C130J Hercules 10th Anniversary

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

RAF News Friday Nov 6th Edition

Centre page spread

(Not online yet)

IN NOVEMBER 1999 the first Hercules C130J touched down at RAF Lyneham, bringing theworkhorse of the RAF into the 21st Century.

More powerful engines, digital cockpits (that sadly sounded the death knell for the engineer and navigator) and a more advanced loading system
gave it a greater capability in its essential air transport role in conflicts or disasters around the world.

Having served with distinction over the past decade (the aircraft cut its teeth in Iraq), it is presently supporting operations in Afghanistan and
will soon be deployed to the Falkland Islands.

And by 2012, when the K variant goes out of service, the C130J will hold the sole responsibility for the work of the Hercules fleet based at RAF Lyneham, in Wiltshire.

To celebrate, an oil painting was commissioned and painted by local artist K Renwick and the resulting print will be available in the SIF Shop BSW and 30 Sqn Shop

[Shackman]

Not seen yet, but if the last edition is anything to go by no doubt accompanied by pictures of Hastings and/or Beverleys!

[Dengue_Dude]

God that heap of dung 10 years old?

Took long enough for them to get it right . . .

We said in the 70's that the cheapest replacement for the Herk would be another one. They could have saved a bomb and bought new 'H' models when they were building them and update their kit.

They'd have been operational long before the Js and cost a fraction. Still, all jobs for the boys eh?

[VinRouge]

Yeah, but it wouldnt have been anywhere near as good.

Be honest with yourself. I bet you are a Nav. :rolleyes:

[sumps]

10 years and how many upgrades?..bring on the next engine change...oh yeah I dont do that anymore. :ok:

[Dengue_Dude]

I bet you are a Nav.

Nope, I don't fly, I just write checklists.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

.

Nope, I don't fly, I just write checklists.

Eastern sea board to Lye today in less than 5 hours, probably a bit too quick for you but we, as a crew found it very satisfying :ok:

[Lockstock]

Nope, I don't fly, I just write checklists.


Ever wondered why you no longer get invited to dinner parties..? :zzz: :zzz:

[FoxtrotAlpha18]

10 years old and we've had about 3 good years out of them so far...:hmm:

[Blighter Pilot]

10 years old with 15 years of fatigue!!

We need more than one replacement C130J

[Dengue_Dude]

Eastern sea board to Lye today in less than 5 hours, probably a bit too quick for you but we, as a crew found it very satisfying

Before I packed in, I got used to cruising at 0.83M with barely a ripple in my tea cup.

Once in Herc at FL350 over Canada (no RVSM those days), we were asked OUR mach no. - I think it was about 0.50 (with many ripples in the tea).

However, I do thank the Hercules for not needing an expensive stereo.

On balance, I'll stick to writing checklists and sleeping in my bed.

Take care guys and fly safely when you can, and cannily when you can't. :)

[StopStart]

Brrrrrrilliant! Another unscheduled meeting of the Flat Earth Society!

Once in Herc at FL350 over Canada (no RVSM those days), we were asked OUR mach no. - I think it was about 0.50 (with many ripples in the tea).

What on earth has that got to do with the price of fish? How does your jet doing 0.83M make a C130J a "pile of dung"? Similarly how does having an opinion on something in the 1970s have the same effect nearly 40 years later? On balance, I'm grateful you're sticking to writing checklists. May I suggest you also cut back on the Internet Expertery whilst you're at it too?

10 years old and we've had about 3 good years out of them so far...

I note that your location is "Oz" - interesting to note that the luddities aren't just confined to these fair shores. Can't comment on the Australians but it may distress you to know that the C130J has been the backbone of deployed UK C130 ops for the last 7 gusting 8 years.

We don't need any replacement Js, we just need the manpower, hangar space, Marshalls time and money currently being pissed away elsewhere, to be invested in maintaining what is, in my opinion, a superb aircraft. Sadly that opinion is only based on 7 years of J flying so I will happily bow to any Flt Engs, Navs, Mess Managers, Tesco checkout girls, street sweepers, double glazing salesmen, etc who can obviously offer a more informed opinion.

