Happiness is... no more VISTA

[piggybank]

At long last I have wiped VISTA off my computer. I attempted to do a clean install of Vista as the kids were used to it, despite its faults. My 'clean' install turned out to have left half the hard drive still in use from the old Vista, as Vista.old or something. As I wiped it told me it would be 34 days and 0 hrs to wipe it all.

I knew that could not be true but gave it an hour to sort things out. I tried to re install the broadband modem, and as before Vista did not like its driver. Even the tech from the computer shop had taken one and a half hours to do it when first purchased.

In the end I chose to put XP in. An excellent move.

The modem was found and automatically installed in less than 15 seconds. Yes, this XP is a really good upgrade after Vista. Really good.

I must have rocks in my head to keep Vista in for so long. I'm using Opera version 10 beta 2 as a browser and it is fast on my Internet. Obviously there's things I can't control, like my broadband running at 4 BPS last night, is that a world record for slowness?

Now here's a bit I need some advice on. I have a problem with the Indonesian language “overlay” supplied with Windows XP. I put it in for a try as our extended household uses Indonesian the most.

Works OK but found that using the language bar to swap languages still left everything in Indonesian.

I removed the language option via control panel, however most things are still in Indonesian. Lucky I never picked some scribbly text language to put in.

Any thoughts how I can get rid of the “overlay”.

[piggybank]

I have found the answer. I did have a good hunt through Microsoft's help site on the web, and found nothing.

Looking around the computer for something obvious, I went back to Control Panel, Regional and Language Options, Advanced. I found the selection for non unicode programs was set to Indonesian. Reset to English (United States) and all is well, it needed a restart to put the right files back.

[The late XV105]

When my Lenovo T61 laptop (T8300 Core 2 Duo / 2GB Ram) was supplied new last year it came installed with Vista Business. Performance was so inferior to my T42 single core laptop with 2GB RAM and running XP Pro that had preceded it, and Cisco VPN so unstable, that I asked the IS team to install XP Pro instead.

When it came back, performance was far better than with Vista, but still no better than the T42. Not quite what I expected given the same operating system and service pack level but a much better headline tech spec.

From the outset of having XP installed the T61 would not read some types of DVD, and this came to a head recently when I had reason to need it fixed. Despite installing the latest full K-lite pack and being fully up to date with MS and Lenovo patches it still didn't work, so I asked the IS team to reinstall XP Pro, check if it was fixed, and if necessary then troubleshoot it.

When it came back this time the performance was exactly what I would have expected in the first place. To use a manner of speech, a flying machine. The DVD problem was fixed, too.

I asked the IS team what they had done differently this time; the answer was to reformat and install XP. Last time, I learned, they downgraded from Vista to XP per the option that the laptop had been purchased with. I wish I'd known at the time as I would have specifically asked for a reformat and clean installation but right now I'm kinda glad the DVD problem cropped up (which for the record had been solved simply by reinstalling XP)

[lomapaseo]

Happiness is visiting a new forum and finding folks with similar thoughts:ok:

Today I feel ignorant and frustrated

I just got a Dell XPS710 off of E-bay and the seller mistakenly loaded it with a fresh load of Vista. OK appologies and such but all I really want is a fresh load of XP. The seller sent along the reload XP disk from Dell. So here I am thinking this ought to be straight forward even for me. So I take out the Vista based WD500gb "C" drive and replace it with a brand new formated WD 1000gb drive.

I then pop in the XP CD and boot the computer. Bingo it takes about a minute to load in a whole bunch of drivers and then the dreaded Blue Screen of death followed by the mysterious gobbledigook of what MS calls a stop error 0x0000007b, 0x0000024, 0x00000000, 0x00000000

So I calls in my more experienced computer guru and after a day of trial and error and reading web sites she (my daughter) still can't reload XP without that blue screen (even tried an XP clean formated drive from one of my other XPS710 machines.

