The profession in the USA and Europe

[galernikus]

I have been a flying for almost 10 years now and I am approaching 30 years of age soon. I am sure that most of you are aware how low the morale and the pay is in the United states. My first year flying for a "highest" paid regional I made $20K before taxes. Keep in mind that rent in my area is about $1000 a month for a studio apartment... This month I will be on 4th year pay scale and maybe I can break into the mid $40K ($2500 a month after taxes). Needless to say, my pay is less than that of a city bus driver. I have a second job that pays well and that is the only reason why I am still flying. I worked hard and payed a lot of money to become an airline pilot but it's becoming increasingly hard to justify staying at the airlines, at least in the United States.
To make a long story short, I have decided to give the profession one more shot in Europe. I am a European citizen and I have always wanted to come back to the old continent ever since my parents and I moved to the United States. I guess the real reason for this post is some encouragement and reassurance that life as pilot is better in Europe. I have been treated like a unskilled worker for many years(by the company and passengers) and it is hard for me to believe that life is that much different in Europe.
I have started the JAA conversion process and I already obtained my medical just to make sure I can pass it under the stricter European standards. I have seen the steady degradation of the Pilot profession in the United States and I am hoping that things are different in the Europe. Do you think that I am wasting my time and money and the low pay and lack respect will spread to the European aviation as well? Or maybe at least for a foreseeable future, it's still a respectable profession at the other side of the pond?

Regards,

Simon

[Bealzebub]

I see from your profile you are in New York, but if you will forgive a bit of poetic licence, there is the old saying: "What California does today, the rest will do tommorow." Certainly in the UK and probably much of Europe, jobs are becoming scarce. Terms and conditions for those that remain are becoming worse.

If you want a snapshot of European aviation, you should perhaps look at one of the few carriers that is actually recuiting and expanding in the current climate. This company is setting the new benchmark standard for Terms & conditions within the industry. Click on search above and enter the word Ryanair. That will give you an idea of all of the answers you are seeking with regards to "respect" and terms and conditions. Most airlines are retrenching, with redundancies and salary cutbacks.

It may be the case that in your situation, a relocation would work for you, however you should be under no illusion that the industry is in severe recession and despite 3000 miles of grey ocean, things are not pretty here either.

[Aerouk]

Jobs at the moment aren't too good, I would wait a couple of years until things pick up. Obviously you would be selected first over any newbie on the market but even for the experienced guys it's hard going.

Ryanair are one of the companies that are expanding and constantly looking for pilots, but their T&C are sh*t and the wage for the first couple of years isn't much better.

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Please quit immediately. You obviously don't like your career choice, so find something else to do that you will like.

cliff
NBO
PS-It will help me out, and you will be happier!

[LAX]

galernikus

I converted my licience a few years ago. Reality is that if you had done the same at that time there may have been some advantage.

Friends of mine that lost their jobs a year ago in uk/europe with medium jet experience are in the middle east or africa, the only jobs available. You state you are an experienced pilot with a regional. What aircraft have you flown/how many hours on commercial aircraft? If you have 3500hrs total and 800hrs PIC on 737 with the right to work in europe then Ryanair would be interested as a direct entry captain, otherwise your wasting your time and money. You need to look at the middle east/africa, the job market is tight in Euro land like the US.

IF, you could find a job in europe you would earn more money than in the USA. HOWEVER, Euro land is very socialist and its all about taxing those working to pay for those poor people that cant be bothered to find a job and their healthcare. Your standard of living would be much lower, think long and hard my friend.

[KAG]

I have a second job that pays well and that is the only reason why I am still flying.
:eek:

Sorry to hear that mate.
Don' t get too tired before your flight.
Good luck.

[galernikus]

Thank you for all the responses (except atpclif) I decided to convert my license but I am doing it with out going into debt since it may take a while before I get that first job. I realize that the job market in Europe is scarce at moment but once the upturn is upon us I hope be ready for it. I am not expecting a "glamorous" lifestyle but I assume that living a middle class life style is possible. For the most part I really want to move back to the old continent and even if the pay was the same at least I would live where I feel at home.

On another note, do you think that the profession in Europe will continue spiraling downward? I was under the impression that pilots in Europe have more tools to prevet the managment from taking their bread. You can legaly strike and barriers to entry are higher than those in the USA. What do you think? Is it still a better career than the "office" job or am I just clinging to the dream?

P.S
I am wandering if I don't know how bad it is in Europe or European aviators are not aware how bad it is in the United States... (honest thought)