So, notwithstanding all the usual horse**** this subject engenders, may I pass on my congrats to all the J crews that have put up with years and years of non-stop deployments and to the "non-deployable" eng line and GEs who have kept the aircraft going in mostly ridiculous circumstances. Despite the hurdles thrown up from the most unexpected places the fleet & crews have always delivered and will continue to do so. Keep on truckin.

[SVK]

Stop Start, does your jaw hurt from biting so hard?

Banter aside, I happen to agree with you and wouldn't be a bit surprised if the K goes the way of the Jag and F3 after the next election.

Now, I am going to bite myself and ask SPHLC is anybody selling this new work of art and whether or not he might know a good picture framer!!!

[120class]

Try the Picture Framing Workshop on Walcot Street in Bath.

[Dengue_Dude]

Thanks SVK - suspect he didn't bother to look at my profile :ok:

It's like fishing with a thunderflash - no talent required.

I'm more than happy to stick to checklists, but 35 years flying does lead to just a little bit of 'expertery' unless you're a complete moron.

You can certainly suggest anything you like but it'll lead to grief for your teddy . . .

Have fun !

[Lockstock]

You can certainly suggest anything you like but it'll lead to grief for your teddy . . .

Errr, I hardly think so chap. Unlike you, Stopstart is a highly respected operator of the aircraft and has the knowledge and expertise to refute your ill-informed and frankly, pathetic comments.

:cool:

[Controversial Tim]

35 years flying does lead to just a little bit of 'expertery' unless you're a complete moron.
That'll explain it then.

[Tea White Zero]

but 35 years flying does lead to just a little bit of 'expertery' ......

ahhh an expert at living in the past! when rates were rates (75% for baldricks!) and VC10 capts were Sqn Ldrs!!!:ugh:

The 70's and 80's are over - as is the cold war, and traveling the world on rates living in hotels.

Be that good or bad, we are where we are, and the boys and girls of the J have done, and continue to do, wonders for our troops and government (even if they don't deserve it).

All - less of the slagging of a fantastic aircraft that is very capable, and more support to our crews who are the main support of TacAT on ops please.

Oh and DD, not sure why it is valid, but since we are boasting about high and ripples.... I have had a nice cup of tea at FL390, the ripples add to the flavour and since tea doesn't make a sound through my noise reduction headset, it didn't matter how noisy the J is! :D

TWO

[Dengue_Dude]

Card 34R

Sense of Humour Circuit breaker trip.

Land as soon as possible, select crewmember, attempt 1 reset. If c/b trips again, cease banter.

Either way guys, fly safely.

[Lockstock]

Ah, the old...say something stupid - make an @rse of yourself - get flamed - then pretend you were trying to be funny...

Very good :ok:

[The Gorilla]

Actually Lockstock..

Flaming is against the rules whereas saying something stupid is not.

Pprune continues its downwards spiral.

[minigundiplomat]

Well done the J. Many more hopefully.

You can say what you like about the J, but it's in service. Unlike the A400, which is big on artists impressions of what it will eventually look like in service.

Thanks for all the 'lifts' back and forth to BSN.

[Controversial Tim]

A thread about an aircraft reaching it's 10th aniversary of RAF service and all some have posted was to slate it. Let go of the old - the J isn't going to be taken out of service now, they and their gucci 2 man flight deck are here to stay.

From the original post I wouldn't care what type it is (the fact it's 'J'Albert has made me post though), well done boys, girls and Mr Lockheed - keep it flying safely for the next decade and beyond.

[ZH875]

10 years of service and it still smells better than the K.

[Dengue_Dude]

Origin of the 'dung' comment. But I'm glad it now does 'what it says on the can'.

The inspector general's (of the USAF) report, issued last July, found deficiencies in the aircraft that, if left uncorrected, could "cause death, severe injury or illness, major loss of equipment or systems." The report concluded that "Lockheed Martin has been unable to design, develop or produce a C-130J aircraft that meets contract specifications in the eight years since production began."

The Pentagon's chief weapons tester, Thomas Christie, reported in January that the C-130J was "neither operationally effective nor operationally suitable"' and has "failed to meet operational requirements."

I was talking with the pilots testing the aircraft initially at Boscombe and it was very much their impression too.

The other comments allude to the fact it's still noisy, vibrates like a bastard and is slow.

Kinda reminds you of some helicopters that can't be used too. But they're not 10 years old yet.