This has got to be a simple problem with a simple soultion doesn't it :confused:k:

[Tonic Please]

The BSOD could be because the mtoherboard does not like the hard disk you put in.

Did you put in a 'storage' hard disk? These are not designed to run as hard disks, only storage, and operating systems will not work on them as they should (if at all).

Why did you remove the Vista hard disk?

If you put the Vista hard disk back in, will it load up correctly?

What happens when you load up on the new 1TB disk without the XP disk in? Same screen?

When you say 'loads up a whole bunch of drivers', do you mean it reads the XP disk? or are you refering to the standard BIOS startup procedure before it actually gets to the XP disk?

If you answer every question, I will (be able to) provide you with the solution.

:)

[Bushfiva]

These are not designed to run as hard disks, only storage,

I might call you on that.

[Saab Dastard]

These are not designed to run as hard disks, only storage,
I might call you on that.

If you don't, I will!

What on earth is a "storage" hard disk?

SD

[lomapaseo]

The BSOD could be because the mtoherboard does not like the hard disk you put in.

a: I have the same motherboard in my other XPS710 computers and the same harddrive as storage

Did you put in a 'storage' hard disk? These are not designed to run as hard disks, only storage, and operating systems will not work on them as they should (if at all).

a: Never heard of such a thing. What spec identifies it as storage? I had presumed that the XP instal disk would see it and ask me if I wanted to format it as a boot disk.

Why did you remove the Vista hard disk?

a: because everything else I own is XP and I hate to learn new icons and pathways

If you put the Vista hard disk back in, will it load up correctly?

a: Yes

What happens when you load up on the new 1TB disk without the XP disk in? Same screen?

a: The 1TB disk is recognized by Vista

When you say 'loads up a whole bunch of drivers', do you mean it reads the XP disk? or are you refering to the standard BIOS startup procedure before it actually gets to the XP disk?

a: It doesn't do anything without the XP disk and by virtue of all the file names being displayed on the bottom of the setup screen it must be reading them off the XP disk. Also I have more thanh one XP system disk and they all end up with the same blue screen.

If you answer every question, I will (be able to) provide you with the solution.

a: Great, can you drop by and take a look at it

If anybody wants a screen capture I can post a pic



Thanks to everybody for their consideration:ok:

[Tonic Please]

I was referring to external hard drives, or 'storage disks' (same term). Look here for further info: Can You Boot From External Hard Disk Drive: Running Windows From a Portable Hard Drive | Suite101.com (http://computer-drives-storage.suite101.com/article.cfm/can_you_boot_from_external_hard_disk_drive)

You see, my problem is, when you say you got a new 1TB 'drive', did you buy a "Hard Disk", or an "External Storage Drive"? If you got the latter, it won't work. If you got the former, fine.

However, my second problem is with your comment: Vista recognises it. What do you mean? The Vista disk is accepted to be installed in this new hard/storage drive? Or, you have Vista on one hard disk, you plug in the new hard disk/storage (yet to be established) and it detects it as an external storage device from within Vista? That's what it sounds like!

The fact you said about posting a screenshot further makes you feel you have got an external hard disk (not for operating systems) and are trying to make it a master drive (principal) whereas it is not designed for this and will absolutely give you the BSOD.

[lomapaseo]

I was referring to external hard drives, or 'storage disks' (same term). Look here for further info: Can You Boot From External Hard Disk Drive: Running Windows From a Portable Hard Drive | Suite101.com

You see, my problem is, when you say you got a new 1TB 'drive', did you buy a "Hard Disk", or an "External Storage Drive"? If you got the latter, it won't work. If you got the former, fine.

However, my second problem is with your comment: Vista recognises it. What do you mean? The Vista disk is accepted to be installed in this new hard/storage drive? Or, you have Vista on one hard disk, you plug in the new hard disk/storage (yet to be established) and it detects it as an external storage device from within Vista? That's what it sounds like!

