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320p
25th Mar 2009, 16:30
Hello
As per FCOM 3.03.90 P3
Gear callouts " The PNF selects the gear lever position and replies after checking the red lights on the landing gear indicator to confirm gear operation" .
As I understand it means that both for Gear up and down,the PNF after selecting the lever just has to see the RED UNLK lights and call out Gear UP(Down) and not wait for Green light/Red light OFF.
However quite a few pilots wait for the Green indicator/Red light to GO OFF before giving the call.
Which is the correct call?:confused:
Thanks

PENKO
25th Mar 2009, 16:37
The first one, exactly as you and Airbus say it!
(unless your airline says something else)

TO MEMO
25th Mar 2009, 17:05
Correct!

The call "gear up/down" confirms that PNF has executed the PF order, it does not confirm gear in position. If the gear fails to fully retract or extend, ECAM will let you know.

toby320
25th Mar 2009, 22:13
that's correct no need to wait until the green ligts come up, but what about the call that come together I mean brakes....

TO MEMO
26th Mar 2009, 00:09
you mean the one when lowering the gear?

"Gear down, autobrakes low/medium"

FlightDetent
26th Mar 2009, 10:53
I actually think that this very line in original AB SOP-Callouts is not written thorougly enough.

The QRH task sharing had it 1) PNF: announce pos. climb 2) PF: order G/U 3) PNF: select G/U 4) PF: announce FMA (nav) 4) PNF: announce G/U.

The NAV comes after a slight delay on FMA, so if you wait for G/U call as per Task Sharing, you, after a split second more, see only red light (32S).

My company had changed the task sharing so that it is 3) PNF: select gear up, announce G/U. 4) announce FMA. This very well fits in the logic of explanatory sentence "checking the red lights" as they illuminate immediately when the lever is moved. What I do not follow is why change Task Sharing to fit callouts and not the other way around?

Typical full loop of inter-action is:
(a) F: issue an order - (b) N: confirm order received
(c) N: select as commanded - (d) N: check correct lever moved to correct position
(e) P: crosscheck correct selection made
(f) N: observe action started / completed - (g) P: verify

If every item had been vocalised too much talking woud create a lot of distractions, so we carefully select only some steps to verbalise with regard to aircraft technology. She will let you know. Pristine example is the flap selection for approach. Only (a) and (d) are verbalised. Delay in between is so short that (b) is included, (c) is granted once (d) had happened. No need for (e)(f)(g) thanks to ECAM logic. Full loop done with small talking aided by aircraft design.

To follow Airbus SOP Cockpit design Philosophy 1.01 I would choose (a) and (f) for Gear-Up loop (No commanded position indication quite unlike flaps, no "Gear not up" ecam).

TO MEMO suggests the call is "that PNF has executed the PF order", i.e (c) or (d) in the loop above. The book says "confirm gear operation" which is (f). The only way do so is to see green light go out - this indicates release from downlocks (FCOM1). The reds illuminated only represent disagreement between lever position and gear status.

My opinion is that the explanatory wording in SOP Callouts should ideally read: " The PNF selects the gear lever position (c) and replies after checking the red lights illuminated only on the landing gear indicator (d) and (f) to confirm gear operation..

Company moved G/U call before FMA announcment i.e. immediately once lever is moved. So I do (a) and (d) now. Nobody does (f), loop left incoplete. The condition of gear being in operation prescribed by SOP text is not satisfied before the aural. So what, nothing is wrong with K.I.S.S.

FD (the un-real)


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