Still - happy birthday.

Standing by for a deluge of bruised teddies.

[Farfrompuken]

DD,

they're a sharp bunch at Boscombe then......

The other comments allude to the fact it's still noisy, vibrates like a bastard and is slow.

It's a turboprob; what do they expect?! remind them it lacks turbofans then!

neither operationally effective nor operationally suitable

I know the TPs at Boscombe aren't in agreement with that view; current (and past) ops would seem to back up the fact that it's a highly capable platform.

DD, get over yourself. You're amplifying your lack of currency by your comments and not doing yourself any favours.

[Tea White Zero]

"neither operationally effective nor operationally suitable"....

2 main points here DD that you seem to had missed/confused/ignored:

- this report is from the US - who's C130J programme is nowhere near as advanced as some. The RAF, as lead nation, has used its fleet very operationally for many years now (and I know as I was there - were you?) there therefore are more advanced.

- secondly, and most importantly, if it is that bad, shouldn't we demand that they all come home from the many Ops that they are on?????

Yes you are right it is noisey - maybe we should retro fit some turbo fans, and it is slow - so maybe we should retro fit swept wings, and yes it can't carry some of the 'outsized' loads - maybe we could make it a bit bigger.....
..... oh hang on a minute that is a C17!!!!! maybe we should just buy a few more of them

but on the other hand it can't get into a tiny weeney TLZ the size of a football pitch or air drop 16 tonnes of stores into a courtyard the size of a postage stamp - maybe we could retro fit some rotors and call it a helicopter!

Maybe it fits somewhere in between...... as it is the same size and shape as a K, maybe it could do a TacAT role ferrying kit, troops, vehicles, ammunition, around theatre and air dropping vital supplies of food water and ammunition to forward deployed troops.:D

But then you are obviously the expert sat in you check list office harking back to the good old days:{. Why doesn't everyone support our troops and emphasize the positive bits rather than just start another slanging match in the name of 'banter' and belittle everything that has, and is being, achieved with what is a great tactical transporter which has become the backbone of deployed ops.:ok:

[barnstormer1968]

Tea White Zero

While I am not disagreeing with most of your above post, surely you will know that a C130 has already been designed to land in the space of a football pitch, and take off again from said pitch:ok:

In fact the design was so radical, that unlike RAF Hercs, it even had self changing wings:}:eek:



Here here for the RAF's C130's, and hoping they fly safe for many years to come. Maybe we might even get some of the 'fat' C130's if they are ever produced.

[Jumping_Jack]

Just 15 more years and then the C130J can be painted in a gaudy paint scheme and flown to Marietta for a week long shindig!! :ok:

[GreenKnight121]

Dengue_Dude...

Could you provide a link or source information for that article... just so we know when it was written, who wrote it, and what their qualifications/conflict-of-interest are?


Just asking.

[Controversial Tim]

The report is an old one (July 2004) and was from the US Defense Department, which at the time was having an internal conflict over the introduction of the new aircraft and had strong political involvement on both sides due to regional job implications.

A fairly typical review from the time is here : NY Times (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9800EFD6163FF937A15750C0A9639C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=2) . I especially like the bit about the engines being so powerful they were flattening the propellor blades on take off making the aircraft vulnerable to stall. Clearly, this wasn't just a case of grabbing any available argument.

When the Defense Dept report was published in July 2004, it was about the same time as our Boscombe Down luvvies were insisting that a trim runaway warning system was retrofitted to our aircraft because they hadn't mishandled it. Thank heavens that didn't last.

[120class]

As the recent Haddon-Cave report demonstrates there is an incredible degree of pressure in the flight test world to give the IPT the required answer in order to meet slipping time and budget constraints. Enevitably decisions and recommendations are raised that do not meet with universal approval and indeed are often subject to heated debate in the testing world. A balance has to be struck between pragmatism and ensuring that a half-baked system is not delivered to the front-line that Sqn crews will spend years having to work around.

UK Flight Test is moving on with the Test Squadrons and OEUs combined under the AWC. I suspect the issue raised regarding the Trim Incident would be handled quite differently today.

