PTR claims on resettlement etc. A very nice lady at the IR tried to recover my tax relief until I pointed out that the rules had changed :}.

Clearly a reasonably generous 63p/mile in 1999 compares unfavourably with a meager 40p/mile 10 years later. Talk about stealth taxes.

Remember the other one - no car tax on cars over 25 years old? Gordon didn't recant on that, he merely changed the rules to apply to cars registered before 1972 or thereabouts.

[Whenurhappy]

I'm currently on duty in the US staying at a popular range of hotels used by CHBS (or whatever it is called). To have one shirt, pair of pants and a pair of sox laundered (ie normally daily wear I suggest) costs $16 ie GBP10. So at the end of this three week trip (yes, I know, sheer hell) I am down by about GBP100 just in laundry charge. If I include the drycleaning of one suite and a pair of uniform trousers, that jumps to GBP150.

I'ver been collecting the laundry tickets to send into ACDS S&P to reinforce the point (copied my MP). It sounds trifiling compared with what our lad are suffering in theatre, however this happens to be my job iso operations. Within the calander year, I'll be about GBP500 out of pocket in reasonable laundry charges alone. If we then look at daily subsitance charges...well, the total goes into the 1000s pa.

Yep, the troops get everything that we need....

[vecvechookattack]

To have one shirt, pair of pants and a pair of sox laundered (ie normally daily wear I suggest) costs $16 ie GBP10. So at the end of this three week trip (yes, I know, sheer hell) I am down by about GBP100 just in laundry charge. If I include the drycleaning of one suite and a pair of uniform trousers, that jumps to GBP150.

Or you could dhoby it yourself..? Just a viewpoint but most people would do their own washing and not expect the taxpayer to fork out.

http://www.superdrug.com/content/ebiz/superdrug/invt/549253/549253_l.jpg



Why don't you nip down to the local corner shop...spend £1 on a bottle of travel wash and then save the tax payer £499 per year..... Are you looking to become a Member of Parliament ????

[BEagle]

For trips of about a week, most people can take enough clothes with them to avoid excess baggage fees on the flight.

For longer than that, you either use the astoundingly expensive hotel laundry service, or a bottle of dhobi-gloop and the room bath. Than wait days for your clothes to dry....:\

For 3 weeks, it would be a bit much to rely on having to use dhobi-gloop - and the laundry charges would be somewhat excessive. So a reasonable combination of both methods would seem the way to go. Socks, underwear, most shirts - dhobi-gloop. Other stuff - laundry.

Sometimes it's almost cheaper to find the nearest store and but some new socks etc than it is to get your own laundered.....:hmm:

[philrigger]

;)

For trips to the states I have always managed to find a launderette close by so that I can wash and dry the clothes then I iron them in my room with the free hotel iron.

[Pontius Navigator]

You would be able to claim relief on the FULL cost of laundry and dry cleaning services.

An officer has a standard tax relief of £367 pa (well it was) which is deducted from his gross pay (her allowance is greater, about £418 iirc). In UK this is expected to cover laundry, dry cleaning, replacement etc. All for £92 per year.

If you are overseas and drawing LOA the additional costs should be factored in to LOA. However if you are on rates, and the you have additional laundry costs for both civilian and uniform clothing, you should be able to claim an element towards their maintenance. Be realistic and prepared to argue your case if the tax man challenges you.

On realism, how often do you have a suit or uniform dry cleaned? My work trousers were machine washable!

[Could be the last?]

On loan,

So to clarify, if I am at a base for less than 2 years it is classed as temp? and, therefore, I can claim the tax back on my HDT?

If I am on GYH(M) because I am on a course for a couple of months outside of the HDT range, I can do the same?

[McDuff]

It also applies to MMA - the old 31.2 pence per mile has now also been reduced to 25 pence per mile.
When the taxman openly agrees that it costs in the order of 44p per mile to run a car, how can the military rate be reduced to 25 pence?
Does this mean that everyone now has to submit a claim form for the difference? How is this saving money? I guess they are just relying on folk not bothering to claim their rightful amount.

It's extremely annoying, but remember to claim the difference in your tax return.

[McDuff]

There is another claim many people are unaware of too. If your subsistence costs came to say £35/day and you were reimbursed £25 you can claim tax relief on that £10 too. You already keep the receipts so that should not be too onerous.

Drat! I didn't know that!

[ZuluMike]

An officer has a standard tax relief of £367 pa (well it was) which is deducted from his gross pay (her allowance is greater, about £418 iirc).


Pontius: the female officer tax relief was not to my knowledge different from the male one. Female officers never received the 'hosiery allowance' that the female troops did. Incidentally, I understand it has been removed this year.

No, I haven't suddenly started wearing hosiery to work (that you can see), but the Marines I worked with thought a hosiery allowance was a top idea.

[Pontius Navigator]

Zulu Mike, trust me, the female officers did indeed have a higher allowance. I don't know what the present figures are but I shall ask she who should know.

[Pontius Navigator]

McDuff, if you still have the receipts and the JPA printouts, it is not too late to talk nicely with the taxman. The least he can say is No.

Before you do so you must ensure that the potential reward is worth the subsequent hassle.