Does a CPL pass "secure" my ATPL examinations?

[Poose]

Hello!

I have just recently passed eight of the ATPL examinations. It is my intention to sit the final six at the end of this year. My question surrounds a concern I have regarding the funding of my CPL/IR.

In the event of a theoretical 'worst case' scenario whereby I did not have access to sufficient funds to complete the IR within the three years allowed post ATPL exam passes, but had passed the CPL.

So... situation is I have a CPL but no IR and the three years permitted have lapsed. Where does that leave me with regards to the ATPL passes?

I've heard several variations, along the lines of the fact that the CPL 'secures' nine of the subjects, meaning I would have to resit five of the exams. Not great but bearable. :{

However, I've heard even worse...
The CPL does not secure any of the exams and despite a valid CPL I would have to resit all fourteen subjects before I could do an IR.

Could I have an informed opinion? :E

Thanks in advance! :ok:

[Linda Mollison]

If you do not pass your CPL AND your IR wihin 36 months of the pass date of your last written exam you lose your ATPL credits.

If you have got your CPL issued within that 36 months, but not your IR, you keep your CPL, but in order to undertake an IR you would have to, as a minimum, do the 7 IR theoretical exams.

However, this does not give you a frozen ATPL so you will not be able to fly for the airlines. To do that you would need to retake all 14 ATPL exams.

Linda Mollison

['India-Mike]

It's actually 36 months to the end of the month that the last exam was taken, not 36 months from the date of the last exam. LASORS Sec D p7

[mad_jock]

There are quite a few people doing Single engine IR's for excatly those reasons just now.

Another method is to go FAA and get there IR as this also keeps your credits valid.

[moona]

So an FAA IR keeps the exam credits valid - That is good news :ok: do you have a reference for that?

[clear prop!!!]

mmmm...I'll buy the SE IR bit, but my understanding was that modular IR had to be completed within a JAA member state and that includes the skills test.

I could well be wrong!

In addition to have an FAA IR issued you would need to pass their written papers would you not?.....more exams...more cash, all be it they are computer based with an instant score.....now there's progress!

Can't see how the FAA route could help as it would add even more financial grief not to mention time and effort.

[Pitch+Power]

Another method is to go FAA and get there IR as this also keeps your credits valid.

I highly doubt that

[Dr Eckener]

Have a look at LASORS J1.7

If still in doubt, contact the CAA.

[BillieBob]

LASORS J1.7 does not suggest that issue of an FAA IR(A) 'secures' the ATPL exams.

JAR-FCL 1.005(a)(2) states "Whenever licences, ratings, authorisations, approvals or certificates are mentioned in JAR–FCL, these are meant to be licences, ratings, authorisations, approvals or certificates issued in accordance with JAR–FCL. In all other cases these documents are specified as e.g. ICAO or national licences."

LASORS J1.7 is a direct copy of JAR-FCL 1.495 and, since no specific mention is made of ICAO or any National Authority, IR(A) means JAA IR(A). The idea that the issue of a foreign IR could 'secure' the JAA TK exams is ludicrous.

[GBB]

Poose,

How about you leave one easy exam for later so you can stretch the time frame of 18 months to maximum. Take the last easy exam in month 16 or 17 from the date you had the first one, just incase you need a retest.

[mad_jock]

Sorry my fault. missed out the Afterwards.

After obtaining your JAR IR rating the continued holding of a FAA IR or any other ICAO IR will mean that your ATPL credits will remain valid.

[SimJock]

This has to be one of the top things to think about before embarking on a modular course, 'Will I finish it within time?'

I found myself in the same position, you think you have loads of time after perhaps suprisingly passing the ATPL exams first go, but then weather, money and various factors conspire against you, courses drag out, things take longer than expected. I had the CPL test passed and then started the IR on a part time basis because I had to work (couldn't get more leave after the CPL course even though I had the money). Through the IR training the ATPL exam passes expiry date loomed large and began to affect my concentration, I eventually realised that I was not going to finish the IR training (let alone the test), so I let it go. I just couldn't face doing the ATPL exams again, with the repeat expense, another 2 week brush up course, time off etc.

I made sure I got the Blue CPL licence issued, though without an IR its a bit of a chocolate teapot !

[Axel.]

I am of a similar position. I have all my ATPL theoretical knowledge exams and they expire in March 2011. I have most of the hours required under my belt, it's just a case of finishing and booking into for a CPL and IR course. Reason I've been holding off is due to the present situation with jobs etc.

I was told after groundschool that the theoretical knowledge exams remain valid to IR. I interpreted this as 36 months validity on the exams unless the IR is completed within this time, in which case they would still remain valid after said time had passed.

Can anyone explain confidently to me whether I am mistaken and this also refers to completing the CPL aswell as the IR in the allotted time?

Many thanks.

[mcgoo]

You have to complete both CPL and IR to secure the ATPL exams, the comment about them being valid to the IR means that the exams remain valid for 7 years after the last IR validity date.

[Axel.]

Thank you for your prompt reply! I thought as much after reading this thread. I'd better get the ball rolling again and finish the CPL and IR by the end of the year!

Fun times ahead!!!

[mcgoo]

No, the ATPL exams are valid for 7 years from the last IR validity date.

[Poose]

Therefore...

If I did my IR before I did my CPL, I could gain an extra seven years validity from the date of the IR pass?

Am I reading you guys, right?
I do know of some people who do the IR first and indeed some schools that don't discourage it. Is this the reason why, then?

[mcgoo]

No, you have to complete both the CPL and IR within the 36 months from last exam pass, then the ATPL theory is valid for 7 years from the last IR validity date.