Regards

[StopStart]

DD - we were obviously all reeled by your fabulous fishing expedition :rolleyes: nice one. That said, a simple admission that you didn't actually have any direct knowledge or experience of this subject would've been more impressive. Do please keep lobbing your thunderflashes into the lake though - we await your next haul. 35 years of flying is all well and good but if you are unable to accept informed opinion and actual experience then it’s all for naught and you must be, I'm afraid, just another dinosaur.

Kinda reminds you of some helicopters that can't be used too.
Can't be used? I missed that memo. Do elaborate. There are loads of the bloody things out here in Afghanistan from at least 5 different nations. Guess they should've checked with you first before sending them out. On the plus side though, if they “can’t be used” then I guess my crew and I get the night off tonight?

GK121 - the article is from 2005 or thereabouts. A google search will also throw up articles from 2005 from the head of AMC praising the Js operational 98.9% mission achievement rate, the effectiveness of the KC130J, WC130J & EC130J, large J orders for the USAF and plans for the MC130J, HC130J and AC130J. Dung indeed.

Ladies, I'm not "biting", being "reeled in" nor am I abusing my teddy (all good, solid internet staples from those unable to accept their own errors or failings). I just find myself, once again, defending an aircraft that I know quite a lot about from people that know absolutely nothing about it. If certain corners of the MoD & the RAF had been able to see the aircraft for what it is (although to be fair, they were wilfully misled at times by agenda carrying “senior” officers) then we’d be a lot further down the line to delivering an even better service to the troops on the ground, which ultimately is what we’re here for.

PS. Trim guards? A classic piece of mongery. Akin to restricting the use of the control column as it has the potential to damage the aircraft if misused :rolleyes:

[Dengue_Dude]

As I said - a deluge of bruised teddies.

Yes it was an old article and was gleaned by typing 'C130J problems' into Google and trawling the results.

The fact IS, I wasn't particularly trying to piss anyone off (overmuch), but the facts remain that the aircraft was not fit for purpose when first acquired.

An immense amount of time and effort went in subsequently for this 'bought and paid for' asset was worth its salt. Which indeed, from talking to current operators that I know, it is now.

I popped back around 2000 to fly with the Auxiliaries at LYE and the impression there (AT THE TIME) was that the aircraft (in some of its roles) was a great disappointment. When you consider the ability of its predecessors, it is very surprising that such a dog was produced then was subject to so much R & D after acquisition.

To the others who've been SOo upset by me impugning their beloved platform, I would say it's a lot less effort to glance at my profile than to make the effort to respond - it's been the same for several years. Humour like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder, but get a grip guys. . .

As for 'flamed' et al, I've been insulted by experts, nothing on here bothers me in the slightest - so feel free. Not as if it's terminal is it?

As I said (and it's quite sincere - take it or leave it), is 'fly safe' when you can and 'cannily' when you can't.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Stoppers,

It's know sad to see but I suspect that technology having moved on and the subsequent removal of a couple of flight decks because the replacement black boxes were considered way more useful, well it was always going to leave one or two folk more than a little bitter :ok:

[sumps]

DD – I don’t know how much experience you have of a new product coming into service but it is the case with most items that there will inevitably be some pain felt when a new piece of equipment comes into service.

Speaking from the engineering point, when the first J turned up in Nov 99 and subsequently the next 3 to 5 years the aircraft and its crews (airborne and ground) went through the “inception into service” learning curve that may have brought on some comments about its design or capabilities. In those early days we were all fighting for operator knowledge of a new platform (as it was handed over from those with the designers perception) in order to get the aircraft to the position it now serves in. Add into that 3 -5 years the operational tasking, new methods of contractor support , training, software/hardware upgrades and modification…etc and it is easy to see how some comments could be amplified due to a persons bravado trying to coping with an unknown situation or deficiency in knowledge. A lot of the shortcomings of the early days have been overcome, some have not, but as the aircraft goes through its life cycle it too will earn its position as a good worker (as it is now) only to get a bit of a slating as it gets to the end of its life cycle.

It is evident that the A400m is embarking on a similar process of delayed entry into service and probably with limited clearance …and so it starts all over again!

[StopStart]

DD - Not entirely sure what your profile has to do with the price of fish other than it declaring you to be a wind-up merchant and general all round crazy trickster. :hmm:

An immense amount of time and effort went in subsequently for this 'bought and paid for' asset was worth its salt.

