Ymml 16 Ils

[UnderneathTheRadar]

Doing my updates yesterday and see that from the 19th of November, the YMML 16 ILS has full CATIIIB approach details published including 0' DH with 75m RVR.

If Thursday morning were to be fogged in, who, if anyone, would be able to use it? Do all operators need permission from CASA to undertake CATIIIB or is it managed through internal training?

Nice to see Australia making it to the 1990's finally....


UTR

[blueloo]

Now if only they could find a spare bit of ILS kit for 34. An ILS on every runway? Wow, we really might be catching up to some 3rd world Asian Countries then!

[apache]

If Thursday morning were to be fogged in, who, if anyone, would be able to use it?


Most international airlines are trained, and equipped to operate catIIIB.
Domestic airlines will have to do their own internal training and currency to operate to this cat.

[Bullethead]

The white rat longhaul jets and crew are all capable but to varying minima due to different approvals for different fleets.

0 ft/75m for the Airbii and 20ft/100m for the Yank Tanks. SFA difference really.

Dunno about the 737s or J*.

Regards,
BH.

[PyroTek]

Wasn't this due to happen 2 or 3 (or more?) amendments ago??

:ok:Pyro

[tmpffisch]

Yara - It turns into a touch and go. Issue is the forward visibility, not the cloud height/"vertical" visibility.

[The Green Goblin]

Now I've got charts 21-1, 21-2, 21-3 and 21-4 with 21-2/3 the same chart one in Yellow and one in standard white with the exception of one being Y and one Z.

:confused:

[Bullethead]

G'day Yara-ma-yha-who,

Cat III approaches are predicated on having an auto go-around capability, if you haven't got the capability you don't attempt the approach in actual conditions.

At 20ft RA you are already over the touchdown zone and pretty much in the, slightly nose high, landing attitude. If there is no visual reference at 20ft you press the GA switch, one on each thrust lever, and the thrust comes up very quickly and the nose is raised to around 15deg NU. Select flaps 20, check for positive rate and then gear up. Carry out the rest of the cleanup above 800HAT. During an autoland the aeroplane flares with the thrust at around 63% so response time is very quick and you would be well below 20ft RA when the thrust is reduced. The radio altimeter is calibrated to give you main undercarriage RA.

You may or may not touchdown, I've done several lo-vis 20ft GAs in the sim and haven't touched down during any of them but that's in a B767 which has lots of grunt. The larger aircraft will of course respond differently. In any case if you do touchdown you continue the GA. If you lose an engine on approach you revert to Cat II minima, 100ft RA DH so the single engine GAs don't go too low.

We practice lo-vis ops and assorted malfunctions every time we complete a sim session, currently three times a year.

Pyro,

The lights, taxi and runway and other facilities have been up to Cat III standard for sometime so I guess it has taken this long to get it all certified.

Regards,
BH.

[Bullethead]

G'day Green Goblin,

The difference between the 'Y' and the 'Z' charts is the use of the ML DME on one 'Y' and the IMS DME on the other 'Z'.

Regards,
BH.

[Bullethead]

G'day Yara-ma-yha-who,

Stable thrust on final approach is around 62% N1, depending on airccraft mass, and during an autoland this is maintained by the autoflight system until the flare is pretty much complete and then the thrust is reduced to idle, which is around 26% N1, and the aircraft settles onto the runway.

Most guys, when hand flying, flare and reduce the thrust at the same time aiming to touchdown as idle is achieved and occasionally we get it right! :rolleyes:

Regards,
BH.

[Bullethead]

G'day blueloo,

Now if only they could find a spare bit of ILS kit for 34. An ILS on every runway? Wow, we really might be catching up to some 3rd world Asian Countries then!


Still leaves one short mate. Nuthin much on the end of 09! Not even rubber. :}

And who said we aren't a third world Asian country? :p

Regards,
BH.

[an3_bolt]

Nuthin much on the end of 09! Not even rubber.

Left plenty of rubber there when they closed down 16/34 ........

Most guys, when hand flying, flare and reduce the thrust at the same time aiming to touchdown as idle is achieved and occasionally we get it right!


....but they still put the wheels on back to front...:mad:

[blueloo]

bah 09 doesn't count......I have only used it twice in 10yrs..... but hey it should get one too. then they could do something creative like precision simultaneous opposite direction landing operations on 09/27. :}

[Howard Hughes]

I remember being number 16 for departure on 09 when 16/34 was closed, got to number 2 and an amended TAF was issued for my destination...:{

Luckily we were only number 5 the second time round!:ok:

[Avid Aviator]

As of yesterday, not yet approved for Qantas Ops. Not sure what the hold up is?
My personal experience is that at least one major Asian airline, who I won't name here, has landed a B747 well below Cat 1 minima here in the past. Cheaper than a diversion, I guess???

[ozineurope]

Cat111 who needs it.

After a certain Asian carrier landed one night in fog at a western capital city near the Indian Ocean -
me in the TWR "for following traffic when did you see the APP lighting?" (they were on Stage 6)
him in the A300 -"aah sir we did not see any APP lights and request a 'follow me vehicle to the international terminal asthe fog makes it hard ot see the runway and taxiway'"

The following F28 diverted......

[clear to land]

Interesting about the different minima for QF Airbus and Boeing. Here in the sandpit our 777's operate to a lower RVR than the AB, and a mutual 0 ceiling for IIIb. Also, there is no requirement to downgrade to Cat 2 for an engine failure (alhough some other failures will necessitate it). Only real limit we have is that PF must be CAPT. Guessing its a company policy thing. The biggest thing is does MEL now have formalised LVO procedures published, and are the ATC trained in their useage also?

[Yeti Breath]

The radio altimeter is calibrated to give you main undercarriage RA

Is it ?, so why does it start counting up during the rotation whit the mains still on the ground ?

[Bullethead]

not yet approved for Qantas Ops

There's a QANTAS tailored Jeppesen MEL ILS 16 Cat III chart with company minima on it so in absence of other info I'd say it is approved.

There is also a LVO airport diagramme with the appropriate Lo Vis taxi ways etc depicted.

Regards,
BH.