Motorgliders / PPL?

[Mark1234]

Can anyone advise / point me to anything regarding flying a motorglider, such as a grob / dimona, and what the legalities are for a PPL. Part of me thinks it's just an SEP, but.... Not had a lot of joy searching the docs so far.

Thanks.

[bentleg]

Whilst I am sure a PPL would allow you to fly a motorglider, with appropriate type training, I think you will find most glider pilots, and that includes motor gliders, have certifcates issued by the Gliding Federation of Australia.


The GFA is responsible to CASA (Civil Aviation Safety Authority) for the conduct of safe gliding operations in Australia. This includes the setting and maintenance of flying standards and in particular training standards.
Glider pilots are exempt from holding pilot licence's. GFA is responsible for the establishment of pilot certificates which are regarded highly enough by CASA and the aviation industry to be considered as a satisfactory substitute for licence's.


More info here (http://2009.gfa.org.au/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=266&Itemid=139)

[Hornet306]

Here is the relevant extract from the GFA Manual of Standard Procedures:

26.5 Conversion of power pilots to powered sailplanes

Power pilots holding a Restricted Private or higher licence, or a Pilot Certificate
issued by the Australian Ultralight Federation may fly powered sailplanes as pilot in-
command under the auspices of the GFA under the following conditions :-

1. The person is a member of the GFA or has undertaken in writing to
maintain and operate the aircraft in accordance with the standards of the
GFA (CAO 95.4).

2. The person must have gained a "C" Certificate in addition to his/her
licence or pilot Certificate in order to fly a powered sailplane cross country.

3. The conversion is carried out as appropriate to the intended mode of
operation and the logbook appropriately endorsed.

[Mark1234]

Thanks - not looking promising :( I know it can be flown under the auspices of the GFA (I'm actually also a glider pilot) but trying to figure whether it has to be! Specifically if I were to buy a share in one, could I use it as a regular aircraft to keep my PPL current. However, to me a powered sailplane is something with a 'pop up' pod onboard, whereas a motorglider is just a conventional aeroplane with big wings - I wonder where the line is drawn!

[certifs]

Mark,
the line is drawn by the CARs.
"aeroplane means a power‑driven heavier‑than‑air aircraft deriving its lift in flight chiefly from aerodynamic reactions on surfaces remaining fixed under given conditions of flight, but does not include a power‑assisted sailplane."

It boils down to legally a motorglider is not an "aeroplane".
(That's also why you get odd discrepancies like you can do a GA biennial in an ultralight, because it is an aeroplane, but you can't do a GA biennial in a motor glider because it isn't an aeroplane)

Bottom line, a "motor glider" can be operated 3 ways
+As a glider under GFA to GFA rules as nearly all motor gliders are currently operated.
+Theoretically as a glider under your own sporting organisation but complying to GFA rules (I don't think this has actually been done in Australia).
+As a GA aircraft but it then has to be under GA rules (Flinders Uni did this with a Grob 109) with LAME maintenance, PPL etc (and by definition it isn't a "motorglider" then).