The fact you said about posting a screenshot further makes you feel you have got an external hard disk (not for operating systems) and are trying to make it a master drive (principal) whereas it is not designed for this and will absolutely give you the BSOD.

Ah, I see the misunderstanding of my shortened printed words.

a: OK its an internal hardrive. No external drives are involved in this task

The computer came with a single boot drive loaded with Vista and boots OK. I simply used the Vista operating system to boot up and check to see that it recognizes my blank 1TB internal hardrive (it does). Then I simply unplug the Vista hard drive and plug into the new blank harddrive and and boot as far as I can with the XP system disk.

The screenshot was only a venacular and yes I would have to capture it with a digital camera and not with a an XP operating system running (because I can't load the &(^(& thing)

I do have a Vista restore CD but that is probably not going to help load an XP system in this case.

sorry for the continued confusion but hopefully we can work it out with these kinds of responses:ok:

[Bruce Wayne]

jumpers on the new hard drive ?

[green granite]

This has got to be a simple problem with a simple soultion doesn't it

Yep, how about a corrupt XP CD? Can you beg borrow or steal another one to try?

[Tonic Please]

Thanks for clarifications!

As posted above, check the cables. Always the first thing. You'd be amazed how many problems can be resolved with simple things before getting so technical.

What do I mean? Well, hard disks have 2 or 3 cables. The power cable (with 4 pins, usually - depends on model), the main connector cable, and sometimes a little flimsy thing (you might find one in the back of the CD-ROM drive). Usuaully, you only need the power cable and the main attachment cable.

Soemtimes, there is a little black peg in the back of the disk. This can be placed in different positions which means the disk will be read as a particualr kind of disk. Have a look. If so, the book (or even on a little ticket nearby) will tell you which position refers to MASTER (not slave). Check that out.

Second, go to the BIOS when the computer turns on WITHOUT the disc in the drive. You normally press delete or F12 (or F8). Find the option for Boot Order. You might also have the option of choosing this direction without going to the BIOS. The keyboard shortcut will be displayed at the very beginning. Make sure the CD-ROM is set for that, and not the hard disk - of course, have the hard disk connected.

Reset with the disc in, and allow it to boot from the disc automatically. The disk should start to load various drivers into the BIOS. Hopefully, you'll arrive at the screen to install XP. Select the appropriate Partition (or create one), and go for it. If it asks you to Format, select the full format which it says takes a little longer. If that works, you should be set...

Keep me updated! We'll take this step by step, getting more complicated each time until we conclude the HD is f*&^ed :)

[Saab Dastard]

A couple of things -

The Dell US website has this in the spec. section for the XPS 710:
The XPS 710 supports up to four hard drives4, each with up to 750GB space - a potential capacity of 2TB total. And with RAID 1 and RAID 0 options, you can choose your storage to meet your needs, whether it's for storing large quantities of files, backing up system information and files, or improving performance with data striping.

Dell will ship up to 3 hard drives.

* Up to 2TB5 Multiple Serial ATA Hard Drives (all 4 drives utilized)
* Up to 750GB3 Single Serial ATA Hard Drive

Are you sure that 1TB disks are supported?

Secondly, XP does not support SATA disks "out of the box" - you have to supply the SATA drivers at installation time, IIRC.

Vista does "natively" support SATA disks.

So I guess my question is - is it a SATA disk? And does the PC BIOS support it?

I would search for articles on installing XP on SATA disks - possibly without access to a floppy drive (if that's your scenario), but you can get around that by slipstreaming the drivers onto the XP install CD - might as well slipstream SP3 while you are at it!

SD

[lomapaseo]

RE: Check the cables

The internal drives are Sata and the cables are absolute swaps from Vista to the new hardrive. No such thing as a jumper block have I seen on a simple SATA swap. Hell they don't even provide jumper buttons on these.

Re: Going to BIOS and setting boot instructions.