Really? Or was it loads of money and time wasted on proving what Lockheed told them the aircraft would do in the first place? The tail doesn't ice up and fall off, parachutists don't get shredded as they jump, the props don't evaporate when used on gravel strips and it is very easily operated at low level by only two on the flightdeck. The list is endless. The time to get things cleared on the aircraft had nothing to do with the aircraft and everything to do with QQ process and prevarication and general footdragging by the luddites in charge.
I would hazard that were the E or the H introduced into service today they would not get certified iaw current FAA regs....

Keep digging.

SFFP - you're quite right but at least this banal chat whiles away the hours and days out here :)

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

SS,

Say hi to your lunch monster and fly safe :ok:

[120class]

Or was it loads of money and time wasted on proving what Lockheed told them the aircraft would do in the first place?


When an aircraft is developed as part of a multi-national programme the decision as to what standard to certify the aircraft to is up for debate. No-one wants to overtest or indeed cover old ground and therefore an agreed standard between the customer nations is required. For the C130J that initial standard rightly or wrongly was FAA. Some of this (hopefully a lot) will satisfy the individual customers needs however some national testing is bound to be rquired dependent upon the anticipated needs of each nation.

The order of the test programme and what the MOD subsequently clears the front-line to do rests with the MOD/IPT subject all the time to changing operational requirements.

The alternative is wait until an aircraft has entered service, received the inevitable software/hardware fixes then place your order.

[Dengue_Dude]

DD - Not entirely sure what your profile has to do with the price of fish other than it declaring you to be a wind-up merchant and general all round crazy trickster.

EXACTLY ! Never promised to be anything else sir!!!

I'm sorry if you got wound up, but as you say, it passes the time. Basically, I only reported what was being said (again, AT THE TIME) but parcelled in a provocative package to generate a bit of reaction.

As you well know, if you're lucky, flying can be boring, so the mischievous types (like me) have to think up new ways of torturing my pilots - which is always good sport.

Shame we can't go and discuss it over a few glasses of Kokinelli and kebab. Not all wind ups are bad news, and I did try to leave clues.

Either way, however this is received, fly as safe as you all can.

[Lockstock]

While you are portraying yourself as the world's greatest wind-up artist and the rest of us are thinking you are a bitter old f@rt, just consider the facts...

The C130J arrived in 1999 directly onto a squadron with the RAF as the lead customer; no OEU, no clearances, no experience on type, no OCU. Just a few C130K crews who had done a Lockheed Martin factory course on a raw airframe with basic software, which amounted to not much more than medium-level flying A to B and LM telling them how great the aircraft that they were selling us was. Compare that, at the time with the K and its 25 years of operational experience, tac clearances and more manuals than the British Library.

Imagine my surprise when a few individuals - remember no Nav or Flt Eng on this new-fangled aircraft - scoffed at the lack of ability of this raw airframe. Now fast forward 10 years and see what the aircraft can do. Whether you like it or not, it has a proven track record since 2003 and is the airframe of choice by the Army in theatre. Please go and Google some random, irrelevant 5 year old reports by another nation or recall your (alleged) conversation with someone 10 years ago who thought it may not be any good... but better still listen or talk to current operators or customers. You may learn something...

[barnstormer1968]

Lockstock.

You appear to have at least some knowledge of the C130 fleets within the RAF.

So when questioned about the lack of RAF AT assets, some government spokesman proudly says that 'we' have 60 C130's in service, do you think that it may be the truth, and not just airframes that have been stretched a little:}:}

BTW, I have not heard this conversation, but feel sure something like it must have been said at some stage:E

Now I must put away this large clockwork key/wooden spoon (delete as appropriate)

[Dengue_Dude]

Oh Lockstock, please drown yourself in your barrel of vitriol.

Humour is funny to some but not to others, get over it.

In Yorkshire there is a great phrase.

'Get yoursen felt'.

Endex.

[Lockstock]

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Just doing what you seem unable to do; provide a few facts.

Ever feel that you are a lone voice in a large crowd...?


btw, thanks for the PM - it meant nothing.


.

