Cpl Exams/study

[Green_pilot_79]

Just a quick thread im getting ready for my CPL Exams and wanted to know if anyone has studied through Bob tait. I have so far to PPL and seems to have enough info in there im just wondering if his CPL Books will cover enough information for the CPL exams. Up to date i have yet to fail any exam as i have had the right preperation:ok:.

Only asking as i did read somewhere not sure if it was on this forum or another that Bob Tait may lack some CPL knowledge in his books :cool:???

[SM227]

No, you will be fine with bob tait books, simple and to the point, questions similar to the real ones, best and only study material needed for BAK through to ATPL MET, good luck with the exams :ok:

[Pilotette]

GP...as SM227 has already said, Bob Tait is definitely the way to go for CPL theory (there have been numerous threads about this), the only exams you will need a bit of extra material is for Human Factors (you will need the TEM stuff off the CASA website) and for AGK I would recommend reading the Aviation Theory Centre book too as not everything was covered by Bob.
Hope this helps and good luck! :ok:

[The Green Goblin]

I self studied with BT and found it quite good.

Took me a while to nut out Echo though :{

I still browse through them occasionally out of pure interest!

[White and Fluffy]

Bob Taits books are not worth the paper they are written on, is my personal opinion. Anyone that suggests they are good has not had to use their knowledge in an aviation environment. Yeah, the questions are like the real ones and if you memorise the answers you will pass the CASA exam, but there is so much more to it then that. Bob Tait has dumbed down the theory and uses terms to make it simple and easy to read. He has written the books to cover the bare minimum sections of the syllabus. The number of pilots that now don't know the basic aerodynamic definitions is amazing. His BAK book leaves so much out, it doesn’t even introduce the different loading charts and his air law chapter must assume that all students have a VFG as it is also very light on for content.

Spend the money and get the Trevor Thom (Aviation Theory Centre) books. They are more in depth, harder to read and don't have as many questions, but at the end of the day you will pass the exams because you know your stuff, not because you have memorized the answers.

If you can find a copy of Dyson Van Hollands books they are gold! But have been out of print for a while now I think.

[Led Zep]

Problem is, White and Fluffy, the exams are in such a format that the only thing that counts is your answer. Not whether you can apply the right technique to to the question, just the answer. If in doubt, pick C. :ugh:
The current exam format is not how it should be done, in my opinion.

I quite agree though, Trevor Thom's publications are excellent as they give you information that goes above and beyond the minimum required to pass the exams.

Oh, for Human Factors the best book to read is an older publication by Tony Wilson entitled, Air Craft: Human Performance and Limitations. You may still be able to get it through the Airservices Australia Publications Centre.

[PPRuNeUser0163]

Like some others here i use both the ATC books and Tait.

I found particularly in Aerodynamics and AGK Tait simply didn't cover it all and where he did it was to a bare minimum- classic examples being different tail structures (Ie balance tabs, anti balance, aerodynamic) where there was maybe a few lines for each- tested heavily in asl.

Doubling up on the books may cost an extra 200-250 or so but if you don't thats possibly a resit of an exam or two :ok:

[Homesick-Angel]

Ive used BT most of the way and done 4 out 7 CPL tests..No trouble so far..What I have found helpful is to use the ATC books as well to beef up my knowledge on a given subject as BT can be good enough to get you a pass, but may not cover the subject in great detail..

If all you want is a pass BT will do the job.

[White and Fluffy]

Here is an example from another thread that highlights the ideas or lack of knowledge that I am seeing more and more in new pilots. (don’t get me started on instructors that teach or proliferate these ideas, I think it’s the blind leading the blind some times)

“It doesnt matter whether you have 2 pax or 50 pax, Glide distance is UNAFFECTED by WEIGHT.”

As has been said by others, Bob Tait will get you to pass the exam, only just, nothing more, nothing less. This may be great in the short term but will bring you unstuck when you go to get your first job and the owner/chief pilot is a GA veteran that starts asking all kinds of hard questions about aircraft systems, air law and met. They are going to expect a lot more then just enough knowledge to get 70% in an exam. Or when you’re at an outpost and the internet (if you have it) goes down, do you think you’ll be a able to get an idea of what the weather is going to do off the synoptic chart on the back page of the local paper? If you walked into a hanger and asked for oil could you answer the lame when he asks what type?

What I am getting at is that CPL exams are not like high school history, this is information that you will need to know and you will need to know it well to be a good pilot and to get the jobs that you want. When you have X number of passengers sitting behind you and red lights start flashing, they are going to expect that you know your stuff and can deal with it. In my opinion Bob Tait does not give this level of knowledge and a lot of new pilots I am seeing do not have this level of knowledge. Ask a new CPL to explain an impulse coupling and you will get a rude shock, mention a Vortex Generator or boundary layer and their eyes start to glaze over.

At the end of the day an aircraft is not unlike a truck, it is a piece of machinery and you need to know how to work it. If you asked a truck driver about their rig I bet you they could tell you how everything runs and how to fix it. That is what I expect of budding new GA pilots that are about to head out and get jobs flying into all kinds of far away places.