No problem there. Just for backup I plugged in an external CD through the USB and watched the boot sequence. First it went to the hard disk and displayed a NO OS found. Then it lit up the external CD drive and provided a setup screen for Windows XP, Then it spent a minute displaying all the various drivers that it was loading then it too displayed the blue screen of death having not found a proper hardrive.

RE: Support for 1 TB harddrives

This would have been an easy fix and of course I would be humbled. So I went out and bought a brand new 500 GB WD SATA and presto it also ends in the blue screen of death during the XP load. *&&**%

I now have a couple of beers in me and I'm feeling better already, but I'll hate life in the morning

RE: Does PC Bios support SATA?

Yes. That's all it supports relative to the first 6 slots including two for CD/DVD

Re: Slipstreaming drivers etc.

No floppy

No idea how this is done

[Saab Dastard]

lomapaseo,

You seem to have missed the most important point of my post:

XP does not support SATA disks "out of the box" - you have to supply the SATA drivers at installation time.

Then it lit up the external CD drive and provided a setup screen for Windows XP, Then it spent a minute displaying all the various drivers that it was loading then it too displayed the blue screen of death having not found a proper hardrive.

Yes, because it hasn't found a SATA driver!!

I would again urge you to:

search for articles on installing XP on SATA disks

As you have confirmed that your PC doesn't have a floppy disk drive, you will need to investigate how you get the drivers onto the PC during installation.

Re: Slipstreaming drivers etc.
No idea how this is done

You will, soon enough!

Less beer, more thought! ;)

SD

[Bushfiva]

Sounds like your XP disk is pre-SP2?

This is an nVidia chipset motherboard, it appears, in which case the SATA controller driver may not be obvious: it's part of nVidia Mediashield.

Since you don't have a floppy, you can slipstream the drivers using a package such as nLite. Although, since you have the Dell reload XP disk, I'm surprised the driver isn't already there.

Just on the off-chance, in BIOS have you checked that it's set to auto/SATA and not RAID? Your DELL recovery disk might then automagically work.

[lomapaseo]

Sounds like your XP disk is pre-SP2?

a: Nope, it comes with SP2 straight from Dell
This is an nVidia chipset motherboard, it appears, in which case the SATA controller driver may not be obvious: it's part of nVidia Mediashield.

Since you don't have a floppy, you can slipstream the drivers using a package such as nLite. Although, since you have the Dell reload XP disk, I'm surprised the driver isn't already there.

Just on the off-chance, in BIOS have you checked that it's set to auto/SATA and not RAID? Your DELL recovery disk might then automagically work.

a: Yes I've cycled it a couple of times\



What's the chance that I can use the XP load option of F6 to add missing drivers and then get the computer to accept them via a memory stick?

[Bushfiva]

Somewhere between zero and very good: I don't know if the Dell BIOS supports "treat USB as a floppy drive". It's an easy test, though, once you get the driver. I'm still a little surprised that a Dell recovery disk from Dell for a Dell doesn't have the right drivers already on it. Since you say you have the same drive in other computers, it can't be that Dell historically uses Seagate and Samsung drives.

[Bruce Wayne]

sounds like it could be a driver issue

you could try windows 7 trial version...

Windows 7 Release Candidate (RC): Instructions for Free Download (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/get/download.aspx)

[lomapaseo]

you could try windows 7 trial version...


Not after reading the warning in the link please don't try this at home sic :)

[lomapaseo]

Time for an update.

Tried everything a home user would have available and couldn't get the Dell windows XP disk that came with the computer to recognize any hardrive. Forget about creating a cobbled up disk by streaming in SATA drivers as that is way beyond a home user's knowledge.

Tried downloading Nvidia drivers (including SATA) on another computer and putting them on a flashdrive. The BIOS recognizes the flashdrive but the XP installation had no way of recognizing how to load them. Finally downloaded a clean Dell XP SP2 installation off the internet using Limewire and presto XP was installed.:ok:

Leftover problem was that the new windows system didn't have internet (wrong or missing drivers on the Dell driver disk) Used another computer to download the proper drivers and solved that problem. At least you can install needed drivers once you get Windows running.