[gopher01]

Believe you me. as one who as the G.E. was on the trip to Marietta, it was certainly no jolly. Two days in Atlanta and then fly to Denver, pick up a load of marines on exercise, back to Marietta and then home with the people we took to Marietta for the photoshoot. The only good bits were the Lockheed brief on the H.T.P. and the airborne photoshoot formatting on a photo ship Mitchell. The Mitchell pilot wasn't too keen on close formation with a Herk so our captain told him to fly along and we would do the formation bit. This did involve at one point trying to get the probe as close to the tail position of the Mitchell as possible, close enough to get the photographer laying in the open tailcone to move further back up the fuselage. Well done Obe!

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Someone is not consigned to being an admin clerk writing checklists by chance, technology will do that to you :ok:

[Tea White Zero]

wow DD you are such a wag!!!!

All along it was just a wind-up, and there was me just thinking you were a 'male game bird' or a 'small vertical sided, round topped pile of hay'!

How about next time you start a thread titled 'The C130J - 10 years on and look at what great support it is giving to our troops on ops':D. Gone on, you can do something worthwhile and positive rather than unfunny and vindictive that quite frankly undermines the efforts of all on ops as the thread is read by many who are not in the know.

TWO:}

Ps Stoppers - have a good one and keep your head down. see you soon.:E

Happiness is 70 tonnes, a HUD and a Hobnob!:ok:

[handysnaks]

10 years of the J eh! I remember going to the 25th anniversary of the Herc meeting at Greenham Common in 1979.

(dunno what that's got to do with anything I just thought I'd lighten the mood)!

[Ken Scott]

Oh dear, a strong feeling of deju vu, I thought the 'K v J' debate was put to bed years ago as the weight of evidence, rather than spite & prejudice, proved that the J was doing an admirable job.

DD, can you give a list of military aircraft that hit the ground running with all their clearances, post 1960 ish? Let's not forget that the J faced huge institutional opposition from those AT operators who had no seat aboard, and even went as far as to cancel test programmes that would have obtained said clearances much sooner.

The 10th anniversary should be a moment of celebration for an aircraft that is, along with the C17, the backbone of current AT Ops and without which the UK military could not carry on. The boys and girls of XXIV & 30 Sqns have been continuously in harms way since Ops began, joined more recently by 47J, and are doing a superb job. The K, RIP, simply cannot provide the frames anymore; as an ex - K operator I have enormous respect & affection for its past contribution, but Canute has wet feet now and we have to look forwards not behind us.

Happy birthday, Albert J!

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

SVK
Now, I am going to bite myself and ask SPHLC is anybody selling this new work of art and whether or not he might know a good picture framer!!!

Indeed. Forum rules prevent me from expanding any further.

I have an image of the 10th Anniversary Print. I believe it is a stunning piece of artwork

Could a moderator drop me a quick PM giving me permission to post the image?

[billynospares]

I am glad someone got a dig at QQ in wouldnt be the same otherwise. By the way QQ wasnt invented when J was being cleared ! :ugh:

[StopStart]

Only just though :hmm: and they've more than made up for it subsequently.

[juliet]

10 years!

What an awesome aircraft.

Cut my teeth flying around Iraq, knew that the J was pretty good. Wasnt till I started working in Afghan that I realised how good.

Climbing out of Kabul knowing that SALT could be made if we lost an engine.

Shuttles to Bastion with gas for the day, 10-12t down the back, NOS onto a 4000' strip.

10t into Chagcharan (how high is it there? About 8500' or so?)

Absolutely loved my time on the J and still amazed that it is still so far advanced in many ways over anything else flying in an AT role, civvy or mil.
:ok::ok::ok:

[Top Bunk Tester]

As an ex Air Eng on the K, I left EDGL not long after the J frames arrived. I admit to being somewhat sceptical of the new plastic fantastic aircraft. Yes, it took time to get a lot of the clearances, yes, it took time for the crews to become familiar with it. In fact all of the associated problems that you get with any new frame coming into service, especially as the 'launch' customer.

Roll on a few years and, now in a different life, I found myself in Iraq and using the J service quite a lot. Because of my background I spent most of those trips 'up front', chatting to old mates and taking more than a casual interest of how the J was operated and any limitations I could see. All I can say is that the crews love it, they say it flys like a dream. Yes, it was very strange sitting in the jumpseat and having no instruments to check on the T/O roll, trying to get used to the MFD outputs, of course the master race had their HUDs. When doing anything a bit 'meaty' the Loady then took the role of the third pair of eyes on the flight deck. All I can say is that it works and seems to be getting better all of the time.