Anyway I have managed to rant my way off topic. My words of advise are that you are about to become a professional pilot, this is knowledge that you will use everyday of your life and may one day save your life. So do yourself a favour and study hard, learn it all and want to learn more then just 70%. That passion for knowledge is what sets pilots apart from great aviators!

[The Green Goblin]

Ask a new CPL to explain an impulse coupling

Thats because the newer stuff mainly use lycoming and have shower of sparks :E

[Pilotette]

I'm confused :confused: You both state that glide distance is UNaffected by weight and I agree too, so why the hostility? Where's the love? :O

[White and Fluffy]

I'm not up for an argument either, just using this example to point out the lose of knowledge due to simplified text books.

As some homework, have a look into why gliders carry water as ballast on cross country flights. Its very interesting and will help to increase your understanding on the implications for your powered aircraft.

This is real world knowledge that you guys need to know and backs up my opinion that some text books are not worth the paper they are written on.

P.S. Don't trust everything you find via google, it could be written by someone with the same or less knowledge then yourself!

[Led Zep]

http://www.inquisitr.com/wp-content/wikipedia-cat.jpg


The more books you have, the better off you are.

[Aeroo]

I, like others on this thread, used both ATC books and Bob Tait. I read the ATC books first (I feel they set out the subject matter in a more logical order), and then I read the Bob Tait books to back up my knowledge (and if I didn't understand something in the ATC books, it was usually explained a different way in Bob Tait).

Good luck with the study! :)

[Delta Oscar Charlie]

I agree with nkand and some others on here. Purchase both, or at least borrow one set and buy the others. BT comes up short in a few areas however the ATC books go in far to deep for someone at the start of learning, particularly anyone self studying.. I found if I couldn't grasp it , I'd have a look at BT's book and it would be explained much simpler. Then when I got a grasp on it I'd go back to ATC books and it would all make more sense and you can broaden your knowledge on the subject from there..

[The Green Goblin]

At the end of the day a pass is a pass.......

The ATO will sort out if you know what is required when you do your KDRs and are quizzed on the CPL test items.

[avi8ar]

so, in conclusion, glide distance is unchanged with weight, but glide speed will decrease with a decreased aircraft weight...

[Roxy_Chick_1989]

Yes avia8tor. Correct.

[RWD5]

vortex generator and boundary layer are both covered in bob tait's book CPL aerodynamics. :hmm:
i found the bob tait books to be good and passed all CPL theory 1st go. good luck :ok:

[The Green Goblin]

just to make it clear:

Glide distance is UNAFFECTED by WEIGHT

In a NIL wind situation YES.

With a headwind a light aeroplane will not glide as far as a heavy aeroplane and with a tailwind a light aeroplane will glide further than a heavy aeroplane.

So you are incorrect, glide distance is affected by weight. :)

[Masif Eego]

Hey GG, your not listening.........:eek:

Bob Tait's books say......... blah blah blah blah.............., and I passed all me CPL's.........:rolleyes:

Seriously, and I agree with White and Fluffy, one can get a helluva lot better than Bob Tait's books when it comes to studying theory subjects

[The Green Goblin]

Some of the experienced folk are sitting back and having a bit of a giggle at this thread.

I don't mind though having a bite every now and then. Roxy chick is an expert on pay and conditions in the major airlines and a resource of industry and aviation knowledge so this could become an interesting conversation.

Roxy chick, I suggest you have a read of mechanics of flight by A.C Kermode. Handling the big jets is also mandatory reading as is aerodynamics for naval aviators.

I also remember in my briefs I would draw a diagram for the student and explain that in NIL wind an aircraft would glide the same distance light or heavy. I would then introduce wind and explain their effects.

Pretty basic stuff really.

[Dangnammit]

I used BT's books for my cpl exams. I do have Trev Thom's books too, so I could reference back to them if I needed to.

I found that BT's performance book had too much info that wasn't relevant.
I used ATC & BT texts to assist me in some atpl's too, namely Met (obviously not high level) & HF.

Really, the more books you have, the better you will be. Also helps for instructor rating too.

[Jazzy78910]

White and Fluffy:
There are a lot of things in life that cannot be learned from any text, no matter how well it's written...

It must be expected that even a fresh CPL with 100% pass marks on all tests would still not know a LOT of things about the aviation game until s/he actually starts learning on-the-job.

Experience is king, passing the CPL theory is a "Licence to Learn" in the real world.

IMHO

[j3pipercub]

Bwahahaha, Roxy got owned again, and on a subject she's already tried to argue... Thanks, that made my night.

[john_tullamarine]

If you can find a copy of Dyson Van Hollands books

probably thinking about Val Dyson-Holland ?

[Blin]

D-H traing books are still available. Very comprehensive.

[CazbahKid]

Is anyone starting their CPL subjects in the Sydney area? I'm about to start and find it easier to study with someone so you can bounce questions off each other.

PM me if you're keen.