I don't know what is wrong with the original Dell installation disk but I suspect that Dell may package these with different drivers for different Dell models and the one I initially tried using didn't turn on my SATA drives for loading (in spite of the fact that they show up in the BIOS)

[Tonic Please]

You probably shouldn't advertise the fact you downloaded a crack XP copy :}

Naughty boy :=

:oh:

[Fly-by-Wife]

Forget about creating a cobbled up disk by streaming in SATA drivers as that is way beyond a home user's knowledge.

Just because it is beyond your knowledge doesn't mean it's beyond a "home user's" ability. Don't make such sweeping generalities based purely on your own inadequacies.

FBW

[lomapaseo]

Don't make such sweeping generalities based purely on your own inadequacies.


It's not a sweeping statement it's an expert opinion.

I'm an expert at being inadequate

[Earl]

I had this same problem a few years back with a new home build that did not recognize the hard drive.
What I did was download the driver that came with the motherboard on a flopy.
Had to put a flopy drive in the computer to do this.
You should be able to do the same with flash memory to install in the screen with the bios.

Been a while so anyone feel free to correct me.
On the start of installation of the operating system it will ask you to install sata drivers.
Once this is done your system will recognize the drive and things will progress normally.
This was with XP, not sure about vista as it may have this already in it.
I am not very computer smart but if I can do it anyone can.
But I will agree Vista should be left alone and trashed.
I bought WDTV from Best buy and the DVD converter has so many problems running Vista, on XP it runs perfect.
As many other items, when you call microsoft about this they blame the manufacturers for not keeping up with the new operating systems and you speak with someone from India with English that is almost impossible to understand.
Yet they think they can solve the problem, ha ha, which they dont have a clue, found most of my issues were solved by google search and people posting the way to correct it.

[lomapaseo]

On the start of installation of the operating system it will ask you to install sata drivers.
Once this is done your system will recognize the drive and things will progress normally.


Agree, but since I have no floppy and only a flash drive and a CD drive access, the question was how do you tell the system setup to access the flash drive rather than drive "A" that it expects?

From what I could discern the computer at that point is entirely dependant on the command structure running via the setup disk which points only to the "A" drive as an alternate.

inadequate

[C-N]

Just curious, is the Dell XP CD you received from ebay seller original?

How about just Dual Booting from Vista or XP. Just Enter vista normally and install your XP on your new Drive (1TB). Then throw vista harddisk after that.

What drive is your 'A'? It could be a flash drive also. Haven't heard of any newly shipped system at the moment that has still floppy drive.

[BOAC]

A caution on C-N's suggestion - check with MS Knowledge base/Google, but I believe you MUST install Win OS's in 'chronological order', ie XP before Vista for multi-boot systems? Certainly applied with 95/98/2000/XP

[Earl]

May be the long way around this problem, but will work.
Find a old computer and remove the floppy drive and cable, a computer repair shop may even give you this at no charge.
Attach the cable and power supply to the mother board.
After you install the driver and operating system you can remove the floppy drive.
This provided your mother board supports a floppy drive, not sure if the new ones still has the socket.

[lomapaseo]

Just curious, is the Dell XP CD you received from ebay seller original?

How about just Dual Booting from Vista or XP. Just Enter vista normally and install your XP on your new Drive (1TB). Then throw vista harddisk after that.


Yes the E-bay seller's disk was still in the sealed Dell packet with all the logos on the disk

Dual booting was considered but I didn't want to have a single disk and then a crash, mostly because if I had to return the machine it would no longer be in original condition.

Yes I did consider ripping an "A" drive out of another computer but the kids were stating to get wise to this and wouldn't let me near their computers.

Then again it's the principal of the issue. Neither MS nor Dell should have been the root cause of the problem.

inadequate