Could someone clarify the reqs for modulair CPL(H).thnx

[Gosa]

Hi,

First of all, I'm not a pilot yet (far from it) But I'm planning to go abroad next summer. Due to financial aspects I thought I would do the PPL H training first and I was looking at the info about the modulair CPL H but there is something that I don't get. I want to compare the price for:
PPL(H)+hour building+modulair CPL H <=> Integerated PPL(H)/CPL(H) course.

But to come back to the Modulair CPL(H) requirements/
I have problems understanding the following text:

To be eligible for this route the pilot must already have passed the JAA written examinations and be in possession of an ICAO PPL(H) with 155 hours as a helicopter pilot; 50 hours must be as Pilot in Command, with 10 of these hours as cross-country.
Suppose I have the PPL(H) license. (Let's say in 50 hours)
1) Do I then need 95 hours of experience(hour building)?

The part that confuses me is: 50 hours must be as PIC.
2) Does that mean that hours as co-pilot are also valid? Cause they are not saying 155 hours as PIC.

Sorry if it's obvious but honnestly I'm confused. (might be because I'm not a native english speaker)

Thank you for helping a newbie.

G

[Curtis E Carr]

1. No, you would need 105 hours.

2. You can only claim co-pilot hours if your are flying a helicopter that is certificated to be flown by two pilots. It is unlikely that being the holder of a PPL(H) you will be type rated on, say, the AS322 so this would not be open to you. The balance of the 155 hours can be dual i.e under instruction.

[Gosa]

Thank you for your reponse and let's quick skip to question/answer 2 :ugh:

I think I get it know. I didn't think about flying with an instructor. I was so focused on How can you fly without being PIC.
I thought maybe that flying with another person that has atleast a PPL(H) license would count as well. (It would divide the cost by two, cause you could take turns)
I'm dreaming I know :p
But thanks for helping me understand.
Now I do feel silly :O

ps: Do you think it would be cheaper to do PPL(H) + hour building + Modular CPL H instead of an integrated PPL(H)/CPL(H) course.

I was thinking about doing the PPL(H) first cause it costs less to begin with. To gather the money for it is also possible. Plus I can do it during the 2 months of vacation that I have. (I work in a school by the way).

[Curtis E Carr]

Please do not feel silly. Until you get used to all of this, it can be a bit of a minefield!

As to costs of Integrated v Modular, there may be old threads on this forum that may be able to assist you. However, please be careful to consider other factors as well as cost. For instance, where do you wish to work once you have your license? This may also influence your decision as to how and where you train.

This thread may be useful. (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/328014-cpl-h-modular-integrated-course.html)

My advice would be to email various schools and start getting some up-to-date prices. Be absolutely clear what each school is offering as items in some schools may be part of the overall package but may be charged extra in others.

Bon chance.

[Whirlygig]

I would reckon 99% of the time, a modular course would be cheaper; you can do it at your own pace, with different schools for different modules and still work and earn money in the meantime.

So, you get a PPL in around 50-60-70 hours, hour build whilst studying for the ground exams. The hour building will ensure you have 10 hours cross-country and 50 hours PIC (some PIC time will be obtained during your PPL); the rest of the time can be with an instructor ( as dual/Pilot under training) to make sure you don't get into any bad habits whilst flying on your own or with passengers.

If you want to share costs with another PPL, please be aware that only one of you can log PIC at any one time. However, the advantage is that, if you self-fly-hire with a fellow PPL, you can go a further distance say, one way each.

Cheers

Whirls

[Gosa]

@Curtis:
For now I'm thinking about going to Florida (Bristow Academy) cause of the cost and I've read some good things about the school. Only one person said that doing the PPL(H) there might not be a good choice cause they like students for combined JAA/FAA CPL(H) more.
I did contact Bristow Academy and they were nice on the phone.
But I will read more post (especially yours) to gain more insight.
There is so much information but it's sometimes hard to filter what's needed for a beginner.

So thanks again Curtis for going easy on me. I really appreciate it.
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@Whirls:
My (first) plan is doing the PPL(H) because I can do it during the summer holiday (summer 2010) (got 2 months vacation)
It costs less to start and I think I will be able to gather the money by next year.
And when I come back I can go back to work and earn money.(just like you said)
I could do hour building during the year until I have enough hours and then do the Modular CPL(H) when i have the money of course :\

Do you think it possible to do the Modular CPL(H) in less than 2 months?
(BA's Program: 35 hours flight training including briefings 300CB/CBi)
Just trying to figure out if it's also possible to do it during school-holiday's.(maybe the year after)

Thank you also for helping me on the other thread about self-studying and the books.
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I'm really happy that the people on the forum are nice and are willing to share their wisdom/knowledge.

[Gosa]

Oh by the way what do you exactly mean with:
" However, the advantage is that, if you self-fly-hire with a fellow PPL, you can go a further distance say, one way each."

Do you mean that one person can fly one way and the other coming back. Or something completely different.

The reason I ask this, is cause I have a colleague who is also considering in doing the PPL(H) the same time as me and I have another friend who already flies(he is the private tutor I talked about in another thread)
So it might be interesting to know what my options are to build-up hours.

[Whirlygig]

Do you think it possible to do the Modular CPL(H) in less than 2 months?If you mean the actual 30 hour course (plus another 5 for the night qualification), then yes, you could do it in two months full-time if you applied yourself. It also depends on the availability of the examiner :}

So, PPL summer 2010, hour build and study for ground school through the next year, and CPL course the following summer is possible. Tough but possible.

Do you mean that one person can fly one way and the other coming back.Yes, it's mean you will have better experience of a longe distance which will improve yours (and your friend's) nav skills.

If you want to do an intergrated course, I don't see the point in doing a PPL first so really, this is the point where you ought to decide which course you wish to take.

With the job market as it is at the moment, there is no rush to get qualified.

Cheers

Whirls

[Torquetalk]

Gosa

As a JCR-FCL (i.e. European training) PPL(H) you can get a dispensation on the minimum hours required for an intergrated CPL(H). The Bristow intergrated course, for example, reduces from 135 to 105 and there are similar and sometimes quite flexible "integrated" CPL(H) programmes elsewhere in Europe (LGM in Germany; BAC in Denmark)

Personally I wouldn't recommend Bristow for ab initio PPL(H) unless you receive instruction from one of the senior instructors who will know the difference between an ab initio PPL(H) and a cadet. You might otherwise get a relatively low-hour instructor who will give you overly militaristic ab initio training. IMHO you could do better seeking out an enthusiatic higher-time instructor at a smaller school. Have some fun learning to get your private licence, then "get the drill".

TT