I still believe that for 'certain' roles they need a dedicated third man, but that aside, unfortunately some may say, the future is J. The K will continue to provide an exemplary service until it is withdrawn, kicking and screaming, from service.........much like I was :)

[OKOC]

Top Bunk Tester--what a nice and well-balanced reply. I agree entirely--yes, we were a bit cautious when the J arrived, remember the J glider (that sat on the pan for ages) (much mirth en-route to 47 and LXX) when there were the shortage of engine problems--but hey ho folks we all move on and sometimes it is for the better--from an outsiders view-point I think the J is to be commended as indeed are all their crews. Shame they don't have space for a 61 year old nav.

[grey_not_green]

Shhhhhhh....

Listen....

I think DD has finally buggered off.

Brilliant, now we can get down to saying nice things about the 'plastic fantastic'. An ac I happen to have a lot of time for, seeing as I've been on it for nearly ten years.

Oh, and SPHLC, top print by the way, don't post it here though, as I may have bought it as a present for someone who may be reading this..... ;)

:ok:

[juliet]

SPHLC,

Any chance we can have a look at the print? Can you put an image on here or something? Might be keen to get one off you but want to check the number of blades before I order anything!:}

Cheers Mate,

Juliet

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Unless the Mods relent, I'm not going to get this thread locked by posting an image, as it would be advertising (even though it is a break-even project)

PM me.

If you googled for the obvious words, you might get a look...


... at your Xmas prezzie, grey_not_green's partner/parent


The reason it has suddenly gone all polite on this thread is that word has finally hit the crewrooms that there will be a free beer situation coming up soon. Very shallow, us Ascoteers

[juliet]

Found the print on Ebay. Great pic, brings back memories!:ok:

[daveyb]

Hi all,
i was just reading through the posts about the herc when i worked for fedex, ACL operated one DUB-STN-CDG which i used to load.
Just a few questions on the military herc were would the navigator sit is the flight deck layout different or is there a civi verson?.
I remember jumpseating on it the crew who i worked with were mostly ex RAF/RAAF/SAAF&USAF great bunch of guys.

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Online now:-


RAF News - Workhorse of the skies celebrates a decade (http://www.rafnews.co.uk/readstory.asp?storyID=303&returnto=search.asp&page=&departmentID=47&categoryID=&search)

[Papa Sierra]

I agree wholeheartedly with TBT (I've heard that it's very comfortable, incidentally!!), I left the mob just before the J was introduced into service. Meeting up with old friends and colleagues, down route, many appeared quite disparaging about the new "Albert" but in a relatively short space of time these same people completely changed their opinions, I suppose like most of us change doesn't come easily,needless to say all the mates I see, far too infrequently, swear by the J. Having no experience of the "new" Herc I can only respectfully submit that if it is half as good as the K it is still an awesome aircraft!!

[Cougar]

Congrats to both the RAF and RAAF for 10 years of the J.

Spent 7 myself on them and loved every single minute of it. Fantastic aircraft. Looking forward to the years ahead.

Anyone say AC-130J? :ok:

[scroggs]

Well done to the boys and girls of 24 & 30 Sqns and all their supporting peeps. Like all aircraft, the C130J had its introductory hiccups but, as Stoppers and others report, it's matured into an excellent bit of kit and has measurably improved the RAF's ability to deliver tactical AT. I never flew the thing myself, though I did do a little bit of work in the sim in 1996 or 97. That taster left me excited and impatient for the core course, which I was lucky enough to be selected for, but technical and political delays slid the programme too far to the right. I got my two-pilot glass-cockpit conversion via the A340 (after a few more years on clockwork with the B747-200), and know how much of a cqpability and capacity expander that is. So congratulations, and here's to the next 40 or 50 years of service!!

[aeroid]

Don't knock the Hastings. There are still a few of us left that flew it and learnt a lot about flying from the beast.

[aeroid]

Though it is a couple of years before the K-model is retired I am interested in any plans for a farewell. I flewthe K on its introduction to UK in 1967 (OCU in USA with USAF) and would be keen to hear from anyone of that ilk. [email protected]