syringes and security..

[golfyankeesierra]

After an english journalist passed through security with an syringe, calling Schiphol "Terror airport" (dailyexpress article (http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/149412)), again a person has been caught at Schiphol with a syringe but now he was in transit only and apparently carried it through security on his way from the UK.

BTW They found it after he was arrested for shoplifting in the taxfree area and his bag was searched. news article (in dutch) (http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/5809912/__Let_op_Schiphol_met_spuit_gepakt__.html)

payback:}

[old-timer]

What about diabetic syringes ?
from personal experience in my family this is an issue that needs to be considered carefully from all genuine medical aspects, please don't raise the alarm unnecessarily; consider all aspects.

[Solar]

So all we need is a diabetic bomber or a normal one who can forge a doctor's letter!!!

[radeng]

My insulin capsules are only 3ml, so there's not exactly a lot of liquid....the needle is 9mm long. The only place I've had problems was in transit through BKK. 'Why have you got insulin?' 'How much have you got?' 'Why have you got this much?' 'What flight are you on?' 'What flight did you arrive on?''What nationality are you?' 'What is your passport number?'

The first three questions are pretty stupid really - the answers are going to be obvious. Why did they worry anyway? Is insulin illegal in Thailand?

[west lakes]

Carrying on from radeng
Yes 3ml is the size of the insulin pens (9mm needles? I use 8mm which are more comforable) the pens are designed to a maximum dosage of .60ml so quantities are low.
I have carried them for years, the needles being banned since 9/11 anyway. (and at one time proper syringes)
Only been asked for doctors letter 3 times in 10 years
MAN, Sanford in the weeks following the shoe bomb scare and GIB ast year.
Most security recognse the devices and the capsules and as long as they are declaed don't question.

Calling it a syringe in the newwspaper article is stretching it a bit though. When closed up it looks, as designed, like a pen and is called a Novopen!
(radeng, got hold of a Novopen 4 the other week - a much better design than the 3)

The biggest problem I foresee is a diabetic injecting themself in the stomach, as I do, onboard and some panicy passenger reacting. No I ain't gonna use the loo to do this for hygene reasons!

[ExXB]

With both 24 hour basal and short term insulins. I've got them with my blood sugar testing stuff in a pencil case type small bag (actually an old KLM amenities kit bag).

Some years ago I gave up declaring them - most weren't interested and one wasn't going to let me on the plane with them (long story, but his supervisor overruled him).

So they go through the x-ray in my carryon and nobody ever notices, or seems to care. This includes traveling from Canada to the US a week after undiebomber and back to Europe from Los Angeles via Heathrow.

On this trip I was even using my Frio (http://www.friouk.com/) cooling bags - which are water activated gels (You soak them for 10 minutes, they absorb the water, and 'cool' as the water evaporates).

At Heathrow I usually ask "Insulin, In or Out"? and have always been told IN.

[golfyankeesierra]

Hi,
I totally agree with the need to carry stuff for medical purposes, but you cannot fault the authorities for dealing with it as it has played its part in a near disaster.

I also wonder if it is at all possible to check for them, especially when the needle is taken out of the syringe.

But the reason I posted it is that I found it mildly ironic that it was an English airport in the latest occasion, while SPL was called "terror airport" for the same reason in the British press.:hmm:

[1DC]

Going to Oz this week and Mrs 1DC has 3 months supply of insulin in frio bags, always been ok before but she always worries a bit until she is airside..

[Tinwacker]

For info my company still carries a 'sharps box' onboard all aircraft so that needles can hygenically and safely be thrown away, just ask the crew for assistance.

TW

[radeng]

ExXB

>So they go through the x-ray in my carryon and nobody ever notices, or seems to care.<

Pretty well the same with me on insulin and blood testing stuff.

Medicine in bottles greater than 100ml seems OK too, provided it has the pharmacists label and patients name on it. I was asked to taste it at Heathrow, but the problem was that with a daily dose in drops and dangerous to exceed, that wasn't possible.

But why this insistence on removing belts? Are braces (US suspenders) OK?

[Jarvy]

My brother-in-law came out to visit the US last year and had no problems with his insulin and his 'pens', carried a doctors note and was never asked.
Why belts? Easy, the 911 bombers had knifes hidden behind large belt buckles.

[radeng]

Jarvy,

So if they had knives behind belt buckles, what is to stop them having knives in their underpants? Taped to the inside of the thighs? If they were ceramic, the metal detector wouldn't find them.

I am convinced that until and unless profiling is introduced, the security people are fighting a difficult battle.

It would have been cheaper, considering the cost of security emasures and the cost in time to travellers and workers, to pay Al quieda and the Taliban $100 billion to go away, with a threat to nuke anywhere they were found if they didn't. And carry the threat out if need be.

[Jarvy]

Security have to be seen to be reacting to current threats, not ifs or buts. So as for knifes in your underpants well I leave that for you to try, but maybe the lastest full body scanner things that everyone seems to be complaining about are to address these problems.
If you think that giving money to terrorist groups to go away will work then you don't understand the issues.
Back to subject in hand, if passenger has a medical need for syringe then they will have doctors note, this system works ok at the moment.

[ExXB]

Honestly I did, but I must have misplaced it ... :hmm: I suppose next time I see my Dr. I'll ask for another one, but seeing that in 37 years of being a insulin dependent diabetic nobody has ever asked for it ... That includes the one time I was almost refused boarding for carrying dangerous thingys.

You are supposed to use a new needle with each dose, but frankly that's a waste. I almost always can use one needle for each pen - and I've never had any problems. I don't use alcohol either, just makes the skin tough. Obviously I don't 'share' my needles, and don't use the loo to inject either. I always carry an extra needle or three but these things are thin and short, and very unlikely to be detected by one of the wizz bang detecters that are used today. In fact (as said before) I've only once been challenged.

I was very worried by the reports of the undiebomber using a syringe. But except for the British Newspapers attempt to make news, rather than report it, there doesn't seem to be any controls being added. This is how it should be.

[radeng]

Jarvy,

have you ever read Kipling's poem 'danegeld'?

This is called paying the Danegeld
And we've seen it again and again
That once you start paying the Danegeld
You'll never be rid of the Dane.


So paying terrorists might not work, but nuking every base that you find would. Bear in mind that I'm a wooly minded liberal, so I would deal with the Somali pirates by destroying villages and boats until they stopped their piracy, and terrorists by nuking their bases. Also some Q ships with instructions to hang out of hand any pirates that weren't killed.

The same approach with terrorists. They are prepared to kill our families - they must be prepared for the same to happen to them. Tough on the families but they should bring pressure to bear on the idiots. Who was the woman in Old Testament who drove a nail into her husbands head? If a few taliban wives did the same, it would slow the terrorists down - and the forensic science service available wouldn't be able to tell.

But I'm a liberal.......

[west lakes]

and very unlikely to be detected by one of the wizz bang detecters

If in your hand luggage the needles are spotted by the x-ray machine.
The one time I forgot to declare them the operator commented "Ah some insulin pen needes"